Chopper_Stew
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Not trying to rile anyone, just curious.
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Is 35 Hours Solo Realistic
- Thread starter Chopper_Stew
- Start date
What the new guys need isn't so much more flight time (eventhough more wouldn't hurt) as much as they need more operational training so that customers like oil companies would no longer have an excuse to request minimum hours from pilots. 😀
Of course, more flight time would be great if it wasn't so darn expensive!!!!
Of course, more flight time would be great if it wasn't so darn expensive!!!!
Chopper_Stew
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I agree with you there Jetbox. Although, the minimum time requirment for a flight test is 75. (So if you are really good you could get about 23 hours of op flying)
After having been in this training industry for some time, I have yet to see anybody capable of performing a flight test at 75% of total time required. I think the total time should be higher (like the 150 in the states) but I am also in the opinion that the solo requirement is rediculus, in asking for 35 hours. I think this is a waste of monies! And the student would benefit more from the operational aspect, rather than flying circuits solo for maaannyy hours.
Hey guys,
My $0.02. 😉
I would like to see the written tests a lot more on topic with what a 100 hour pilot needs to know. And the idea that knowing 60% of the information is satisfactory isn't nearly challenging enough. Subjects like GPS navigation should be taught and no not how many damn satellites do we need etc.. How about converting d.m.s to d.m.m. Touch on the subject of datums. Review how to use the grid systems (d7J 94I12) your clients are gonna hand you on your first ever flight. How to program and use FM radios. The difference between simplex and duplex. What a guard channel is. How to repair and problem solve an aircraft refueling pump. I've spent more time talking to lower time pilots out with a client having difficulty on those subjects than on met or air law.
The more hours that new pilots log training before they get licensed the better. I would like to see the number of hours required move up to around 150 hours. More longline training and practice. More true confined areas in brushy areas teaching new pilots how to not have tail rotor strikes. It may also reduce the number of 100 hour pilots out there with no hope of ever getting a flying job.
It's unfortunate that the schools in Canada aren't as up front with their students as they should be. There are not enough jobs to go around.
Regards,
pl
My $0.02. 😉
I would like to see the written tests a lot more on topic with what a 100 hour pilot needs to know. And the idea that knowing 60% of the information is satisfactory isn't nearly challenging enough. Subjects like GPS navigation should be taught and no not how many damn satellites do we need etc.. How about converting d.m.s to d.m.m. Touch on the subject of datums. Review how to use the grid systems (d7J 94I12) your clients are gonna hand you on your first ever flight. How to program and use FM radios. The difference between simplex and duplex. What a guard channel is. How to repair and problem solve an aircraft refueling pump. I've spent more time talking to lower time pilots out with a client having difficulty on those subjects than on met or air law.
The more hours that new pilots log training before they get licensed the better. I would like to see the number of hours required move up to around 150 hours. More longline training and practice. More true confined areas in brushy areas teaching new pilots how to not have tail rotor strikes. It may also reduce the number of 100 hour pilots out there with no hope of ever getting a flying job.
It's unfortunate that the schools in Canada aren't as up front with their students as they should be. There are not enough jobs to go around.
Regards,
pl
although i find 35 hours a little high, it's not totally out of line.......
our students get to the level that we send them solo to ACTUAL working pads at repeater sites, confined areas in the bush ect. it is a HUGE boost of confidence!!
also, everybody that comes through the door checking out flight training is told that there are NO guarantees. it amazes me that some potential students tell me of other schools that actually tell them otherwise.....
our students get to the level that we send them solo to ACTUAL working pads at repeater sites, confined areas in the bush ect. it is a HUGE boost of confidence!!
also, everybody that comes through the door checking out flight training is told that there are NO guarantees. it amazes me that some potential students tell me of other schools that actually tell them otherwise.....
I agree with Pitchlink on one subject, the written test needs to be overhauled with better subject matter, I disagree with the opinion that just by raising the minimum hour requirements and making student better at ops flying will reduce the number of pilots looking for work, if the jobs aren't there they aren't there no matter how good a low time pilot you are. Just by better training the job market won't suddenly improve!
As far as flight test standards go, one person who posts on this board passed his flight test with 75% of his total time, it's rare but not unusual so it can be done. This left him more 'operational' flying time. There is also a fair amount of 'interpretation' of the flight test standards from region to region. Shouldn't be but is.
The only reason the flight time should be raised to 150 if either the instructor takes a long time to teach each flight lesson (maybe by sitting on the tarmac, blades turning, burning time talking) or the student is slow or no good (and therefore should be told as much).
The 35 hours of solo time has been and will be a contentious subject, with some (not much) movement at the top of the TC training division may come some changes but, by the new draft of the Flight Training Standards, don't expect much. To believe that the requirements are rediculous and a waste of money shows that the instructor has no concept of what those hours are to be used for.
The funny thing is that with all the talk nothing really changes, pilots will still get training at one of the multitude of flight schools around the country to all various levels and all will look for that first job. Some will succeed, some will fail, that is life. If you are a pilot, enjoy what you do, if you are an instructor, do the best for your students, noone can ask any more.
For those who have read this far, remember this is only one opinion and really doesn't count for much.
Thanks
As far as flight test standards go, one person who posts on this board passed his flight test with 75% of his total time, it's rare but not unusual so it can be done. This left him more 'operational' flying time. There is also a fair amount of 'interpretation' of the flight test standards from region to region. Shouldn't be but is.
The only reason the flight time should be raised to 150 if either the instructor takes a long time to teach each flight lesson (maybe by sitting on the tarmac, blades turning, burning time talking) or the student is slow or no good (and therefore should be told as much).
The 35 hours of solo time has been and will be a contentious subject, with some (not much) movement at the top of the TC training division may come some changes but, by the new draft of the Flight Training Standards, don't expect much. To believe that the requirements are rediculous and a waste of money shows that the instructor has no concept of what those hours are to be used for.
The funny thing is that with all the talk nothing really changes, pilots will still get training at one of the multitude of flight schools around the country to all various levels and all will look for that first job. Some will succeed, some will fail, that is life. If you are a pilot, enjoy what you do, if you are an instructor, do the best for your students, noone can ask any more.
For those who have read this far, remember this is only one opinion and really doesn't count for much.
Thanks
Fully Articulated
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Here's an hours question for ya'll. In the Sea King world, we make aircraft captains out of guys with 500 hours total time. (About 85-B206, 300-S61, and some fixed wing).
Why does it take a bajillion hours to get the same quals in 'industry'? i.e. Multi-Engine, Heavy, IFR, offshore? The SK is all of that and more.
Why does it take a bajillion hours to get the same quals in 'industry'? i.e. Multi-Engine, Heavy, IFR, offshore? The SK is all of that and more.
Hey Genus,
When I said, "It may also reduce the number of 100 hour pilots out there with no hope of ever getting a flying job." I meant with fewer people having the finances to pay for the increased cost maybe we would have a reduction in newly licensed pilots.
Regards,
pl
When I said, "It may also reduce the number of 100 hour pilots out there with no hope of ever getting a flying job." I meant with fewer people having the finances to pay for the increased cost maybe we would have a reduction in newly licensed pilots.
Regards,
pl
407 Driver
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Fully Articulated, can you answer a couple of questions re: why the CAF pilot can be a Captain and a civie pilot can't at 500 hours?
1) Customer and Insurance requirements. Who is your customer and can your customer dictate experience requirements? Who is your insurer?
2) How much training $$$ have gone into that 500 hr captain? How many training hours vs Operational hours have gone into that 500 hr Capt?
How much of this has the Captain paid with student loans, collecting bottles and selling Mac Burgers?
3) Who's your competition, and do they undercut your rates, offer more experienced crews, fly newer aircraft and steal your customers?
I have an idea your question Re: 500hr CAF Captains isn't really thrown out on a level playing field, is it?
1) Customer and Insurance requirements. Who is your customer and can your customer dictate experience requirements? Who is your insurer?
2) How much training $$$ have gone into that 500 hr captain? How many training hours vs Operational hours have gone into that 500 hr Capt?
How much of this has the Captain paid with student loans, collecting bottles and selling Mac Burgers?
3) Who's your competition, and do they undercut your rates, offer more experienced crews, fly newer aircraft and steal your customers?
I have an idea your question Re: 500hr CAF Captains isn't really thrown out on a level playing field, is it?
Albert Ross
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I'm trying to get some sense out of insurance people as we speak about an add-on course that would fill in the gaps for 100-hour pilots and make them the equivalent in knowledge at least as 500 hour ones - suggestions for content would be welcome!
Phil
Phil
Why can't the companies run better re-current/indoc training ??
PL you say that the flightschool should teach students about FM radios. So they will need to buy every type of FM and teach each student how to operate each. That's something that each operator should be doing, during re-current. The student has a lot to learn in a very short period of time.
I agree with this, as it's part of basic navigation and the students should understand the basic datums, and how to deal with UTM.
If the course was longer, then students could be taught how to take care of ops gear. Mind you, an operator could also do this during re-current training. I would prefer that, since there are numerous experienced pilots out there who seemingly haven't the foggiest notion how to care for ops gear.
Nothing beats properly supervised training by a good instructor. The earlier they learn good habits, the better, and the safer they are likely to be. There should also be a form of supervised "apprenticeship". So those good habits are reinforced, and the bad habits aren't allowed to take hold.
Cheers
PL you say that the flightschool should teach students about FM radios. So they will need to buy every type of FM and teach each student how to operate each. That's something that each operator should be doing, during re-current. The student has a lot to learn in a very short period of time.
Touch on the subject of datums. Review how to use the grid systems (d7J 94I12) your clients are gonna hand you on your first ever flight
I agree with this, as it's part of basic navigation and the students should understand the basic datums, and how to deal with UTM.
How to repair and problem solve an aircraft refueling pump.
If the course was longer, then students could be taught how to take care of ops gear. Mind you, an operator could also do this during re-current training. I would prefer that, since there are numerous experienced pilots out there who seemingly haven't the foggiest notion how to care for ops gear.
The more hours that new pilots log training before they get licensed the better. I would like to see the number of hours required move up to around 150 hours. More longline training and practice. More true confined areas in brushy areas teaching new pilots how to not have tail rotor strikes.
Nothing beats properly supervised training by a good instructor. The earlier they learn good habits, the better, and the safer they are likely to be. There should also be a form of supervised "apprenticeship". So those good habits are reinforced, and the bad habits aren't allowed to take hold.
Cheers
donnybrook
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Nothing personal, but I hate the idea of restricting licences by making it financially prohibitive to get one. Only the rich can afford a licence? I'd rather hire someone who is absolutely committed to being a pilot and will work for their first break, vice someone who has bought their first break. Not that people with money aren't hard workers, I just think that excluding people based on their income is unsatisfactory.
