M&R LBO2 Vote Predictions

[Tex-Mech]

Getting a real good feeling on an overwhelming no here at AFW. Alot of self-admitting Yes voters are swinging to a hard NO with this vote. Hearing the same at DFW. Looking at the ad, the vote no video hits, the LBO2 website hits, the press from the ad, and the rumored radio and TV coming this week, I predict the offer fails by 61%.

What are your thoughts?

 

[TWU informer]

Voted down, abbrogation, company imposes this T/A and we begin negotiations from there.

 

[Ken MacTiernan]

I believe the vote no percentage will be 68%. A friend said he was voting yes because if this fails his medical will be too much for him to pay. After talking with him I believe he sees where he calculated wrong.

The key to voting this t/a down... again... is educating people about what they are voting for or against. The twu will NOT tell you the truth about what damage will be done to not only us at AA but what a yes vote will do for the industry. The company will NOT tell you the truth and even if they did they would say "Well, we lied when we said that.".

I hope there is a large box of Kleenex handy for hewitt and gang when this vote is counted because they are going to look like fools... again!

VOTE NO!

 

[TWU informer]

This fight will continue. If AA were to impose this T/A after abbrogation, and negotiations continue, then AA can keep some sense of Labor Peace, begin reducing head count, and then work on getting an agreement that can be ratified will be much easier.

Once those that are gone are no longer being used to get voting done in a certain driection, AA will have to negotiate with those of us that are left. And those are the employees that AA needs on their side to succeed.

The hard liners will be happy that this crap contract is no longer a 6 year deal. Those that want to leave can go. The heads that Local 514 are trying protect will be on the payroll. And AA starts implenting cost saving changes.

That is a simple solution and everybody wins something with future negotiations to continue.
Why is that so difficult?

AA Management has an oppurtunity here, I am just not convinced they are smart enough to see it?

 

[High Speed Steel]

Voted down, abbrogation, company imposes this T/A and we begin negotiations from there.

Believing in your own bullshett again Informer?

 

[TWU informer]

Believing in your own bullshett again Informer?

My predictions are just as valid as yours.

AA will not impose 3/22 and start a war, that I do have faith in them about.

My glass is half full and there is hope and everyone wins.
Your glass is always about fear and we the workers losing again.

But I am not suprised that would be your choice. You would give them even more than they are asking because of your fear and inability to reason both sided have needs.

Don't make fun of me. Show me some proof that what I predict cannot and will not happen.
You know nothing, except fear and smear.

 

[High Speed Steel]

My predictions are just as valid as yours.

AA will not impose 3/22 and start a war, that I do have in faith in them about.

My glass is half full and there is hope and everyone wins.
Your glass in about fear and we lose.

But I am not suprised that would be your choice.

Really....hmmmm?

 

[TWU informer]

Really....hmmmm?

They could and they might, but they will forever regret that move.

 

[Frank Szabo]

They could and they might, but they will forever regret that move.

Perhaps.

Personally, I believe this is the major difference between bean counters and businessmen. Horton (a beancounter/cpa) wants the judge to abrogate - a businessman would realize that, while his charts and graphs temporarily look good, he'd be setting the stage for his business to implode.

Whatever is left won't be worth fighting aboutr - all would be doing themselves a greater service to vote with their feet, taking their skills to an new field, getting completely clear of aerospace. Let aero become the Third World enterprise it deserves to be. When enough executives on aircraft become lawn darts, somebody might wake up but I wouldn't hold my breath as our lawmakers are the best money can buy.

Besides - after said implosion, one has to ponder if anyone in Centrepork would understand why it happened.

 

[Buck]

Centrepork often fails to understand anything.

 

[767 mechanic]

How short is the memory of the employees? Do you remember the bonuses that they took and did not care what you or I thought. Here we are in the same situation 9 years later and one thing you can count on is that they are going to take bonuses again. The fact that they are taking your pension should be enough. The pension was worth more than the money that they were asking for. So why are they asking for everythingelse? Because they can and they are a bunch of arrogant bastards that are lieing to members with the help of the twboo. Just ask yourselves how many times the company has been caught lieing in court and when this is voted down how many more lies do you think will be revealed. Take a trip down memory lane and count how many complete lies or half truths the company and the twboo have told us as members or to the press so that they can sway not only your opinion,but the publics opinion also. All of this so they can paint us as greedy union people. How ironic is it that they say we are greedy when they are the ones getting bonuses. The people at the top like Horton,Brundage and the others are employees of amr just like you and I so why should you allow them to take money out of your pocket and put it in there pockets. Is there family more important than yours?

VOTE NO
[sub][sup] [/sup][/sub]

 

[dfw gen]

Centerpork knows the cost of everything and the value of nothing*
*borrowed quote

Vote no!

 

[AA89]

The last LBO failed and the main difference I see is the money so for some guys maybe that will be enough to change from a no to a yes.

The problem with that logic is that the line guys will still be paid less than our peers and the overhaul guys that think they will be around to see the money have no language guaranteeing that.

Guys that have faith in either the company or the union to do anything either moral or good for their future should stop and look at our history as you mentioned.

I think if all 3 unions still voting vote their LBOs down, we are in great shape. The problem with that is that it appears that maintenance is taking a bigger screwing than the other 2 unions so thats not a given.

If we are alone with rejection then we will have to be stronger than ever because it's going to be ugly.

I'm a definite NO vote

 

[Bob Owens]

The last LBO failed and the main difference I see is the money so for some guys maybe that will be enough to change from a no to a yes.

The problem with that logic is that the line guys will still be paid less than our peers and the overhaul guys that think they will be around to see the money have no language guaranteeing that.

Guys that have faith in either the company or the union to do anything either moral or good for their future should stop and look at our history as you mentioned.

I think if all 3 unions still voting vote their LBOs down, we are in great shape. The problem with that is that it appears that maintenance is taking a bigger screwing than the other 2 unions so thats not a given.

If we are alone with rejection then we will have to be stronger than ever because it's going to be ugly.

I'm a definite NO vote

To me the only reason why anyone would vote YES is because they allowed FEAR to rule over common sense. You dont say yes to eliminate system protection in its entirety if you trying to save jobs, it just does not make sense.


The choice here is do we allow fear to have us jump off a cliff like the American Bison, or do we stand shoulder to shoulder and be ready to fight like the African Buffalo?

 

[Buster CRC]

http://www.tulsaworld.com/business/article.aspx?subjectid=45&articleid=20120728_45_E1_Anewsp307329

I can't believe that John Hewitt would have the nerve to say the ad was a lie. His mind must be clouded by the thought of an international job. He says 5 of the 8 bullet points are "misleading" or "outright lies." Which ones are the lies? Because I've read the ad and the proposal and I see no lies.