Pilots to picket over pension

USA320Pilot

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May 18, 2003
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Pilots to picket over pension

PITTSBURGH (Tribune-Review) - The leadership of US Airways' pilots union has voted to pursue informational picketing -- which could begin in a few weeks -- mainly in response to management's handling of the pilots' pension plans.

This management team is not being honest with us, said Air Line Pilots Association spokesman Roy Freundlich on Thursday. Management has contractual obligations, and they seem to be trying to needle and pick at our contract.

The US Airways Master Executive Council for the pilots union resolved to pursue all legal and representational avenues, including informational picketing. That is when off-duty pilots parade signs at airports and other permitted spots. The union currently is seeking such permits.

The union claims US Airways violated an agreement early this year wherein pilots acceded to having their defined-benefit pension terminated, if the company supported federal legislation to restore the pension with a new funding scheme. While still in bankruptcy, US Airways substituted that pension with a more affordable, defined-contribution plan.

Draft legislation would lower US Airway's annual funding obligation to $310 million, which is below the $325 million the carrier said is the maximum it could afford, Freundlich said. Such a bill has not yet been introduced in Congress.

But that $310 million assumes US Airways terminates its flight attendant and mechanic pensions, Chris Chiames, senior vice president of corporate affairs, said yesterday. The pilot portion of that annual liability is $124 million.

We don't believe the Association of Flight Attendants and the International Association of Machinists would embrace our terminating their pensions in order to achieve some other savings, Chiames said.

At the end of the day, if we're not comfortable with the numbers -- since we're writing the check -- we have to be confident that the numbers work, he said.

Chiames added that US Airways' reorganization plan had assured key creditors -- including aircraft financier General Electric -- that the airline had settled the pilot-pension dispute by substituting the defined-benefit plan with the more affordable defined-contribution plan.

Union leadership noted the pilots have lost 1,827 jobs and, in the last 10 months, conceded benefits and wages worth more than $3 billion over the next seven years. That is the term of their contract and of the $1 billion loan guaranty from the Air Transportation Stabilization Board.

Given our obligation to repay a $1 billion loan that US taxpayers have guaranteed to help save this company, we are more than a little disappointed that our pilot union leadership has deemed it useful to undermine the accomplishments and sacrifices of so many hard-working employees because complex and difficult decisions had to be made, US Airways said in a prepared statement.
 
Do you really think the traveling public cares one way or the other? All they care about is the price of the ticket and is the flight on schedule. We could all work for free and be on food stamps and the public would not blink an eye. So what is this informational picketing going to? Do you think DAVE cares? He has proven he doesn`t.
 
A agree AIRMAIL. As I've said on numerous posts "the public demands WalMart". They couldn't give a rats a** about anything else. In Amerika, if someone makes a dollar more than others he's a crook, if he makes a dollar less then he's a bum. All of the picketing in the world won't change that, I still have control over the brakes and thrust levers though. I use the training departments motto, "Fly like you train and train like you fly".
 
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On 5/24/2003 9:47:58 AM LavMan wrote:


What happened to Dave''s number one fan?

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The MEC is pretending to be upset at Dave for awhile... it helps the poll numbers.
 
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On 5/24/2003 11:11:10 AM AIRMAIL wrote:
Do you really think the traveling public cares one way or the other? All they care about is the price of the ticket and is the flight on schedule. We could all work for free and be on food stamps and the public would not blink an eye. So what is this informational picketing going to? Do you think DAVE cares? He has proven he doesn`t.
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Did you ever think that the flying public might care a little bit more if airline employees and unions presented your case / explained your situation in a better manner? All the flying public generally hears is the "I want" - as in: I want higher wages and better benefits, I want to work less hours, I want to keep my workrules, I want a bigger pension, etc, etc, etc.

The traveling public does not and can''t sympathize with MOST airline employees. If it is really so bad in your present job, then look for a new one / get a new one - unless ofcourse there are no better jobs available then your current airline job.

Yes the traveling public cares about price, you would too if you had to pay out of your own pocket for travel to a meeting or a job interview, or to see family or vacation.

More importantly, what will the information picket accomplish? I doubt it will attract more business to your airline so that you might be able to get that wage/benefit/pension increase.
 
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On 5/24/2003 4:04:34 PM FrugalFlyer wrote:

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On 5/24/2003 11:11:10 AM AIRMAIL wrote:
Do you really think the traveling public cares one way or the other? All they care about is the price of the ticket and is the flight on schedule. We could all work for free and be on food stamps and the public would not blink an eye. So what is this informational picketing going to? Do you think DAVE cares? He has proven he doesn`t.
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Did you ever think that the flying public might care a little bit more if airline employees and unions presented your case / explained your situation in a better manner? All the flying public generally hears is the "I want" - as in: I want higher wages and better benefits, I want to work less hours, I want to keep my workrules, I want a bigger pension, etc, etc, etc.

The traveling public does not and can''t sympathize with MOST airline employees. If it is really so bad in your present job, then look for a new one / get a new one - unless ofcourse there are no better jobs available then your current airline job.

Yes the traveling public cares about price, you would too if you had to pay out of your own pocket for travel to a meeting or a job interview, or to see family or vacation.

More importantly, what will the information picket accomplish? I doubt it will attract more business to your airline so that you might be able to get that wage/benefit/pension increase.

Perhaps the company should publish the average pilot''s wage when the picketing begins. Let the traveling public determine how much sympathy is warranted. Savey
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On 5/24/2003 4:04:34 PM FrugalFlyer wrote

More importantly, what will the information picket accomplish? I doubt it will attract more business to your airline so that you might be able to get that wage/benefit/pension increase.


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It will however show the public what a bunch of crooks we are working for. The law makers of Pennsylvania already found out the hard way. Why can''t we get Siegel to step down for screwing us again and again and again like AA did to Carty? It may not slove anything, but morale will surely skyrocket!!!
 
US Airways spokesman David Castelveter said the airline was disappointed its pilots found the vote useful.

"This management team has taken an airline that was left for dead, and implemented a restructuring plan that has preserved more than 30,000 jobs and given it a chance for success," Castelveter said.

The airline was dissapointed,what about labor? Management
will begin to learn what it means to push on a rope.As one
of my favorite actors Popeye said,"that''s all I kin stan
cause I cants stans ne more..."
 
As one of your flying public. I already know what a pilot makes and I am personally sick of all the crap that has come out of the airlines in the last few years. Your management and your greed is killing the airline industry. Let's face it. The reason that Southwest and JetBlue are making it is because they have priced themselves into business not out of it.

There was a time not so long ago when it was fun to fly. Both for work and play. Now it is nothing more than a big hassle. The TSA and the airlines are to blame. And the flying public truely doesn't give a rats ### about your problems. I used to be a big supporter of USAirways. But now that has changed. I could care less if U was around anymore.

So go ahead pilots, hand me some information about your woes and troubles and watch my reaction when I don't give a damn. How is it that someone that makes a lot of money doesn't know how to save and invest it properly? Ask Dave how much he's socked away since he took over the helm? Bet he won't be crying when he's left U for greener pastures.
 
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On 5/25/2003 10:21:21 AM trvlr64 wrote:


As one of your flying public. I already know what a pilot makes and I am personally sick of all the crap that has come out of the airlines in the last few years. Your management and your greed is killing the airline industry. Let's face it. The reason that Southwest and JetBlue are making it is because they have priced themselves into business not out of it.

There was a time not so long ago when it was fun to fly. Both for work and play. Now it is nothing more than a big hassle. The TSA and the airlines are to blame. And the flying public truely doesn't give a rats ### about your problems. I used to be a big supporter of USAirways. But now that has changed. I could care less if U was around anymore.

So go ahead pilots, hand me some information about your woes and troubles and watch my reaction when I don't give a damn. How is it that someone that makes a lot of money doesn't know how to save and invest it properly? Ask Dave how much he's socked away since he took over the helm? Bet he won't be crying when he's left U for greener pastures.



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I think you're a fool. Do you want professionals flying your planes, or minimum wage high school dropouts? SW and JetBlue both pay their pilots acceptible wages when you factor in the profit sharing and benefits. There is a cost of doing business, and Dave and crew are soon gonna find out what that is. I think travelers would be very unhappy if the aviation industry were to regress to accident rates of the past, when flying was considered a good way to travel if you didn't mind gambling with your life. Most of US Airways' (and others for that matter) are college graduates, who chose aviation as a career because of the pay and benefits, not inspite of them. I wouldn't recommend anyone that can work somewhere else even look at this career field, unless they are seriously into self-abuse. By the way, a 15 year pilot at US makes about what a pilot with 15 years in the military makes, and has a lot worse pension and benefits at this point. And they're not continuously being threatened with MORE wage cuts and fleet reductions. In fact, the Gov't pays them a bonus to stay in!
 
to Quote OLDIE......I think you''re a fool. Do you want professionals flying your planes, or minimum wage high school dropouts?


THANKS FOR THE COMPLIMENT!! And to do you really think the airlines would hire a high school dropout? That is the dumbest comparison. And as for your comment about what a 15 year pilot makes, I have a neighbor that works for an airline and he spends only 1 week a month flying and collecting a hell of a paycheck for doing very little work. Hard work for being overpaid if you ask me.
 
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So go ahead pilots, hand me some information about your woes and troubles and watch my reaction when I don't give a damn.  How is it that someone that makes a lot of money doesn't know how to save and invest it properly?  Ask Dave how much he's socked away since he took over the helm?  Bet he won't be crying when he's left U for greener pastures.



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trvl,
   You take a 25% pay cut at your job and as they cut corners, you need to pick up the rest of the slack. 
  
   You are that typical passenger that we would rather spit on than to serve.​
 

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