TED

[Just Plane Crazy]

Looking at the announcement's that TED is adding more routes as of Apr/07 and May/24 I will have to say that they are the fastest growing airline.

Las Vegas is going to be the first TED only city in the network (exception of LAS-PSP and LAS-FAT operated by UAX).

I know a lot of PAX that are not going to be happy with this move. They will have to pay the same Y price as they did with the main line and no more F Class.

I am predicting that TED and UAX will take over within a year or so all the domestic UA network and let the mainline operate all the international routes and the routes between the Hub's (LAX-DEN, LAX-IAD, LAX-ORD, SFO-DEN, SFO-ORD, SFO-IAD, ORD-DEN, ORD-IAD and DEN-IAD).

This might be the delay with all the loans etc, since UA will have a leaner network and lower cost after the restructuring.

 

[coolflyingfool]

When UA announces that they are going to reconfigure the 757s in all coach with 205 seats and call it TED II or TED Senior, then we know that all domestic service will be TED. What will a 747 hold in an all coach configuration?

 

[iflyjetz]

What will a 747 hold in an all coach configuration?

Current configuration at UAL is 14/73/260=347.
According to Boeing's website, it'll hold 524 in a 2 class configuration. They list 1 class as N/A (probably because if you threw on any more bodies, it couldn't meet evacuation timing.

MOOOOO!

 

[FWAAA]

I know a lot of PAX that are not going to be happy with this move. They will have to pay the same Y price as they did with the main line and no more F Class.

This might be the delay with all the loans etc, since UA will have a leaner network and lower cost after the restructuring.

Uhh, pax don't HAVE to do anything, let alone settle for crappy Y at the same price they used to pay for a real UAL mainline flight (with the possibility of an upgrade to F). Heaven help UAL and its employees if somebody at WHQ thinks any pax HAVE to fly UAL. B)

Ted makes for a leaner network and lower costs?? Stop it - you're killing me!!!

 

[Fly]

I believe EVERYTHING is going to go the route of TED. And not just at United, but across the board. The business traveler has spoken, and price is king. Of course there will be defectors, but as we have all seen, the companies buying the ticket are serious that price is the major factor in purchase. If TED were to pick up all domestic United flying except hub to hub, and United remains flying the International routes, you will still find the brand loyalty because of the superior routing that United is lucky enough to have. They are flocking to JetBlue, Southwest, et al., with NO chance of upgrade and NO miles to use for their international upgrades, this would give them the rewards they want with the cost structure that their companies want. I've pulled up numerous TED routes and they've been consistently competitive. If they can remain that way AND start making a profit, I believe this is the wave of UAL future. United the international carrier, and TED the domestic carrier.

 

[Just Plane Crazy]

When UA announces that they are going to reconfigure the 757s in all coach with 205 seats and call it TED II or TED Senior, then we know that all domestic service will be TED. What will a 747 hold in an all coach configuration?

B747-400 is rated for a max of 568 PAX. Look at Japan, they used to fly B747 in all PAX on domestic routes.

I don't think that UA will keep the B757. TED will fly an all Airbus Fleet. And don't forgett TED has "Econmy Plus"!

A318 = rated for a max of 107 PAX
A319 = rated for a max of 124 PAX
A320 = rated for a max of 150 PAX
A321 = rated for a max of 185 PAX

With this combination they only need one type of cockpit crew.

UA's B737 fleet is aging and upgrading the aircrafts and getting them through the nex C or D check is not oing to be an option that is financially responsible.

LAS has currently B757 aircrafts service. As of May there is no other service than A320 and J31. Better have a 99% laod factor (since there are going to less seats avalaible) which looks better on paper and for the banks.

 

[orwell]

I think TED SHOULD take over at least most of the domestic network. In my opinion, that is the only way an airline-within-an-airline idea could work. The idea being: use TED to lower fares in markets BEFORE the commodity carriers leap into them. B6, WN and the like won't enter markets where they will actually have to compete to win passengers. If TED is used proactively, rather than as a defensive weapon, I think it could work - meaning it should be used across the domestic network. If instead it's only used defensively, AFTER WN etc. get credit for entering a market and forcing fares down, I'm not so sure.

This doesn't have to happen overnight, but on a longer term, strategic basis. Obviously it would be used to complement/feed the routes that still support "legacy" carrier service - ie transcons (not for long) and intl (for a little while still.)

 

[Busdrvr]

"LAS has currently B757 aircrafts service. As of May there is no other service than A320 and J31. Better have a 99% laod factor (since there are going to less seats avalaible) which looks better on paper and for the banks."

Actually, ALL TED MARKETS served from DEN have a NET INCREASE in daily seats with the implementation of TED, and yes, the loads ARE ludicrously high.

"The idea being: use TED to lower fares in markets BEFORE the commodity carriers leap into them."

I agree with this point, however, I've read more than one talking head lambast that strategy. UAL is putting product where it will work. There is talk that UAL will be replacing 767-200 three class transcon service with 757 THREE CLASS service. The seat total would be less than a Guppy. WHY? They have a large corporate client who WANTS it, and is willing to PAY for the premium product. Give people what they want. The model T strategy doesn't work anymore (you can have any color you want as long as it's black....)

 

[Eagle]

They said from the beginning that it would have 40 planes by the end of 2004. Those planes have to fly somewhere and it's not going to be over the pond. I did think it was going to do more point-to-point and not just from the hubs. Probably after they get something started from all hubs. However it is following the statements that it would fly to the primarily leasure market. BTW, I also thought but not sure they stated it would be limited to 10% of UA flying therefor not taking over all domestic.

 

[GuppyPup]

UAL applied for DEN-PVR using TED product

http://dmses.dot.gov/docimages/pdf89/275767_web.pdf

Ole'!

 

[Cosmo]

United also applied to DOT for nonstop ORD-Cozumel, Mexico (CZM) route authority, initially to be operated three times per week by mainline but IMHO likely to become a Ted operation at some point in the future. You can read United's DOT filing for this authority here.

 

[crossfeed]

Always one to ask a stupid question, but is Ted making a profit at a 90% load factor?

 

[mweiss]

If that's one of your more stupid questions, then you must truly be brilliant.

(Lest anyone accuse me of sarcasm, I mean that sincerely.)

 

[Just Plane Crazy]

It would be interesting to see the cost structure. If Ted has the same cost like UA to operate these routes, how are they going to be profitable.

If Ted pays UA for the services and receives a special discount, then I could imagine that they could make some kind of a profit.

 

[firstamendment]

When UA announces that they are going to reconfigure the 757s in all coach with 205 seats and call it TED II or TED Senior, then we know that all domestic service will be TED. What will a 747 hold in an all coach configuration?

BigBadTED or FatA**TED