UA transfers its two DAL (Love Field) gates to Southwest; Is DL out?

[Kev3188]

CRJ-200's

 

[robbedagain]

thanks kev   given that DFW is near by  does DL fill up the planes to the max or no?

 

[topDawg]

before the 717 came into DL fleet  what aircraft did they use?

CR2s but remember that before October if you didn't fly into a state approved for large aircraft you could only fly aircraft with 51 seats or less. As soon as Delta could go larger they did with a mix of CR9s and 717s.
 

That is correct. Which is where all the fuss came from the illegal sale of tickets to destinations never started. I have asked numerous times about these issues, and to this day still not get an answer to what has happened to all that mess.

Nothing. Like i told you guys, Delta offered re-funds or put them into DFW or on ATL-DAL flights. 
No legal mess. 

 

[robbedagain]

thanks  

 

[metopower]

It is very hard to commute from DFW to Atl except on the jumpseat . From DAL to ATL I have no idea .sorry that was for Kev.

 

[topDawg]

It is very hard to commute from DFW to Atl except on the jumpseat . From DAL to ATL I have no idea .sorry that was for Kev.

Non-reving out of Dallas can also be impossible. 
 
I have no idea how some many Delta south people still live in Dallas but work in Atlanta or Salt Lake. Its crazy. 
 
I have heard getting to and from DAL was easy till more and more people caught onto it. Along with capacity cuts from DFW things aren't any easier. 

 

[metopower]

One of my friends retired early. Could not commute without over stressing. So he just left early..it was a good decision for him ...he was ready to go.

 

[WorldTraveler]

based on DOT data, the average load factor on DFW-ATL (both directions) for the year ended Oct 2014 was 87% which is higher than both the domestic system average as well as for AA or DL's other routes.

For the most recent quarter that is reported, DL has a 20% average fare premium in the ATL-DFW LOCAL market over AA.

ATL-DFW is also DL's highest yield (cents per mile) route from DFW and AA and DL both get an higher average fare premium on ATL-DFW compared to other routes which DL serves from DFW (all of which are also served by AA.


ATL-DFW is not a very heavy market but it is also a lucrative market.

the very reason why DL wants to make sure it can serve the market from DAL as well as DFW is because it is a lucrative market and DL does not want to allow WN to be able to serve a market which DL cannot.


Again, just as with DL's service to both MDW and ORD from ATL, DTW, and MSP, DL gets an average fare and market share premium to Chicago.

to argue that DL could or should just settle for serving N. Texas from DFW and allow WN to serve it from DAL is counter to US antitrust laws.

There is nothing in the Wright Amendment or any other law that allows WN to dominate DAL to the exclusion of other carriers while DFW is a more competitive airport.

Given that WN made a huge amount of noise about being able to get into DCA and LGA where it had a higher share of seats at those airports after the FL merger but before the two rounds of slot divestitures that it won, it is all the more hypocritical for WN to argue that it should be allowed to dominate DAL but AA and DL had to give up slots at DCA and LGA - or in DL's case not be able to bid on slots that it wanted to bid on.

again, let me know when DL is pushed out of DAL and WN is allowed to even further dominate an airport that is far more concentrated than any other large airport.

 

[jcw]

What is amazing every time we read about revenue we hear how DL has a higher revenue usually by a wide margin on specific routes. If all these posts were true then DL's revenue would be about 20% to 30% higher each quarter. What routes is DL losing its shirt that erases all these revenue advantages?

 

[WorldTraveler]

DL has a revenue premium to the industry and has repeatedly been noted by analysts for its ability to continue to grow revenue faster than the industry.

ATL to DFW (and DAL) is a business heavy route.

I don't think it takes rocket science to realize that routes such as to the Caribbean and resort destinations are far less high yielding.

There isn't anything that DL loses its short on... but some markets clearly do better than others.

 

[FrugalFlyerv2.0]

and somehow people think that the same courts that WN used to pry open DAL in the first place can't be used by DL and other carriers to ensure that DAL is not the poster child of antitrust laws ignored.

there is NO LEGAL BASIS for WN to carry 95% of the traffic from DAL and have one weak niche carrier as competition.

There couldn't be an easier antitrust case for DL to win if it wanted ot take the case to court.

WN knows it.

 
its called the Wright Amendment
Educate yourself.
 
BTW:  I love the spin this tool puts on things.  First it was DL will sue the heck out of WN, DAL, city of Dallas, etc.  Now It is DL will lead a coalition of airlines to court - but only when and if it wants to.  Hilarious!
 

the Wright Amendment did not and never can supersede US antitrust law.

you like most of the rest of the people on this board have repeatedly parroted something that you don't understand.

There was no expectation nor is there any defense for WN controlling 95% of the seats and traffic in/out of a single airport with no way for any other carrier to provide competition.

there is absolutely no basis for it and WN knows full well that if an antitrust case were taken against DAL and WN, WN's ability to operate at DAL as it does now is greatly compromised.
 

 
Wrong as usual.
There is nothing illegal about the Wright Amendment.
 

an antitrust case doesn't require that DL or any other prove that it has been harmed.
 

 
So now you're a legal expert.
Then answer 1 little question:  why hasn't DL sued yet?
 
 

Well, there was a loss of face... DL promised something and put flights out for sale that they couldn't deliver on.

 
Some people that have a certain narrative would still call that winning.
 
 

again, let me know when DL is pushed out of DAL and WN is allowed to even further dominate an airport that is far more concentrated than any other large airport.

 
As soon as DLs sublease is not extended, DL will be out of DAL and there is nothing DL could do about it. 
That's the Whole Truth.

 

[FrugalFlyerv2.0]

What is amazing every time we read about revenue we hear how DL has a higher revenue usually by a wide margin on specific routes. If all these posts were true then DL's revenue would be about 20% to 30% higher each quarter. What routes is DL losing its shirt that erases all these revenue advantages?

 
You do realize that some posters have problems with math.
 
A perfect example is how somebody was preaching day and night how DL's transcon fares were "within a few percentage points of AA".  Well, in that person's world 30-35% is "a few percent".
 
And just as an aside - all of these diatribes about percentages, etc. never include any numbers to back up the conclusions. Hmmm.

 

[WorldTraveler]

then get back with me when DL is out.

there have been so many "DL is out of DAL" posts on here that if I got a dollar for every one of them, I would be a very rich person.

I don't really care that some posters don't do well in math.

profits are reported in money - calculated by math.

if people can't understand or use math correctly, they are clearly in over their heads - which you and others repeatedly show every time a post is made.

just like the peanut allergy discussion on AA, the world does not and will not stand still because you can't make it in a world where peanuts and math are the norm.

 

[FrugalFlyerv2.0]

then get back with me when DL is out.

there have been so many "DL is out of DAL" posts on here that if I got a dollar for every one of them, I would be a very rich person.
 

 
Sure.
 
But why don't you also chill out until then and quit posting on the topic?
 
You keep on repeating that same "DL will teach you a lesson in the court" BS over and over and over and over and over every single day after day after day.
 
I wish I had a dollar for every time you caught lying or were wrong and needed to be corrected, or used funny math, or made statements without any supporting data, or fabricated definitions, or made up stuff,  ... ... ....

 

[WorldTraveler]

I wish I had 50 cents for every time you and others accused me of lying but can't even detail the supposed lie.

when you quit throwing out charges of lying and accept the fact that there are basic market facts which you might not like but which are absolutely true, then maybe we can all move on.

in the meantime, all of the predictions of DL's demise at DAL have yet to occur.

when DL is out of DAL and they accept it without a fight, you can get back to me.