mrfish3726
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Ual On Watch
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U
UAL_TECH
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Expert in what?
He rides in airplanes and wrote a book on travel, now he's a stinking 'expert'!!!
I wouldn't be surprised if UAL didn't sue his 'expert ass' for creating a website called 'uawatch'. Just another moron trying to make a buck.
Pathetic!!!
😛 UT
spacewaitress
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UAL_TECH said:
Separate yourself from your passions and all things considered...it doesn't look good for our future...
London mechanics possibly striking with US based sister unions saying they will honor the strike if it happens...
The gov't now investigating and as of today the PGBC taking UAL to court to block plans by the airline to stop pension payments ( http://www.9news.com/acm_news.aspx?OSGNAME...47-c589c01ca7bf )...
United's US based unions in denial that further cuts will be needed to salaries and benefits...
Oil at $46.50 and climbing...
Full airplanes and low yields due to continuing "walmarting" of the industry...
No exit financing in sight...
How does one see anything positive for our company as we face all these obstacles?
Where is the silver lining or are you just whistling in the dark? Seriously...how does UAL climb out of this? I'm looking for honestly objective perspective...not wishful thinking!
If the company thinks they can just walk away from the pension dificiency, they may have miscalculated what may happen.
I don't think the Fed's will allow it, they will do everything in their power to prevent the company from walking away as they don't want to set an example for the other airlines and other companies to walk away from what is owed into the pension funds. Can you inagine the taxpayer revolt that would happen?
I do not like what I am seeing and reading to past few days. The pressure seems to be mounting as you can tell by Tilton's latest phone call to employees. He doesn't have a clue. But do you think he really cares? He has a pension from UAL already and I'm sure he has one from Texaco as well.
I don't think the Fed's will allow it, they will do everything in their power to prevent the company from walking away as they don't want to set an example for the other airlines and other companies to walk away from what is owed into the pension funds. Can you inagine the taxpayer revolt that would happen?
I do not like what I am seeing and reading to past few days. The pressure seems to be mounting as you can tell by Tilton's latest phone call to employees. He doesn't have a clue. But do you think he really cares? He has a pension from UAL already and I'm sure he has one from Texaco as well.
Seems to me as I recall that when Glenn was hired they had to "buy out" his pension from Texaco or something like that? On the other hand, yes our backs are against the wall. But this is HIGH STAKES POKER folks. Government can hoot and holler all they want, and guess what....we fold and they take ALL of the pension obligations as required by LAW anyways. So I would imagine a whole lot of wheeling and dealing in the background, not to mention the loss of 60k jobs in an election year. With USAir about to roll over and DAL on the brink, this is going to be one heck of a ride. Unfortunately, the loss of pay, benefits and even employment is most likely to occur for many. Prepare for the worst and hope for the best. 
WorldTraveler
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UAL's future is not likely to be decided before the elections which is good. I'm really tired of hearing that decisions re: UAL must be made based on politics; UAL's future must be decided by pure economics - that was why the airline industry was deregulated. At this point, a US failure, if it were to happen, is not about to be pinned on any politician. At some point everyone recognizes these things have been brewing for years and the government cannot be expected to bail out every major company in the US, nor do they do it.
WorldTraveler said:
Would you care to read the ATSB description and tell us where UAL missed the boat? If you take the case on the issues as described in the ATSB layout the app. was a slam dunk. Only one person had direct govermental connection to the ATSB, as it is designed, GW BUSH.
In the first application the ATSB said our cost and structure were too expensive so cut your cost and come back. We cut the cost and now they say, "you do not need the loan". WTFO? Do you even see the double standard and talk from the govt? AWA and FRNT get loans but not UAL? Get your DL head out of the sand. Of course I just read where you think DL is going to buy parts of UAL? Are you related to US320? Must be. DL can not finance ANYTHING. CCC credit rating is difficult to get a loan and the definitely do not have the cash. Of course a buyout would not be that bad I suppose, I am sure the pilots that go with the assetts would like the pay raise <_<
Mr. Bush is too busy dumping the treasury of the United States into that sh*thole in Middle East for people that don't appreciate or want it, to worry about the coming collapse of the US economy.
The sad part is the Kerry would be no better. No choices worth voting for this election year.
The sad part is the Kerry would be no better. No choices worth voting for this election year.
Winglet said:
Winglet,
You are probably right. However, I know the industry or our economy can not stand 4 more years of the Texas Circus. By the way, anybody seen the boss of Abu Gahrib lately?---Rumsfield. Cheney and the misstated earning/stealings. Where do we find such good men? Texas=BUSH,ENRON,Record OIL, cheerleader hit squads.
I will take my chances with Kerry and hope for the best.
WorldTraveler
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magsua and winglet,
You are setting yourself up for great disappointment if you think the Kerry administration will be all that is necessary to keep UA from failing. As an American worker, I am very disappointed at some of the trends that are emerging in American business but to blame them on the Bush administration is truly in denial. Why don't you look at the Clinton administration and see how many suppliers to Wal-Mart cut jobs in the US and exported them to Asia in order to bring you, the American consumer, lower prices. What is happening in the airline industry is no different - and was set 25 years ago when the airline industry was deregulated. Unless you would like to shut the doors between the US and the world (and there are people who will persuasively argue that we should-even though it would sink the legacy airlines which most need free trade and global economic growth to survive), it's time to recognize that the standard of living of all Americans is not going to be as robust as it once was while millions of people in other countries will enjoy better lives, although still at a fraction of the standard of living of Americans. That's life in the global economy and it isn't Republican or Bush - and Kerry is not about to stop it, even it does come at the death of United Airlines or any other huge American company.
You are setting yourself up for great disappointment if you think the Kerry administration will be all that is necessary to keep UA from failing. As an American worker, I am very disappointed at some of the trends that are emerging in American business but to blame them on the Bush administration is truly in denial. Why don't you look at the Clinton administration and see how many suppliers to Wal-Mart cut jobs in the US and exported them to Asia in order to bring you, the American consumer, lower prices. What is happening in the airline industry is no different - and was set 25 years ago when the airline industry was deregulated. Unless you would like to shut the doors between the US and the world (and there are people who will persuasively argue that we should-even though it would sink the legacy airlines which most need free trade and global economic growth to survive), it's time to recognize that the standard of living of all Americans is not going to be as robust as it once was while millions of people in other countries will enjoy better lives, although still at a fraction of the standard of living of Americans. That's life in the global economy and it isn't Republican or Bush - and Kerry is not about to stop it, even it does come at the death of United Airlines or any other huge American company.
mrfish3726
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Yeap AWA and Frontier both got ATSB loans. They showed that they had viable business plans! If you look at the ATSB website you will see that Frontier repaid thier loan VERY early. And, you will also see that the government has made almost 12 million off these airlines from stock options the taxpayers got in return.
As the ATSB said, the safety and stability of the US airline industry is not dependent on the survivial of UniTED. UAL's management team showed the ATSB time and again that they did not have a sound business plan. Not one that they wanted to see the American taxpayer paying for in the end :down: . You can bet here in the next two months they will truley regret that they EVER gave USAIR a loan.
Your management team did IT, stop saying it was a government conspiracy. Stop saying that GW had anything to do with it. Tilton, McDonald, and Brace are the guys you can put that blame on. What the government has truely conveyed to UAL management is. If you can reorganize on your own DO IT. If you can't, THEN GO AWAY.
If you look at the ATSB website you will see that Frontier repaid thier loan VERY early. And, you will also see that the government has made almost 12 million off these airlines from stock options the taxpayers got in return. As the ATSB said, the safety and stability of the US airline industry is not dependent on the survivial of UniTED. UAL's management team showed the ATSB time and again that they did not have a sound business plan. Not one that they wanted to see the American taxpayer paying for in the end :down: . You can bet here in the next two months they will truley regret that they EVER gave USAIR a loan.
Your management team did IT, stop saying it was a government conspiracy. Stop saying that GW had anything to do with it. Tilton, McDonald, and Brace are the guys you can put that blame on. What the government has truely conveyed to UAL management is. If you can reorganize on your own DO IT. If you can't, THEN GO AWAY.
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mrfish3726
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Emiley,
SO what's your point? You saying that the war in IRAQ is what is putting UniTED under? I don't agree with the war in IRAQ, but after working for UAL for 6 years I still can figure out what is putting them out of business. Till the BK judge appoints a trustee to dump the current management you won't be any further by DEC 30. It won't be long till UAL is at the point in the BK like TWA was. Where there is no end in sight and people start to make bids for assets or collecting on that DIP financing. Remember AA walked in and bought TWA for 750 MIL in cash. BK judge could do the same to USAIR and UAL.
SO what's your point? You saying that the war in IRAQ is what is putting UniTED under? I don't agree with the war in IRAQ, but after working for UAL for 6 years I still can figure out what is putting them out of business. Till the BK judge appoints a trustee to dump the current management you won't be any further by DEC 30. It won't be long till UAL is at the point in the BK like TWA was. Where there is no end in sight and people start to make bids for assets or collecting on that DIP financing. Remember AA walked in and bought TWA for 750 MIL in cash. BK judge could do the same to USAIR and UAL.
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