IT WAS JUST A MATTER OF TIME !

[southwind]

... and I know what the former MX people from DFW feel about the DL 'Trim' Plan. They all lost their Jobs when DFW shut down it's MX Base. Most told me they were told, 'This is the last place you will ever work'! Guess what SW, They went to work for AirTran making more $. Now, they will work for WN and make better $. I sometimes wonder the flavor of the Kool-Aid you drink! Get a Grip!

And I know how people from DFW feel too.................I work right next to some of them , because they were given the opportunity to "bump" someone from ATL. Were they happy about leaving DFW, probably not. Were they happy that Delta gave them the opportunity to continue working, more than likely..........yes !

What I don't understand, is if you and Kev hate this company so much and just can't stand the fact that the "Majority" of people here don't want a union...........why the hell don't you pack your bags and move to some other company.............maybe you'll have better luck starting a union there !

As far as Air Tran/WN wages................sounds like wealth envy to me ! Go work for them !

 

[eolesen]

What he's saying about the DFW guys is true. We were friends with a 20 year wrench who bumped into ATL until he could hold a line job again at DFW.

Might not be a written or publicly available procedure, but then again, not every HR policy is going to be published in black and white for rank and file employees to see. At my previous airline, that stuff was restricted by pay grade, and yes, often adapted to fit the situation when unions weren't involved. No, not to screw the employees, but to make sure it was accommodating and (gasp) respectful of the employees with tenure. Union employees were dealt with to the letter of the agreements, which often left fewer options.

 

[Kev3188]

What I don't understand, is if you and Kev hate this company so much and just can't stand the fact that the "Majority" of people here don't want a union...........why the hell don't you pack your bags and move to some other company.............maybe you'll have better luck starting a union there !

I should've known you'd default to this stale meme before too long... Frankly, I'm surprised it took you this long.

Still waiting...


P.S. FL is union... Or did you miss that?

 

[WorldTraveler]

What he's saying about the DFW guys is true. We were friends with a 20 year wrench who bumped into ATL until he could hold a line job again at DFW.

Might not be a written or publicly available procedure, but then again, not every HR policy is going to be published in black and white for rank and file employees to see. At my previous airline, that stuff was restricted by pay grade, and yes, often adapted to fit the situation when unions weren't involved. No, not to screw the employees, but to make sure it was accommodating and (gasp) respectful of the employees with tenure. Union employees were dealt with to the letter of the agreements, which often left fewer options.

That is true and DL likes having the freedom to not put things in writing in a largely non-union environment - even if SW believes they have largely been as fair as possible with most personnel policies - but the closure of the DFW hub as well as the consolidation of maintenance facilities was very much a one time event that will likely not be repeated.
.
It was also very likely that DL allowed the one time maintenance exceptions to bumping because DFW was a fairly large maintenance operation for DL and if they didn't allow bumping, they would have lost a lot of experienced people.... it likely made more sense to "amend" the unwritten policy on a one-time basis than to lose all that talent.....and end up w/ an overall less experienced workforce.
but it also doesn't mean it will repeated again even for maintenance... nor does it mean that it will be used for ACS employees which is Kev's perspective.... highlighting my previous comment that personnel policies are interpreted differently by work group.

 

[WorldTraveler]

anyone who had doubts about how WN would develop its network post FL-WN merger might want to note that they are temporarily or permanently pulling down a number of markets in network carrier hubs, esp. PHL and to a lesser degree SLC... and they are building up their own hubs....

http://swamedia.com/releases/9e4da577-de90-d3a8-0469-b1004e2d7deb?src=PRPRSWAMSCH0000000110725

Lest anyone think any differently, WN's business model is becoming more and more focused on building their own hubs and withdrawing from markets where they are not a large enough force to shift revenue to themselves - not much different from what the network airlines did with their hub rationalization years ago.

 

[700UW]

Freeing up airplanes for its massive assault on DL in ATL!!!!

 

[eolesen]

anyone who had doubts about how WN would develop its network post FL-WN merger might want to note that they are temporarily or permanently pulling down a number of markets in network carrier hubs, esp. PHL and to a lesser degree SLC... and they are building up their own hubs....

Lest anyone think any differently, WN's business model is becoming more and more focused on building their own hubs and withdrawing from markets where they are not a large enough force to shift revenue to themselves - not much different from what the network airlines did with their hub rationalization years ago.

I think you're stretching the truth a bit. SLC isn't being pulled down -- Boise is. And that's not a hub for anyone.

What they've pulled down is a lot of short-haul flying:

Manchester-Philadelphia = 289mi
Philadelphia-Pittsburgh = 268mi
Philadelphia-Providence = 237mi

Spokane-Seattle/Tacoma = 224mi
Birmingham-Louisville = 325mi

Boise-Reno/Tahoe = 377mi
Boise-Salt Lake City = 290mi
Boise-Seattle/Tacoma = 399mi

BoltBus and MegaBus are also in each of those PHL markets (to BOS vs MHT/PVD), and I suspect trying to compete with $25 fares for the six hour drive from PHL to BOS is probably not worth WN's time anymore.


Then there's a couple routes which probably perform like dog vomit:

Jacksonville-Philadelphia
Kansas City-Seattle/Tacoma
Manchester-Las Vegas
Phoenix-Providence


WN probably also has some fleet flexibility with owned 733's and 735's that could be parked and/or retired if necessary.

So no, I don't think this is at all any indication of how WN will approach ATL, unless you think they were planning to fly from ATL to MHT, PVD, or BOI.

 

[WorldTraveler]

I think you're stretching the truth a bit. SLC isn't being pulled down -- Boise is. And that's not a hub for anyone.

What they've pulled down is a lot of short-haul flying:

Manchester-Philadelphia = 289mi
Philadelphia-Pittsburgh = 268mi
Philadelphia-Providence = 237mi

Spokane-Seattle/Tacoma = 224mi
Birmingham-Louisville = 325mi

Boise-Reno/Tahoe = 377mi
Boise-Salt Lake City = 290mi
Boise-Seattle/Tacoma = 399mi

BoltBus and MegaBus are also in each of those PHL markets (to BOS vs MHT/PVD), and I suspect trying to compete with $25 fares for the six hour drive from PHL to BOS is probably not worth WN's time anymore.


Then there's a couple routes which probably perform like dog vomit:

Jacksonville-Philadelphia
Kansas City-Seattle/Tacoma
Manchester-Las Vegas
Phoenix-Providence


WN probably also has some fleet flexibility with owned 733's and 735's that could be parked and/or retired if necessary.

So no, I don't think this is at all any indication of how WN will approach ATL, unless you think they were planning to fly from ATL to MHT, PVD, or BOI.

yes, there are "spoke" cities that aren't working for WN, but it is a bunch of "spokes" that make a hub. And while WN can't make PHL-PIT, BOI-SLC, BOI-SEA, PHL-etc.... apparently the network carriers can.
The notion that WN can stimulate markets and create demand just isn't supported by the reality that many of these markets DO need a strong hub in order to support air service, and when a network carrier has far more capacity in the market than a low fare carrier, it is clear who will win..... in reality, it is about the largest carrier in the market, regardless of the type of carrier. We have seen WN "win" in markets where the hub carrier pulls back and we have seen WN blink in cases where the network carrier won't blink. Not surprisingly, WN continues to add capacity to DEN - where, guess what, the other carriers are blinking -and are very watery eyed.
.
We haven't heard about the FL specific network changes yet but they will be pulling out of a lot of their markets - many of which hang on the side of ther ATL hub - or there will be even more dog "stuff" to mop up.
.
Notions of WN's grand incursion into other carrier hub markets STILL are not supported by any historical evidence - and they become even less likely as WN, like all other carriers, has to deal with $3/gallon jet fuel.
Perhaps the network carriers' previously scuttled merger plans won't look quite so bad when WN has to do some of the same thing.

 

[QA4Jet-A]

And I know how people from DFW feel too.................I work right next to some of them , because they were given the opportunity to "bump" someone from ATL. Were they happy about leaving DFW, probably not. Were they happy that Delta gave them the opportunity to continue working, more than likely..........yes !

What I don't understand, is if you and Kev hate this company so much and just can't stand the fact that the "Majority" of people here don't want a union...........why the hell don't you pack your bags and move to some other company.............maybe you'll have better luck starting a union there !

As far as Air Tran/WN wages................sounds like wealth envy to me ! Go work for them !

Duh...... That's who I work for

 

[QA4Jet-A]

Duh...... That's who I work for

... and by the way, I never said I hated DL

 

[gizmo_sc]

STAY TUNED.... WN announcement on AUG 4th !!!!!

 

[2BlacknBlue]

STAY TUNED.... WN announcement on AUG 4th !!!!!

 

[signals]

STAY TUNED.... WN announcement on AUG 4th !!!!!

See ya then

 

[signals]

See ya then

Sneak peek h34r:

 

[WorldTraveler]

Sneak peek h34r:

Surprise, surprise, Wall Street is looking at LUV as an airline and comparing their performance to other airlines - and expecting them to work within the same set of challenges of other airlines.
.
WN is a very well run airline... they will adjust their business model - including the FL acquisition - to what it takes to win in a consolidated industry... but they are not immune to rising fuel prices, increased taxes, and merger integration issues.
.
BTW, all of the network carriers have reported their financial results for the 2nd quarter and DL's results show that it is the largest domestic airline in terms of revenue and they also had the highest domestic RASM growth.
DL has never forgotten its roots as a domestic airline - and intends to win in the domestic market since DL like every other US airline has more domestic than international revenue exposure.