Union elections and the RLA....POLL!

[2BlacknBlue]

Do you think it is interference for Obama to appoint pro-union nominees to the NMB, to sway decisions made by said NMB ?

Just curious. :blink:

What laws are on the books regarding this subject above?

The law states for organizing:


"No carrier, its officers or agents, shall deny or in any way question the right of its employees to join, organize, or assist in organizing the labor organization of their choice, and it shall be unlawful for any carrier to interfere in any way with the organization of its employees . . . or to influence or coerce employees in an effort to induce them to join or remain or not to join or remain members of any labor organization."

 

[Dignity]

what you forget to mention was how the Union Activists and affiliates will bully the employees.. who just happen to have a different view or want to try something differently rather than continuous failed ideas.. to try and keep our, employees mouth shut.

(of course that is fairly obvious)

 

[2BlacknBlue]

Digggggg? You're deflectinnnnnng.....these are two separate issuesssssss.

""No carrier, its officers or agents, shall deny or in any way question the right of its employees to join, organize, or assist in organizing the labor organization of their choice, and it shall be unlawful for any carrier to interfere in any way with the organization of its employees . . . or to influence or coerce employees in an effort to induce them to join or remain or not to join or remain members of any labor organization."


"what you forget to mention was how the Union Activists and affiliates will bully the employees.. who just happen to have a different view or want to try something differently rather than continuous failed ideas.. to try and keep our, employees mouth shut.

(of course that is fairly obvious)"


Bullying is WRONG!!! But how is the company going to un-bully the employees by flagrantly attempting to influence or coerce employees to not join a union by providing literature to send via emails?

 

[LukeAisleWalker]

Dig--
I forgive you too.
I'm really not a hater but trying to have a LIVELY debate --and making sure you see the whole enchilada.
Happy landings (and takeoffs).

 

[john john]

AFA organizers/Leaders/Activists bickering all over again but its just a tad unpleasant to witness repeatedly, the "driving the wedge right down the middle part" all over again.. that sort of doesnt really show "unity" and makes the group "whole".

(some things seem.. will never change)

being stuck in the middle that is..

moving right along....

(hopefully)

An organized group of employees elected by the employees empower by the law to represent a class and craft having opinions and debating. You not so much
And they are moving on with what concerns there represented class and craft. You not so much

 

[Dignity]

You not so much
And they are moving on with what concerns there represented class and craft. You not so much

I am a Flight Attendant with an opinion and personal beliefs.

(that seems to bother some who cannot embrace other ideas, I wonder why that is?)

someone does not have to always accept another person's idea but that should not dismiss
someone from being part of the group or the ability to work as a team.

we are moving on?

did someone happen to inform you they, AFA pulled the ability for us to do just that.

(without asking any one of us)

*we have zero resolution to-date on anything.

they, AFA need to re-file, as they did this past summer, so we can begin the process of,

moving on.

 

[southwind]

Did you think it was fair for Bush to appoint, anti-worker, anti-union and pro-business to the NMB?

And deny TSA employees the right to unionize?

I for one , am glad the TSA was not allowed to unionize, as I do not want my "AMERICAN TAX PAYER" money supporting unions !

Even though thats not the case with the UAW @ GM, but I wasn't given a choice !

Businesses create jobs......................unions don't !

 

[southwind]

. . . or to influence or coerce employees in an effort to induce them to join or remain or not to join or remain members of any labor organization."

Hmm..............maybe the "NEW" members of the NMB should have read this before trying to pass legislation !

 

[2BlacknBlue]

Hmm..............maybe the "NEW" members of the NMB should have read this before trying to pass legislation !

What laws are on the books regarding Obama's appointments of pro-union nominees to the NMB?

BTW, didn't Delta back Obama's appointments?



Delta backs Obama's labor board nominee


"Delta’s top human resources officer urged the U.S. Senate to confirm Linda Puchala to the three-member National Mediation Board (NMB)."



"Ms. Puchala has years of valuable experience, including time with the NMB,â€￾ Mike Campbell, Delta executive vice president of human resources and labor relations, said in a statement. “She enjoys broad support among the airline industry and labor community. We look forward to her confirmation to become a member of the NMB."

 

[john john]

I for one , am glad the TSA was not allowed to unionize, as I do not want my "AMERICAN TAX PAYER" money supporting unions !

Even though thats not the case with the UAW @ GM, but I wasn't given a choice !

Businesses create jobs......................unions don't !

You do know what the biggest union in America is
Sets a lot of standards for workers in America

 

[Dignity]

You do know what the biggest union in America is
Sets a lot of standards for workers in America

yeah and set some us of back 30 years.

I work under contract right now that has our group hovering at the bottom of the industry.

want to know how effective they were with the "me too" clause?


*an effective union will address, compromise, maintain and protect.

what we ended up with was a union(s) that...

ignored, ignored more, gutted, promised, didnt deliver.

 

[Wings]

yeah and set some us of back 30 years.

I work under contract right now that has our group hovering at the bottom of the industry.

want to know how effective they were with the "me too" clause?

Dignity:

Perhaps you can explain why the NWA FAs currently have a contract that set them "back"? And then perhaps, you can also mention that when AFA-CWA was voted onto NWA property in July 2006, with only ten days to negotiate, our new union was able to obtain approximately $10 million in improvements (from PFAA's TA1). AFA-CWA didn't set the bar for the negotiations. PFAA agreed to it and U.S. Bankruptcy Court Judge Alan Gropper held the NWA FAs to that "ask". When we voted down TA2, AFA-CWA was then able to negotiate an additional $10 million in improvements.

As far as the "me too" clause, are you familiar with the grievance? Do you have the details of the decision regarding our pilots' cost-neutral improvements? Our "me too" clause is much more than JUST LOA 35 which is what the arbitration covered.

It's amazing how you can be so critical of our union, it's leaders and the efforts of many other FAs when you have no idea what goes on behind the scenes to represent our FA group. Instead, you refuse to lift a finger to assist, but are always quick to criticize. So very typical and completely unproductive.

I remember when you first joined this forum. Very polite when asking questions or providing information, etc. From what I read these days, you've pretty much taken over the board and there are very few who even bother to participate. Your caustic comments no longer add to a healthy debate of the issues. And your demeanor now mirrors Dapoe's - very embarrassing to see from a coworker.

It's one thing to disagree with our union's actions, but when you consistently twist the facts to suit your agenda... what you have to say, no longer holds much water.

 

[Dignity]

Dignity:

Perhaps you can explain why the NWA FAs currently have a contract that set them "back"?

I would be more than happy to explain that. We have a group of know-it-all career unionists that convinced the group
how horrible the Teamsters were (even though we had an industry leading contact) and how they called us names at the convention and why we had to go independent and vote PFAA. They, PFAA and crew, former ousted teamster President as well, jumped on that band wagon and there we have it our "new" independent union.

then something happened.. the promise of not having to worry about dues check off would never be an issue, and for some reason it was! and we lost it. Then something interesting started to happen, our own colleagues just refused to pay their fair share to keep the union solvent financially, also at the same time they, PFAA started to ignore every and any attempt to address one cent of concessions. then the infighting started...then continued refusal to pay dues, then more delays, then finally they caved in and gutted the contract. But all was not lost AFA was there to save the day and promised to guide us through the bankruptcy and restore and were voted in...what happened, they changed the evaluations, the PFAA and AFA Leadership started to bicker, TA 2 was voted down, they canceled the strike and then never fully explained the equity claim and then TA 3 barely passed.

Were concessions needed, yes, were they going to happen, yes.

I think we can all understand that one.

The point was not necessarily the concessionary amount, it was all the promises AFA made to our group during the campaign in order for everyone to vote for them and then when they did not deliver pointed fingers back at the PFAA and claim they were not the one responsible, even though their name was on the cover and they are the representative, it is always someone else's fault, always.

Oh yeah, then the dues increase on top of it all.

face it, they needed us, $ , more than we really needed them.

I will give PFAA one thing though, they did try to merge the association into TWU, that would have been the smartest move at the time instead of the alternative we ended up with, the least effective on the list.

And then perhaps, you can also mention that AFA was able to negotiate approximately $10 million in improvements when they were voted in by a majority of NWA FAs (July 2006) and forced to negotiate a contract in a short ten days. AFA-CWA didn't set the bar for the negotiations. PFAA agreed to it and U.S. Bankruptcy Court Judge Alan Gropper held the NWA FAs to that "ask". When we voted down TA2, AFA-CWA was able to negotiate an additional $10 million in improvements.

we have the full 195 in place.. so you can go honk that horn to someone who didnt pay attention!

As far as the "me too" clause, are you familiar with the grievance? Do you have the details of the decision regarding our pilots' cost-neutral improvements?

we ended up with zero correct?

It's amazing how you can be so critical of our union, it's leaders and the efforts of many when you have no idea what goes on behind the scenes to represent our FA group. Instead, you refuse to lift a finger to assist, but are always quick to criticize.

well Wings, I was one of the more vocal people attempting to explain the importance of voting for TA3 and supported that agreement that secured the equity claim.. and voted for it, unlike a lot of Northwest Flight Attendants who were just convinced they knew what they were doing emerging bankruptcy with three rejected TA.

You should be real thankful people such as myself supported that agreement going into this merger, any chance to unionize would be hovering at about Nil.

oh yeah, and paid all my dues..

(even though I was labeled a management sympathizer by my own colleagues for supporting the AFA agreement because you were all set to reject it for the third time.. so you could be enabled to all walk off your jobs in a strike to get even with NWA, you all know who you are..)

Thankfully some of your colleagues have some sense.

so I would appreciate you quit pointing your finger.

I remember when you first joined this forum. Very polite - when asking questions or providing information, etc. From what I can see these days, you've pretty much taken over the board and there are very few who even bother to participate. Your caustic comments no longer add to a healthy debate of the issues. And your demeanor now mirrors Dapoe's - very embarrassing to see from a coworker who should be intelligent enough to understand why we need representation at the 'new' Delta Air Lines.

There are 10 thousand plus members on this forum and I have not taken over the board, I respond nearly 90 percent of the time after I have been quoted.

I do however put a lot of thoughts down in a short period of time, it is the way I have always been since I was very young, so its not just taking over the board, as you see it, rather than I just write.

Had I taken the stance to focus negative attention solely to management you would have been cheering me on.

(I believe that would have been the case 100 percent)

face it you do not seem to accept other people's opinion, if they differ from yours is the real reason you felt the need to
try and put a guilt trip on me.

Ill keep your "embarrassing" comment in mind after I go back in and pick up the passenger commendation letter and gift card that I was notified by email..again. Those cards and letters from passengers and thank for you a nice flight keep me focused as that means more to me than any thing ever. It makes me feel great, a simple Thank you at the end of the flight is really all I want to hear, the letters they write are priceless, to me.

Believe it or not, I try to be a nice person and always treat our customers and crew like they are suppose to be treated.

I have always believed in second chances and was willing to give the AFA another chance when the merger was approved, the development or lack of over the past year is when it gets to be the third , the fourth, to the point some are never going to change.

I am not anti-Union per say, but something is going to have to change with what I am seeing.

It's one thing to disagree with our union's actions, but when you consistently twist the facts to suit your agenda... what you have to say, no longer holds much water.

I have posted facts.

You may however take any one of my comments and point which ones out that are "twisted" or not true.

(I actually welcome you or anyone to do just that)

instead of just making a baseless comment trying to discredit the truth.

 

[700UW]

I for one , am glad the TSA was not allowed to unionize, as I do not want my "AMERICAN TAX PAYER" money supporting unions !

Even though thats not the case with the UAW @ GM, but I wasn't given a choice !

Businesses create jobs......................unions don't !

Guess you dont know that the biggest portion of unionized workers are government employees, too late, lol!

Dignity, look around, guess you forgot about 9/11 and the fuel crisis, every union in the industry at most carriers were forced to take concessions or perish, so what is better, working to fight another die, or just die immediately?

Look at how many airlines went out of business after 9/11.

 

[southwind]

What laws are on the books regarding Obama's appointments of pro-union nominees to the NMB?

BTW, didn't Delta back Obama's appointments?



Delta backs Obama's labor board nominee


"Delta’s top human resources officer urged the U.S. Senate to confirm Linda Puchala to the three-member National Mediation Board (NMB)."



"Ms. Puchala has years of valuable experience, including time with the NMB,â€￾ Mike Campbell, Delta executive vice president of human resources and labor relations, said in a statement. “She enjoys broad support among the airline industry and labor community. We look forward to her confirmation to become a member of the NMB."

Well then, sounds to me like you have nothing to worry about, as far as Delta inteferring with a union vote, since they backed Nobamas nominations .............right ?