2007 PHL Int'l Departures

[PHL]

So WN has only increased service "minimally" in PIT, whereas they can't add flights fast enough at PHL. Is that correct? Strange, there are plenty of gates available at PIT, no?....

yes. SW sees what US and any other airline have seen. PIT doesn't have the O&D to support a big operation. US was succesfull because PIT was a connecting hub. I don't have the hard numbers, but did O&D traffic EVER outnumber connecting traffic there?

 

[aredeeyou22]

yes. SW sees what US and any other airline have seen. PIT doesn't have the O&D to support a big operation. US was succesfull because PIT was a connecting hub. I don't have the hard numbers, but did O&D traffic EVER outnumber connecting traffic there?

"US was successful because PIT was a connecting hub."

Successful where? PIT?

Connecting traffic alone is low yielding. Plus, PIT is a much less desirable airport to connect in due to its location. Unfortunately, DFW, ORD, DTW, are more centrally located. Would people pay a premium to connect at PIT? No. And as for north/south connections, CLT has that covered....

I would think that O&D traffic did not outnumber connecting traffic, but am not sure. Anyone?

 

[ClueByFour]

Whether O and D outnumbered connecting traffic is irrelevent in light of the fares US charged when PIT was a hub. O and D is up significantly since.

Likewise, O and D is up hugely in PHL since LUV came in. That's not people heading overseas, either.

 

[BoeingBoy]

"US was successful because PIT was a connecting hub."

Successful where? PIT?

Actually, yes - PIT.....

How many years was Allegheny/USAir successful when PIT was it's only hub? Only 40-some.

How many years has US Airways been successful with PHL as it's "premier hub"? Not saying there's necessarily a connection, but we've had 2 bankruptcies since PHL has had that distinction.

While PIT may not be the ideal location for a "midwest" hub, where else are you going to put one? Name a city between the Ohio river and the Rockies that has more O&D than PIT, has the facilities for a hub operation, and isn't already heavily served by another carrier.

Jim

 

[Travelpro72]

Jim I just absolutely LOVE your posts. They are ALWAYS dead on. Maybe that new hub could be in GRR Grand Rapids. 🙄

 

[UWCactus]

Look for some really great new destinations on TA flights...not a bunch, but what we get (one in particular) will be worth the wait.

 

[Boeing Boeing GONE]

I bet ur talking about Athens?? 🙂

 

[Crzipilot]

Another interesting spin on this, as someone mentioned we are parking 3 757's at end of year. (Actually I believe they are getting called back by the lessor, as they can get a better lease rate from some place else, and obviously US didn't want to pay the higher rates)

As some have stipulated and Mgmt has stated, Parker will look at new airframes if it is "the right situation" (probably meaning cheap lease rates)

Well Fedex just announced plans to acquire and modify 90 757's, and bring them into service between 2008-2016. 8 long years, but the lead time to get the airplane, cut the door in it, and have it in service is (a guess here) 6 months or so to do the conversion. Any rate the lease prices for 757's I'm sure have just gone up, and when Fedex and UPS started gobbling up Md-11's/DC-10's you'll prob. see the same thing happen to the market for 757's, you could barely find any.....

 

[SoftLanding]

Well Fedex just announced plans to acquire and modify 90 757's, and bring them into service between 2008-2016. 8 long years, but the lead time to get the airplane, cut the door in it, and have it in service is (a guess here) 6 months or so to do the conversion. Any rate the lease prices for 757's I'm sure have just gone up, and when Fedex and UPS started gobbling up Md-11's/DC-10's you'll prob. see the same thing happen to the market for 757's, you could barely find any.....

This is very interesting. Try to get "cheap" lease rates on B757 now...

🙂

Maybe A330-200 is in our future? Sure is a more comfortable aircraft for the Atlantic. (PS Try sitting for 8 hours in the middle seat of a B757, not too funny...Though price was right 🙂


SoftLanding


SoftLanding

 

[barbeetantrums]

I bet ur talking about Athens?? 🙂

PRG 🙂

 

[jerseyfinn]

PIT is indeed a good location of arguable worth, but it remains whilstful thinking given Pennsylvania politics and the rural/urban divisions which drive state politics. Things are what they are in PHL and the reality of demographics and geography drive that equation and will continue to do so.

I remember the old PHL airport when we could walk out on the concourse roof and see the old Tri-Stars taxiing around ( also TWA, Pan Am,&National, Eastern & of course Allegheny to name a few ). PHL has been under perpertual construction all of those years and will continue so in the future. I read these ripples about a new runway etc. etc. and I can't begin to fathom how that will happen. Then again, the problems facing US are more functional such as finding employees who will work for the money without chucking your luggage down the crapper.

Wayne's World says "build it and they will come." In the case of PHL I think they'd change that quote to "you built it, now you're stuck with it."

Barry

 

[EKCH]

Look for some really great new destinations on TA flights...not a bunch, but what we get (one in particular) will be worth the wait.

It will be interesting to see which new TA destinations US will add from the summer 2007 (I know you can’t tell)

This summer Stockholm was added to the network and after a weak start it seems like the route has performed well. As always rumors are floating around and I have heard that they have been studying a route to Copenhagen in addition to the Stockholm service. But personally I find it hard to believe they add a new service to Scandinavia this coming summer.

Anyway I cross my fingers for a CPH service – It would be perfect to have a nonstop connection from Denmark to PHL.

 

[sharktooth]

Another interesting spin on this, as someone mentioned we are parking 3 757's at end of year. (Actually I believe they are getting called back by the lessor, as they can get a better lease rate from some place else, and obviously US didn't want to pay the higher rates)

For many reasons "higher" lease rates are available other than at USAirways.

For instance, US corporations doing business overseas can defer that income almost indefinitely, for tax purposes. (Just this year an amnesty of sorts was arranged with corporations paying a maximum of 5.25% income tax rate for that income - wouldn't we like that rate).

If your US corporation leased aircraft overseas, that income can, eventually, be taxed at a much lower rate than income derived from within the states, therefore, US corporations enjoy a significantly higher profit margin overseas for the same lease rate (Their cost of doing business is so much lower that even with lower lease rates they still get more money over there than here). So, better does not necessarily mean, "higher".

For a "tip of the iceberg" look at the problem, read, "Take This Job and Ship It" by Senator Dorgan of North Dakota. It is a perversion of our tax law that allows such unfair balances to happen, in this case.

 

[nycbusdriver]

Actually, yes - PIT.....

How many years was Allegheny/USAir successful when PIT was it's only hub? Only 40-some.

How many years has US Airways been successful with PHL as it's "premier hub"? Not saying there's necessarily a connection, but we've had 2 bankruptcies since PHL has had that distinction.

While PIT may not be the ideal location for a "midwest" hub, where else are you going to put one? Name a city between the Ohio river and the Rockies that has more O&D than PIT, has the facilities for a hub operation, and isn't already heavily served by another carrier.

Jim

Well, yeah. Okay. In the heady days of USAir having a strangle-hold on the northeast and, by far, the highest yields in the industry, PIT was a money maker.

Those days are GONE. FOREVER.

PIT makes perfect sense when yield is in the stratosphere. It's not now, nor is it likely to ever be again.

PIT has a lovely terminal, arguably in the top ten world-wide. But now it makes as much sense (financially) as building the Burj al Arab Hotel in downtown Enid, OK.

PIT is passe for the airline business. Time to just get over it.

 

[PHL]

Wayne's World says "build it and they will come." In the case of PHL I think they'd change that quote to "you built it, now you're stuck with it."
Barry

That was actually "Field of Dreams" that had Kevin Costner believing "If you build it [baseball field], they will come"