AA 's selling TW 767's to FEDEX?

[aafsc]

<_< ---- It's sad whenever anyone feels there is no other way out except taking ones own life, no matter who you work for, or what the circumstances!---- aa! You keep talking about EAL. I can understand that seeing you originally came from there, but I don't see the similarities! EAL went Chapt.7, and was liquidated! Good thing? No! EAL was a class act! And but for a few greedy people, might still be flying today! TWA was purposely taken into Chapt.11, not Chapt.7! Was bought up by aa and it's employees were promised "fair" treatment! That promise was never kept! I don't know how old you are aa, but a good portion of these Girls were in their early to mid fifties, and some even older, when this happened. And spent a good portion of their life's working only as F/A's for TWA!------ Reality check here! With few, if any other skills, at their age, just "getting on with your life, and getting another job", just isn't that easy!---Sad, but some, thought it imposable!---- Now, Hopeless!--- I've always said I felt "fair" was some where between "Staple", and "Dovetail"! But your Union didn't even conceder that! It was, and is, all one way!---- As for me trying to put a Guilt trip on you, and your fellow F/A's? I don't have to do that! It's not on me! You have to live with it! My conscience is clear!--- 😉 At least regarding these matters!

twa did exactly what EAL did-filed chapter 11 which later on turned into a chapter 7 liquidation. Compton said this when the asset purchase was announced. AA agreed to offer the twaers employment using you twa seniority for pay purposes. AA fulfilled it's commitment and gave jobs to the twa unionized employees as promised. However, Carty had no legal authority over union seniority. He could not give what was not his any more than I can give your home to a third party because it's not mine to give. So he may have promised this and that but the fact is the AA employees and their unions were absolutely against this transaction and we were going to do everything to protect ourselves from the twa people who had very high seniority at twa. The APFA did exactly what it was supposed to do; protect the interests of it's members (twa F/As were not legally represented by APFA at the time). There is absolutley no reason the AA F/As or the APFA to feel guilty about the way the list was combined.By the way, hopeful is not an AA F/A. You are right in one respect about EAL and twa being different. That being the fate of it's employees. About 4,000 twa employees are still working at AA making the best compensation among the legacies; EAL people didn't get that. Many twa employees retired from AA with retiree medical, a small AA pension, and passes; EAL people didn't get that. The twa people that did get laid off got to work for two more years at top pay and they have recall rights, EAL people didn't get that. AA gave those twaers who retired from twa before the asset purchase retiree medical and passes, EAL people didn't get that. The fact is you twaers came out a hell of a lot better than the employees of Eastern, Pan Am, and Braniff.

 

[nbmcg01]

twa did exactly what EAL did-filed chapter 11 which later on turned into a chapter 7 liquidation. Compton said this when the asset purchase was announced. AA agreed to offer the twaers employment using you twa seniority for pay purposes. AA fulfilled it's commitment and gave jobs to the twa unionized employees as promised. However, Carty had no legal authority over union seniority. He could not give what was not his any more than I can give your home to a third party because it's not mine to give. So he may have promised this and that but the fact is the AA employees and their unions were absolutely against this transaction and we were going to do everything to protect ourselves from the twa people who had very high seniority at twa. The APFA did exactly what it was supposed to do; protect the interests of it's members (twa F/As were not legally represented by APFA at the time). There is absolutley no reason the AA F/As or the APFA to feel guilty about the way the list was combined.By the way, hopeful is not an AA F/A. You are right in one respect about EAL and twa being different. That being the fate of it's employees. About 4,000 twa employees are still working at AA making the best compensation among the legacies; EAL people didn't get that. Many twa employees retired from AA with retiree medical, a small AA pension, and passes; EAL people didn't get that. The twa people that did get laid off got to work for two more years at top pay and they have recall rights, EAL people didn't get that. AA gave those twaers who retired from twa before the asset purchase retiree medical and passes, EAL people didn't get that. The fact is you twaers came out a hell of a lot better than the employees of Eastern, Pan Am, and Braniff.

TWA ONLY filed BK as a condition of the acquisition to abrogate contracts. The IAM gave away our SCOPE (without any discussion or vote), Even with "TOP PAY", I made less than at TWA because of the archaic work rules. Now you're at our former pay scale and don't have those work rules to offset. What was even dumber that the IAM giving away SCOPE was the APFAs RPA worth how much? Not securing no cost or cost neutral quality of life enhancements shows the APFAs lack of bargaining skill. Not one person HAD to lose their jobs in that debacle. TWA, PanAm, Braniff, and Eastern, are like fruits, all great but very different circumstances. And don't forget the original SIA included New York. That just "happened" to disappear as will St. Louis. Moot issue since the APFA and AA are in collusion not to return any former TWA f/as.

 

[eolesen]

Must...

continue....

beating....

dead....

horse.....

 

[TWskyliner]

Must...

continue....

beating....

dead....

horse.....

Not....


interested?.....


Go......


to.....


another.....


thread.....

 

[aafsc]

TWA ONLY filed BK as a condition of the acquisition to abrogate contracts. The IAM gave away our SCOPE (without any discussion or vote), Even with "TOP PAY", I made less than at TWA because of the archaic work rules. Now you're at our former pay scale and don't have those work rules to offset. What was even dumber that the IAM giving away SCOPE was the APFAs RPA worth how much? Not securing no cost or cost neutral quality of life enhancements shows the APFAs lack of bargaining skill. Not one person HAD to lose their jobs in that debacle. TWA, PanAm, Braniff, and Eastern, are like fruits, all great but very different circumstances. And don't forget the original SIA included New York. That just "happened" to disappear as will St. Louis. Moot issue since the APFA and AA are in collusion not to return any former TWA f/as.

I am not making now what the twaers made, I'm still making much more. twa ramp topped out at around $16 and change an hour. In 2000 I was making around $20 an hour. The following contract put top pay for AA ramp at $22 an hour. The concessions put my hourly pay back where it was in 2000, $20 an hour. Even with the concessions, I am still making more than a twaer did at twa.

 

[eolesen]

Not....
interested?.....
Go......
to.....
another.....
thread.....

Sounds great, except that this friggin' thread ISN'T ABOUT SENIORITY.....

It was about selling aircraft to FDX. Instead, a bunch of whiners turned into the 2,528th thread on how the TWA'ers got screwed.

I (and I'm sure there are another 84,000 people) would much rather discuss the 2000 presidential recounts in Florida than sit thru yet another flame-fest on seniority.

 

[alfista]

So I wonder... is it the old TW 763's fault for all the AA employees' miseries? Or the other way around? Or inside out???

I've heard of thread hijack, but this one is ridiculous even by THIS BOARD'S standards!!!!

C'mon, folks, does EVERY SINGLE THREAD have to be a pi$$in' match..????

AA vs TWA
Union vs management
TULE vs MCIE (vs AFW)
any particular individual with an axe to grind vs any given grinding stone

Good grief.

 

[nbmcg01]

I am not making now what the twaers made, I'm still making much more. twa ramp topped out at around $16 and change an hour. In 2000 I was making around $20 an hour. The following contract put top pay for AA ramp at $22 an hour. The concessions put my hourly pay back where it was in 2000, $20 an hour. Even with the concessions, I am still making more than a twaer did at twa.

I can only speak for the f/as, not other work groups. Work rules make a contract industrry leading, not $ per hour. Don't get me wrong, $ per hour is great but when you have to fly more days per month, and more legs per day, TO ME it doesn't equate. We have been told how grateful we should be for the substantial pay raise because of AA/APFAs Industry Leading contract. Now we are being quoted "industry standard". I would watch upcoming negotiations very carefully if I were an active f/a. Work rules can offset almost any pay cut. Many of our f/as didn't realize that until we worked under the APFA's circa '70s rules.

 

[MCI transplant]

Must...

continue....

beating....

dead....

horse.....

<_< ---- Problem is, not all us horses are dead!!! 😉 ---- But, you are absolutly correct, this thread is about TWA's 767s, or should I say 757s! If ALCOA ever shows up, we'd be more that happy to covert them for Fed Ex!!!