American Airlines and Labor Negotiations

[iluvaa]

Can we keep personal attacks in private messages? We get it a lot of us have differing opinions.

 

[swamt]

Right over his head and out the window. He's probably still thinking; "what did I miss?"

how many new amfa positions did the amfa gain or do they still allow most of maintenance to be contracted out?
Look, i get it that you guys want the cash, even thats better than the assoc. But having most work contracted out isnt the answer either.

Glad you asked Timmy.
AMFA is and will gain many new positions with our new contract. SWA will be hiring big time for HOU-DEN-San Diego-San Jose-LAX-FLL-and either BWI or MDW as well as at headquartered DAL. With all the added maint. coming to line, hgr ron, line ron and overnighters headcount will have to increase. They have already started the hiring and will continue into 2020.
Now, let me educate you on something Timmy; AMFA inherited the teamsters contract back in 2004 after teamsters represented us for well over 30 plus years. They, as well as the IAM before the teamsters are the representational unions that originally agreed to the rather large outsourcing %'s that SWA does. Even while under the teamsters, it was agreed to by the co. and the teamsters that as long as they can keep outsourcing like that they are willing to pay ILC rates with a lean and mean headcount. AMFA simply inherited that contract. However, AMFA has since brought in more maint and work than the teamsters ever did in their 30 plus years. AMFA doubled heavy maint in Dallas, added "C" check lines in 4 cities, increased shop work, and now doing it again with overnight, line, line ron, hgr ron and hgr visits maint.
Next time you ask such a stupid question just because my post pissed you off, you might wanna think it thru. Your question was a jab to try and make AMFA look bad with it's new contract, when in fact, they just made you look stupid and the fact that you know nothing about what you talk about.
Reminder little Timmy, full retro, huge pay raises, more than full retro, ILC, no scope changes--none, natta-zilch-zero. Article 2 stayed as is.
2nd reminder, SWA has been contracting out the same % of maint. from day one there chief, and we don't believe in nego for future applicants who are not even here yet like your union is currently doing. Our union works on taking care of the employees here now. With the added maint jobs is how AMFA helps out future mechanics not here yet.
Of course we wanted the cash, it was due to us for retro pay. You try to make it sound as if we took the money for outsourcing and you are dead wrong. When you make your employees wait for nearly 7 years for pay raises, then that's when you get 75-80K retro checks. I know that sounds outrageous for "retroactive bonuses" but that is what the long waits totaled up to, and that's not our or AMFA's fault.
3rdly, while your sitting there trying to slam AMFA's contract, why is your union begging to get AMFA's deal or better??? Your moron colors are starting to show.

 

[Tim Nelson]

how many new amfa positions did the amfa gain or do they still allow most of maintenance to be contracted out?
Look, i get it that you guys want the cash, even thats better than the assoc. But having most work contracted out isnt the answer either.

So have you guys crossed 3,000 mechanics yet?
I know the teamsters are awful as well the association but thats no excuse to continue allowing much more outsourcing than my company. I aint mad at ya but going for the cash and retro couldda been reallocated into more scope. I think that, plus the botched strike at NW, and being outsmarted by the teamsters on a basic card filing has most american airline mechanics saying no thanks.
To be sure, i think amfa would be a great choice for them, especially since our mechanics are holding back fleet leverage.

 

[Buck]

huh?
Look, i hope amfa finally learns how to file cards and organize because nobody will be as happy as me if our mx vote in amfa.
Our mx is killing our negotiations as fleet service simply dont need them on our coattails. Your craft is simply dying.
Its the truth. I remember usair alone had 9000 mx. But globalism and having to compete with pedro making $2 hr had crushed your profession.

and I hope that whenever the next drive is that the TWU can defend itself without the company...

 

[Tim Nelson]

and I hope that whenever the next drive is that the TWU can defend itself without the company...

the twu is not for workers. Itis anti worker

 

[Eagle]

Keep it civil, please. No need for personal attacks.

 

[dfw gen]

man this thread turned south quick.....

 

[AANOTOK]

man this thread turned south quick.....

...yep, and we were doing so well once some vacancies were made available. We can do better...

What's the Judge timeline?

 

[swamt]

So have you guys crossed 3,000 mechanics yet?
I know the teamsters are awful as well the association but thats no excuse to continue allowing much more outsourcing than my company. I aint mad at ya but going for the cash and retro couldda been reallocated into more scope. I think that, plus the botched strike at NW, and being outsmarted by the teamsters on a basic card filing has most american airline mechanics saying no thanks.
To be sure, i think amfa would be a great choice for them, especially since our mechanics are holding back fleet leverage.

I guess we had some folks get a little out of line a bit.
No we have not crossed that 3K threshold as of yet. We are currently at 2500 plus.
You need to read my earlier post again. More work came to us with this new contract. Same thing happened with our last contract with AMFA. AMFA keeps bringing "IN" more work. Not outsourcing more. Once all the new hangars are completed in 4 cities even more work will come in to us.
Just ask all the X-AA mechs here now at SWA. They would tell you guys to bring AMFA in in a heartbeat as they have experienced them for a few contracts now here at SWA. The AA'ers really need to stop believing all the BS info that flies out of the industrial unions camps. Seek their own info. otherwise deal with what and who you got.

 

[Tim Nelson]

I guess we had some folks get a little out of line a bit.
No we have not crossed that 3K threshold as of yet. We are currently at 2500 plus.
You need to read my earlier post again. More work came to us with this new contract. Same thing happened with our last contract with AMFA. AMFA keeps bringing "IN" more work. Not outsourcing more. Once all the new hangars are completed in 4 cities even more work will come in to us.
Just ask all the X-AA mechs here now at SWA. They would tell you guys to bring AMFA in in a heartbeat as they have experienced them for a few contracts now here at SWA. The AA'ers really need to stop believing all the BS info that flies out of the industrial unions camps. Seek their own info. otherwise deal with what and who you got.

Here is your problem, unless a mx wants to have his own union, and his contract enforced, there wont be any other reason to switch to amfa since AA will have 14,000 mx while WN only 2,000.
AA will have much more scope + same or higher wages and benefits.
Before you get your panties in a wad, i think its smart for a mx to join amfa but the Association will get credit, and deservingly so, when it signs the industry leading contracts.

 

[1AA]

Here is your problem, unless a mx wants to have his own union, and his contract enforced, there wont be any other reason to switch to amfa since AA will have 14,000 mx while WN only 2,000.
AA will have much more scope + same or higher wages and benefits.
Before you get your panties in a wad, i think its smart for a mx to join amfa but the Association will get credit, and deservingly so, when it signs the industry leading contracts.

Our AMT'S will never get together on the same page and issues to get our own union. Its been tried over and over and now its virtually impossible since we have much more diversity among the association.
The problems or issues we have trying to organize a replacement union for title 1 and 2 are:
AA vs USAIR in both title 1 and 2. This one has many issues that the list is long.

Then we have stations pitted against each other for various reasons.

 

[Tim Nelson]

Our AMT'S will never get together on the same page and issues to get our own union. Its been tried over and over and now its virtually impossible since we have much more diversity among the association.
The problems or issues we have trying to organize a replacement union for title 1 and 2 are:
AA vs USAIR in both title 1 and 2. This one has many issues that the list is long.

Then we have stations pitted against each other for various reasons.

lus are extremely open to amfa if the iam knifes their medical. Sito and reagan told them a few weeks ago that they dont plan on giving up medical. Especially, clt.
I think amfa has a huge chance to win after a jcba.
The problem is that one of my good iam friends said that discussions between the twu and iam recognize this possibility so they may petition the nmb to extinguish the association and request twu for mx and fleet for iam. That would block any election for 2 years.

 

[Rogallo]

Let the members decide!

 

[V.O. Reason]

lus are extremely open to amfa if the iam knifes their medical. Sito and reagan told them a few weeks ago that they dont plan on giving up medical. Especially, clt.
I think amfa has a huge chance to win after a jcba.
The problem is that one of my good iam friends said that discussions between the twu and iam recognize this possibility so they may petition the nmb to extinguish the association and request twu for mx and fleet for iam. That would block any election for 2 years.

So by saying this because the IAM refuses to give up medical our chances of any agreement for at least two years are slim an none.
If that’s the case I’m pissed because going another possible 3 more years without a raise with the possibility of an economic turndown will hurt way more than paying higher medical
Morons all of them

 

[dfw gen]

lus are extremely open to amfa if the iam knifes their medical. Sito and reagan told them a few weeks ago that they dont plan on giving up medical. Especially, clt.
I think amfa has a huge chance to win after a jcba.
The problem is that one of my good iam friends said that discussions between the twu and iam recognize this possibility so they may petition the nmb to extinguish the association and request twu for mx and fleet for iam. That would block any election for 2 years.

thats not exactly the whole story, i believe that if the pull the old dues check off scheme again there is a 30 day window for an intervener to turn in cards.