American Airlines and Labor Negotiations

[NYer]

i don't know about this...

i don't believe you'd be sharing with the rank & file your personal opinion(s) that; lus insurance is a goner or palatable wage tables or the potential of one work group voting on a TA, while the other group has stalled in negotiations.

if you were a negotiator/head of airline division, sure, you could share your opinions with others of the same stature and try to formulate a negotiating strategy. maybe you would have objected to tieing the groups together; it seemed to have worked for vc, it may fall flat with scope.

i'm not trying to be argumentative, i was trying to understand what meat & potatoes the assoc. can share.

nonetheless, it's good to get others' opinions about the issues mentioned above. to me, the meat & potatoes are compensation & scope. you have talked about the cs policy and ot. you're entitled to give them importance...but, i don't rate those issues as being high on my list.

So in your view, I shouldn't share things as I do, but it is OK for others to share their views when they are opposite mine?

Nothing that has been shared is top secret stuff. It is all in the open if someone would want to look at the pieces and put them together.

Whether I share or don't share doesn't determine what will happen. What I share is just a reflection of what I think may happen. There's a difference.

And what do we say if things happen to play out as shared? So far it has. Shouldn't we be making decision based on all information and all possible scenarios? I think so.

 

[AANOTOK]

Nope...

He (like a lot of us) just decided to let the regular forum naysayers have at it back and fourth with each other in their own little semi-private universe...
This entire forum is the same negative hype, over and over again, day in day, out...
To make things easier, why don't you guys just copy and past the following at least 50 times a day per person...

Union = Corrupt + Officers = Corrupt -- Company Bankruptcies = Union's Fault + Association= No leverage + Negotiators = Stupid.

This would save thousands of words, and countless hours spent attempting to clandestinely transmit the same message subliminally!

>SPIT<

Got to admit >SPITMONT< your Bromance with W is undeniable and strong. You need to give me a “Winners” Mark just for mentioning him.

 

[CremaDiLimone]

@NYer

?? i'm not sure why you came to that conclusion.

i believe that if you were a twu negotiator or even head of the airline division, you would not share your opinions with the rank file about: lus insurance/palatable wages/potential of work groups voting separately on TAs. you have shared all that, and more, with us here.

this does not mean you can't have differing opinions nor you can't share them with us here.

otherwise, i appreciate your input/opinions. if anything, i would want you to comment more on compensation & scope issues.

 

[NYer]

@NYer

?? i'm not sure why you came to that conclusion.

i believe that if you were a twu negotiator or even head of the airline division, you would not share your opinions with the rank file about: lus insurance/palatable wages/potential of work groups voting separately on TAs. you have shared all that, and more, with us here.

this does not mean you can't have differing opinions nor you can't share them with us here.

otherwise, i appreciate your input/opinions. if anything, i would want you to comment more on compensation & scope issues.

You make an incorrect assumption. If that is where the circumstances lead us to then we should share it. My belief is that the frustration level is high because there is little understanding to the process, how we got to where we are and what to expect in the future. There is no reason that shared information shouldn't be shared it is something that we may all face and so we should all be aware.

What good comes from withholding anything that has been shared? At least we can have a conversation and debate and are able to make decisions based on all the available information. It would help us to maximize our returns, minimize our loses and to formulate our actions ahead of something happening. We can become proactive rather than reactive.

 

[AANOTOK]

You make an incorrect assumption. If that is where the circumstances lead us to then we should share it. My belief is that the frustration level is high because there is little understanding to the process, how we got to where we are and what to expect in the future. There is no reason that shared information shouldn't be shared it is something that we may all face and so we should all be aware.

What good comes from withholding anything that has been shared? At least we can have a conversation and debate and are able to make decisions based on all the available information. It would help us to maximize our returns, minimize our loses and to formulate our actions ahead of something happening. We can become proactive rather than reactive.

There seems to be a high level of frustration in regards to the lack of info on the equity and how it was handled. Do you believe that frustration is justified?

 

[NYer]

There seems to be a high level of frustration in regards to the lack of info on the equity and how it was handled. Do you believe that frustration is justified?

Absolutely, for the most part. That ball was dropped when it was released from the court proceedings, and the TWU wasn't ready to move ahead. They've acknowledged that.

That was another process that wasn't explained as well as it should have been, but that was also mired in internal politics.

 

[CremaDiLimone]

@NYer

- what incorrect assumption have i made? i'm not angry at the assoc. in regards to info about a contract. i don't feel as though i'm so special where i need to know what exact numbers (wages & scope) they are gunning for.

my assumption is that company is making us suffer to get what we want. i made an incorrect assumption about parker, taking him at his word. i place blame on the company for the lack of progress that would take us over the hill and on to a vote.

- i do feel that there would be no need to tip the company off as to what would satisfy you (as a negotiator, if you were a negotiator)/assoc. in regards to compensation & scope.

to me, bartering has replaced bargaining in the usa. the company knows this and is taking full advantage of it.

 

[NYer]

@NYer

- what incorrect assumption have i made? i'm not angry at the assoc. in regards to info about a contract. i don't feel as though i'm so special where i need to know what exact numbers (wages & scope) they are gunning for.

my assumption is that company is making us suffer to get what we want. i made an incorrect assumption about parker, taking him at his word. i place blame on the company for the lack of progress that would take us over the hill and on to a vote.

- i do feel that there would be no need to tip the company off as to what would satisfy you (as a negotiator, if you were a negotiator)/assoc. in regards to compensation & scope.

to me, bartering has replaced bargaining in the usa. the company knows this and is taking full advantage of it.

--That a title would somehow restrict my voice. I'd rather not have a title if that were the case.

--Negotiations is bartering, always will be. An incorrect assumption would be to believe that we would get 100% of what we want. The difficulty in the current negotiations is having so many groups trying to recover several years of losses in one negotiation. It takes time to go up and it takes time to go down, although down is much quicker.

--There is no tip-off of what it would take to get a yes, at the same time it does us no good to set an expectation for the Members that can't be fulfilled. We need to open and honest with what we can and cannot do. If we don't know how something will turn out then we should present it that way.

 

[Tim Nelson]

Yep <Snort> <Spit> he is in the cornfield.

he was put in the cornfield. I kind of miss him since he takes the devils advocate approach by advocating for the iam pension and Sito.

 

[AANOTOK]

Thanks mods, kids will be kids...

 

[cltrat]

It doesn’t say cornfield on his past posts which as been the case with other posters

 

[bob@las-AA]

As it is the weez is not in the cornfield, he now is a conscientious objector of his own free choice.

 

[ALUS78]

I'm guessing the weez is in the cornfield.

The moderator has to approve his posts so as an artist he refuses to post

 

[cltrat]

You’d think a couple others would be getting that treatment

 

[ALUS78]

You’d think a couple others would be getting that treatment

I love the Weez but things have been pretty civil since he left.