American Airlines and Labor Negotiations

[CremaDiLimone]

But it was a yes vote, how can that be?

they made the flight attendants vote twice.

the small stations voted 'yes' to protect their stations and aa closed them anyways. sean doyle would probably confirm that.

 

[Racer X]

The offer from the company does have a hint of trimming of the fat, and some would consider it concessionary, but I will tell yo this, it is a excellent deal and if enough pressure is applied on the association, the members of the TWU could start enjoying what the IAM has been enjoying ever since the merger was initiated.

Excellent deal?????? It’s not even close to being a good deal!

 

[Racer X]

With the DL raise, which get them getting closer to UA rates, it would be closer to .93 cents. (not counting premiums and differentials)

That is ONLY if Isom and Parker STILL say Delta plus 3%. Don’t forget all the other promises that fell by the wayside when delta or United’s wages increase

 

[Tim Nelson]

That is ONLY if Isom and Parker STILL say Delta plus 3%. Don’t forget all the other promises that fell by the wayside when delta or United’s wages increase

you saying that the next deal will be less?
Bob was right.
Parker can justify, his position, of offering less, by claiming oil at high prices werent projected. I dont trust our union and i hope mr baskett doesnt flip quickly and get us less. If so, i want him to make up the difference.

 

[Tim Nelson]

just gave some 170 work to envoy, in lga.

 

[B737 driver]

it varies. the permian field is break-even at $42 a barrel/$48 with exploration costs.

If it goes above $100, and your contract is not done, you guys will be going a long time to get something, or you will be eating a big turd sandwich!!

 

[Racer X]

Whatbim

you saying that the next deal will be less?
Bob was right.
Parker can justify, his position, of offering less, by claiming oil at high prices werent projected. I dont trust our union and i hope mr baskett doesnt flip quickly and get us less. If so, i want him to make up the difference.

I’m saying everytime Parker said Delta plus x% or United plus x% then Delta would give a raise and all of a sudden the Delta plus x% was reduced to a lower %. Then Parker said we can’t keep jumping these other airlines. We need to stay on par with them. Then we actually got United plus 1%.
Now they said Delta plus 3%. ( about 22 cents)
Then Delta gives raise. Now that 3% would be almost $1.20. Let’s see if that doesn’t change again.

 

[NYer]

here's what i don't understand.

some here are talking about oil prices at $70, putting downward pressure on our contract. this is the issue. some are clearly worried about it.

i bring up parker and co., who have claimed we will make money with oil above $100. parker also told analysts that the fares will catch up to the oil hike.

i bring up delta, a fiscally conservative airline...not obligated to give any raises and increase profit sharing. with oil a few dollars lower than what it hit today, dl decided to give the raises, increase PS and enhance the financials of it's ready reserve.


the rebuttal is that dl is majority non-union and can take the raises away. let dl do that a few times and their employees may organize. clearly, dl is not bothered by $70 oil.

to me, that is not a satisfactory rebuttal in addressing the oil fears and our contract.

It may not be satisfactory to you, but the worry isn't yourself. The worry is how those oil prices, or any other external force, would influence decision because of how the stockholders and the Mediator may feel about the issues faced. In Section 6, the comparisons aren't just the airlines, but all of corporate America.

We often perceive this to be management v. labor, when there are influences all around us but we choose to ignore them because it may hurt our position. We shouldn't ignore them because it is a barometer that can often signal when we may have reached our maximum return.

I'm sure we'll end up with "a fair joint contract."

 

[bob@las-AA]

they made the flight attendants vote twice.

the small stations voted 'yes' to protect their stations and aa closed them anyways. sean doyle would probably confirm that.

you saying that the next deal will be less?
Bob was right.
Parker can justify, his position, of offering less, by claiming oil at high prices werent projected. I dont trust our union and i hope mr baskett doesnt flip quickly and get us less. If so, i want him to make up the difference.

If it goes above $100, and your contract is not done, you guys will be going a long time to get something, or you will be eating a big turd sandwich!!

I don't believe it, it looks like some of us are starting to read from the same page, we all can, and should agree that THIS contract is like no other, spawned form a forced merger, in my opinion no one wanted, and to complicate things, in an environment with economic volatility and political instability over seas. Keeping with conventional thinking in always reject the first offer thinking the counter offer will get better may in this contract have a adverse effect.

 

[bob@las-AA]

It may not be satisfactory to you, but the worry isn't yourself. The worry is how those oil prices, or any other external force, would influence decision because of how the stockholders and the Mediator may feel about the issues faced. In Section 6, the comparisons aren't just the airlines, but all of corporate America.

We often perceive this to be management v. labor, when there are influences all around us but we choose to ignore them because it may hurt our position. We shouldn't ignore them because it is a barometer that can often signal when we may have reached our maximum return.

I'm sure we'll end up with "a fair joint contract."

Very well said.

 

[bob@las-AA]

The fact that fleet can not move forward because of MX pi$$es me off. The will have to come to see reality for what it is, outsourcing is here to stay and you can't have, for example, 10k mx to service 100 planes, what scene does that make.

 

[ATD]

Association sucks.
Fleet is using the maintenance scope to adjust their asking.
There should be separate negotiations with only the Healthcare being common .
I am not berating fleet, stores or any other group.
I am tired of this union using one group to benefit another.
With this leadership that is exactly what is happening.

 

[Racer X]

Association sucks.
Fleet is using the maintenance scope to adjust their asking.
There should be separate negotiations with only the Healthcare being common .
I am not berating fleet, stores or any other group.
I am tired of this union using one group to benefit another.
With this leadership that is exactly what is happening.

It’s called solidarity.

 

[bob@las-AA]

Association sucks.
Fleet is using the maintenance scope to adjust their asking.

How so.

 

[CremaDiLimone]

It may not be satisfactory to you, but the worry isn't yourself. The worry is how those oil prices, or any other external force, would influence decision because of how the stockholders and the Mediator may feel about the issues faced. In Section 6, the comparisons aren't just the airlines, but all of corporate America.

We often perceive this to be management v. labor, when there are influences all around us but we choose to ignore them because it may hurt our position. We shouldn't ignore them because it is a barometer that can often signal when we may have reached our maximum return.

I'm sure we'll end up with "a fair joint contract."

again..

dl also has shareholders. dl just gave most of it's employees a 3% raise and financially enhanced ready reserve.

again..

parker has stated the company will earn money with $100+ oil and that fares will catch up to oil prices.

again..

those EMPIRICAL examples don't count in the $70 oil/aa contract hypothesis...but, your hypotheticals count?

we all know that dl can take this or that away. that is your argument to aa $70 oil/assoc. contract? ok. to me, that is a flimsy argument that $70 oil will negatively impact our contract.

clearly, dl hasn't thought the recent 3% raise & associated expenses any kind of financial burden with $70 oil. if it did, it wouldn't have given out the raises.

as far as a mediator and $70 oil -

when aa whines to the mediator that southwest or dl only has x-amount of AMTs and does this much o/h outsourcing...watch our people tell the mediator what percentage of pre-tax profits southwest and dl pay profit sharing to their employees.

you've already dismissed that scenario, while you tell us the mediator will acknowledge that southwest & delta have fewer AMTs and outsource more.

in your mind, have you ever lost any semblance of a debate on this board?