American CFO Horton talks labor issues

[frontline]

And bankruptcy can happen in a matter of days, and probably would have were it not for the 2003 concessions. So your point is meaningless.

 

[Bob Owens]

And bankruptcy can happen in a matter of days, and probably would have were it not for the 2003 concessions. So your point is meaningless.

ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZzZzZzzzZzZ

Wake me when you have something intelligent or original to say.

 

[TWU informer]

And bankruptcy can happen in a matter of days, and probably would have were it not for the 2003 concessions. So your point is meaningless.

Fear Mongering Threats are no longer working.

Are you also a paid work horse for management to influence these forums?

 

[The Goose]

Fear Mongering Threats are no longer working.

Are you also a paid work horse for management to influence these forums?

From previous posts, I'd say this person is simply very afraid.

Flatline (named by Mr. Hackman) does carry the company line quite nicely but can't understand many of us are ready for the company to go the way of Eastern if they aren't willing to take proper care of their "greatest asset", as the company claims.

Most, even though much noise was being made, didn't expect an immediate return to pre-2003 pay and benefits but have little tolerance for the "F#%$ You!" attitude the company has displayed toward its "most valuable asset". That alone has triggered a severe degeneration in morale that may well be non-repairable at this point, even if Arpey and fellow frat-brats committed Hari Kari on the steps of Centrepork. I'd be happy to purchase a ticket to watch but I doubt if it would change my opinion of the company and Board of Directors.

Personally, I feel the employees were rather reasonable for longer than we should have been. As the morale sinks even further, I expect to see a softening of the "union" position but an all or nothing attitude taken by the membership regardless of what Little Jimmy and his band of fools tells the faithful. Don't bother with threats of a bankruptcy filing - just do it and get it over with. It's quite obvious that's what Horton has in mind.

I don't want any more warnings from these "roll over and pee on my belly" types. They are no more than scared little girls in my book. The "business-types" can go to hell also.

(Addition)

I see the TWU has formally asked for a release from negotiations according the the Star-Telegram. While I haven't a problem with that on the surface, it's probably what Horton wants. If the request is granted quickly, we'll know for sure.

I've always been taught that in a situation like this, it can cost the company much more than a reasonable settlement if the snubbed workers stay on the property rather than going on strike. Evidently, Little wants to help his friends while taking our dues money.

 

[Bob Owens]

From previous posts, I'd say this person is simply very afraid.


Personally, I feel the employees were rather reasonable for longer than we should have been. As the morale sinks even further, I expect to see a softening of the "union" position but an all or nothing attitude taken by the membership regardless of what Little Jimmy and his band of fools tells the faithful. Don't bother with threats of a bankruptcy filing - just do it and get it over with. It's quite obvious that's what Horton has in mind.

I don't want any more warnings from these "roll over and pee on my belly" types. They are no more than scared little girls in my book. The "business-types" can go to hell also.

(Addition)

I see the TWU has formally asked for a release from negotiations according the the Star-Telegram. While I haven't a problem with that on the surface, it's probably what Horton wants. If the request is granted quickly, we'll know for sure.

I've always been taught that in a situation like this, it can cost the company much more than a reasonable settlement if the snubbed workers stay on the property rather than going on strike. Evidently, Little wants to help his friends while taking our dues money.

Being released doesnt mean walking out on strike, but legally we can have sick outs, slowdowns, spot strikes and any other self help we want. The spectere of this will drive bookings away and put pressure on the company to settle even if we dont walk off the job. Sure the company can impose new wages but it wouldnt take much to set our guys off. I remember back in 1999 when they set us off, the effect was immediate and severe. The radio announced that "American Airlines is reporting weather related delays, please check with the carrier prior to going to the airport".All the other carriers were fine.

We are among the lowest paid already, what would Horton have to gain? I may still be broke but I'm ready to shut it down.

I dont know what Flatline fears, everyone that I know who left is doing better. If you look at our update on the local website its pretty easy to see why. I agree with TWU Informer's assessment.

 

[Hopeful]

The pro company pundits should encourage us being released. they should be ecstatic about having Walmart wages and work rules being forced on those who remain to stay.
They they can say "WE TOLD YOU SO."

I don't know why they post here defending the company when they should help us get released.

I am willing to let the chips fall where they may. I don't know why the pundits are not.

Maybe because that once either a contract is in place or bankruptcy, whichever happens, the pundits will be off AA's payroll and won't get paid anymore for posting here.

 

[WeAAsles]

I'm looking forward to being able to engage in self help finally. It's clear to me that this company doesn't believe we have any value and are just a liability at this point. Perhaps a few organized spot strikes can have the value they're looking for? Bob one question? Why did we TA the "Working Together" language? I think even the premise of that language in these negotiations is a farce. I don't want to see it being used to administer discipline in any BOI's or 29F hearings against our members?

 

[Bob Owens]

I'm looking forward to being able to engage in self help finally. It's clear to me that this company doesn't believe we have any value and are just a liability at this point. Perhaps a few organized spot strikes can have the value they're looking for? Bob one question? Why did we TA the "Working Together" language? I think even the premise of that language in these negotiations is a farce. I don't want to see it being used to administer discipline in any BOI's or 29F hearings against our members?

I dont sit in on the Joint, so I dont know why they accepted it. I suspect that we (M&R) will as well because Don V and Steve Luis are big fans of giving away productivity without any quid pro quo. Its called "taking the high road" and if we dont pass it Steve will threaten to take his ball and go home or Don will take a break, call the Lawyer and tell us to keep voting on it till we get it right. If either of them had read "Confessions of a Union Buster" they would know that such agreements are toxic. They never pay off for the workers.

This hasnt come up yet, but I know its coming and I cant really do anything about it, other than put it out here and hope that readers from other Locals make it clear to their representatives that they dont want it in there.

When I argued against putting all the crew chiefs on permanent probation and letting management select them through a panel like the TCCs I was told by Steve Luis that I'm "just a little Local" so my objections were given no weight.

 

[Boomer]

The International OWNS the contract, not the membership.

IMHO-This is all smoke and mirrors designed to shake up the weak/timid and prepare us for the deal they already made.

 

[FWAAA]

Being released doesnt mean walking out on strike, but legally we can have sick outs, slowdowns, spot strikes and any other self help we want. The spectere of this will drive bookings away and put pressure on the company to settle even if we dont walk off the job.

What do you mean it will "drive bookings away?" Make up your mind, Bob. Just a couple weeks ago you posted that eolesen had no choice but to fly AA because all the flights on all airlines were so full. And now you claim that passengers actually have a choice and can fly other airlines? Not the consistency we've come to expect.

It will "put pressure on the company to settle?" Think again. Current bookings aren't profitable - so how will threatening to disrupt loss-making bookings put pressure on the company? As has been posted before, threatening to disrupt profitable flights might get their attention.

 

[Hopeful]

Right now,I doubt very much the flying public, let alone AA's customers, have a clue what is going on. It is now just making the media reports because of the release requests. If and when the release comes, It will get more attention that there might be need to be worried about a strike.

Right now, it's bookings as usual.

 

[star power]

AA is looking to downsize to profitability, because what been happening in flying is not working.

They may be looking for ZW, EV, RP, 9L, OH, XE, QX, YV, XJ, OO, S5, G7, CP, YX, L3, MW, G4, F8, and 9E to fly the unprofitable flights. All MD80's, B752, B762, B763.

Only the B738's and B772's may be flying on the profitable flights. which ones, HUMmmmm.

JFK-LHR, BOS-LHR, MIA-LHR, ORD-LHR ,DFW-LHR, LAX-LHR. B772'S

JFK-NRT, ORD-NRT, DFW-NRT, LAX-NRT. B772'S

B738's MIA and DFW to Ct. america, N. S america, S america, deep S america. The S america and deep S america will be milk runs. The B738's may not have the ranges.

All Dom. flights to the regionals carriers.

 

[Bob Owens]

What do you mean it will "drive bookings away?" Make up your mind, Bob. Just a couple weeks ago you posted that eolesen had no choice but to fly AA because all the flights on all airlines were so full. And now you claim that passengers actually have a choice and can fly other airlines? Not the consistency we've come to expect.

It will "put pressure on the company to settle?" Think again. Current bookings aren't profitable - so how will threatening to disrupt loss-making bookings put pressure on the company? As has been posted before, threatening to disrupt profitable flights might get their attention.

Flying is not always the only option.

Current bookings arent profitable? Really, so they are losing money everywhere? Keep fishing and spinning FWAAA.

 

[FWAAA]

Flying is not always the only option.

Very true. Premium long-haul international passengers could always charter a boat.

Current bookings arent profitable? Really, so they are losing money everywhere? Keep fishing and spinning FWAAA.

If you'd respond to what I wrote instead of what you think I wrote . . . AMR is expected to report a sizable net loss in the first quarter, so yes, on the whole, current bookings are not profitable. I'm certain that there are some bookings that are profitable, but too many are not.

Keep Fabricating, Bob. It's worked out so well for you thus far.

 

[Bob Owens]

Very true. Premium long-haul international passengers could always charter a boat.

Or they could stay home and not spend their money, like big business is doing.

If you'd respond to what I wrote instead of what you think I wrote . . .

Hmm, how else would you expect someone to respond to what you wrote other than what they think you wrote?

AMR is expected to report a sizable net loss in the first quarter, so yes, on the whole, current bookings are not profitable. I'm certain that there are some bookings that are profitable, but too many are not.

Would you expect them to report anything but a loss with all their labor groups asking to be released? They would burn the money at this point before they would report a profit.

Keep Fabricating, Bob. It's worked out so well for you thus far.

Hmm, a guy who posts here under a ficticious pseudonym of FWAAA is accusing me of fabrication. I'm I the only one who finds this just a tad hypocritical?

Certianly you are well aware that even if AA is losing money operating they would lose even more if they stopped operating due to a strike. Rents, leases, loans etc all still have to be paid but revenue would stop coming in. Posted profits and losses really dont mean much, if they did this industry would have collapsed years ago. People like you would have to settle for the cattle car indignity of SWA or Jet Blue, or hire a charter, but you're probably not quite in that class yet.The airlines drive the economy and if you control an airline you can steer the revenue that airline generates to someplace where you can safely report your profits.