Atsb Plan

[mastermechanic]

[blockquote]
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On 11/17/2002 7:41:48 PM wts54 wrote:

Maybe the layoffs are coming from management not mechanics
did anuone think of that?Wishing for all the layoffs from the people
who actually do the labor at UAL you might be in for a suprise.
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[/blockquote]
Talked to some of the union guys off the record of course over in Burlingame...they felt about 1250 mechanics layed off in this round, but who knows....the IAM sure isn't talking

 

[UAL777flyer]

Also, rumor is that 12% of management/salaried employees will be cut as part of the 9,000.

 

[UAL777flyer]

wts54,

You need a lot more than your short list to effectively run an airline. Who is going to build your flight schedule? Who will do the economic analysis to determine what markets you serve, with what types of aircraft, with how many frequencies, while adhering to all established operational and maintenance schedule criteria? Who is going to schedule pilots and flight attendants and ensure that each flight United operates has the legal compliment of crewmembers? Who is going to make changes as necessitated by sick calls, late arriving crews, etc? Who will manage your inventory and pricing? Who is going to dispatch each flight under the required FAA and UA specs? Who is going to advertise and promote our product? Who is going to come up with new product enhancements to keep us competitive in the markets we serve? The list goes on and on and on. There are many, many departments that perform vital functions for this airline that get largely overlooked. I grant you that the list of 5 you provided are vital. No denying that. But there are plenty of other vital departments at this airline. Was your point to highlight that everything beyond your list was outsource-able?

 

[wts54]

My point is that is a starting point after we keep
everybody absolutely vital to UAL's survival.Start turning
a profit and add back rationally to the manpower roster even
if that means after 13 years my butt is out the door.UAL
was in existence before any of us showed up here,and I want
it to be flying long after were gone.I realize you need more
than the five things I mentioned.
And for Eagle I wouldnt want you to think I was being
hard on management because since I have been here I have
seen wonderful people from all areas who are good leaders.

 

[mastermechanic]

[blockquote]
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On 11/18/2002 931 AM UAL777flyer wrote:

wts54,

You need a lot more than your short list to effectively run an airline. Who is going to build your flight schedule? Who will do the economic analysis to determine what markets you serve, with what types of aircraft, with how many frequencies, while adhering to all established operational and maintenance schedule criteria? Who is going to schedule pilots and flight attendants and ensure that each flight United operates has the legal compliment of crewmembers? Who is going to make changes as necessitated by sick calls, late arriving crews, etc? Who will manage your inventory and pricing? Who is going to dispatch each flight under the required FAA and UA specs? Who is going to advertise and promote our product? Who is going to come up with new product enhancements to keep us competitive in the markets we serve? The list goes on and on and on. There are many, many departments that perform vital functions for this airline that get largely overlooked. I grant you that the list of 5 you provided are vital. No denying that. But there are plenty of other vital departments at this airline. Was your point to highlight that everything beyond your list was outsource-able?
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[/blockquote]
And look how wonderfully we have done, why we're just winning everywhere

 

[UAL777flyer]

mastermechanic,

Do you honestly think those folks I mentioned are responsible for our problems? They're no more to blame than you are. The senior leaders (or lack thereof) of this company are the ones who made the lousy decisions that hurt this airline. They're the ones who failed to lead and motivate the workforce. That had more to do with our failings than anything else. The groups I listed are worker bees just like you are. If you honestly think this airline can operate without them, than you know less about how an airline truly functions than I thought.

 

[novaqt]

Below is a story from Drudge Report. See www.drudgereport.com. It certainly appears that AMR's Texas influence is trying to severely weaken our Star Alliance and increase the power and influence of the One World. I believe Mr. Tilton so far has done a superb job so far of restructuring our beloved airline. However, I hope beyond hope he has the political power and connections up on the Hill and in the backdoor of the Administration to get this loan approved and stave off Chap 11 filing.


Administration Insiders Believe Feds Will Reject UNITED AIRLINES Loan Application
Mon Nov 18 2002 10:01:51 ET

UAL Corp., parent of United Airlines, is fighting an uphill battle to get a $1.8 billion federal loan guarantee that the airline says is essential if it is to avoid filing for protection of the bankruptcy courts before the end of the year, the WALL STREET JOURNAL reported on Monday.

The staff of the Air Transportation Stabilization Board is scrutinizing the company's business plan skeptically, and the betting among Bush administration insiders familiar with the board's thinking is that the board, which has three voting members, eventually will reject the application or set conditions so onerous that UAL will reject them.

MORE The board, however, has yet to make even a tentative decision, the JOURNAL claims.

UAL had hoped to get the green light for the loan guarantee soon so it could raise $2 billion in fresh capital and stay out of bankruptcy court. But the company is burning through more than $7 million in cash a day, and it faces a $375 million debt repayment on Dec. 2. United said in a recent federal filing that without the loan guarantee, and the cost reductions that it has to make to get the guarantee, it doesn't expect to be able to have sufficient liquidity to support its obligations through year end.

It recently succeeded in postponing $500 million in additional debt coming due in the next few weeks.

Developing...

 

[mastermechanic]

[blockquote]
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On 11/18/2002 11:46:13 AM UAL777flyer wrote:

mastermechanic,

Do you honestly think those folks I mentioned are responsible for our problems? They're no more to blame than you are. The senior leaders (or lack thereof) of this company are the ones who made the lousy decisions that hurt this airline. They're the ones who failed to lead and motivate the workforce. That had more to do with our failings than anything else. The groups I listed are worker bees just like you are. If you honestly think this airline can operate without them, than you know less about how an airline truly functions than I thought.
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[/blockquote]
I think we're getting somewhere 777flyer. You are right, I don't know jack about airline operations such as you speak of. I depend on people like you and our senior management to do that side of the equation. But as I have said repeatedly, without the planes, the pilots don't get their pot of gold, nor does anyone have anything to do. You must have at least one aircraft to have an operation don't you, and that is my job. I was awakend at 7am this morning by two engineers and a office full of guys like you asking me how to fix their airplane. I must know something about my end of the equation. And the mechanics are fed up with the company, and this cancer called the IAM.

 

[sastal]

Sounds as though you are either in scheduling, marketing/sales, or accounting, although you sound too chatty to be in the latter department. Am I right?

 

[UAL777flyer]

mastermechanic,

We agree on more than you think. I'd be the first person to tell you that fixing and maintaining aircraft is a vital role at this airline. But those people who think that a group of only 3-5 areas are what's important at keeping this airline going are only deluding themselves. I'd be willing to bet that most of the people who say that don't have the first clue about some of the other vital departments at this company and the work that gets performed each day.

 

[Taipan]

American Airlines launched a simplified fare structure in a small number of markets last week, lowering the price of tickets bought at the last minute by as much as 40 percent. The apparent goal is to steer business travelers away from rock-bottom, advance-purchase fares that have become popular during the economic downturn

Looks like AA beat us to the punch on this, if I were Mr Tilton I would not let this go unanswered.

 

[UAL777flyer]

Taipan,

They haven't beaten us to the punch. You're just not hearing about any of the fare tests that we're doing these days. Some of what we're doing is showing promise, which is encouraging. But more testing needs to be done before it gets rolled out into many more markets. But you can rest assured that the Pricing folks are working long and hard at formulating and testing new strategies that can help us get out of this mess.

 

[UnitedChicago]

On a different topic of sorts...

Anyone think there would be a collections of companies (Star partners, Boeing, Airbus, GE, etc.) that would step in to gaurentee loans for UA should the ATSB reject UA's application?

May seem far fetched...but worth considering. UA is already in talks with Boeing to cover the $200 million not secured by the ATSB loan application.