Bundy. why no interest?

[EastUS1]

An injury to one is an injury to ALL.

 
Exactly!

 

[AdAstraPerAspera]

It's not his land to begin with; it belongs to the taxpayers of the United States, of which he is apparently not one!

 

[EastUS1]

It's not his land to begin with; it belongs to the taxpayers of the United States, of which he is apparently not one!

 
Fine. As a taxpayer of the United States: I'd just love to see the figure for money spent by the government there to accomplish....umm....what was it exactly?...And just how have we concerned taxpayers gained at ALL by ANY of this violent insanity? Note to self: How wryly amusing it is that the "Left" isn't loudly screaming to at least get PETA involved here. Just imagine all the "concerned" howling if the following had been perpetrated by any from the "Right"....
 
https://www.google.com/search?q=pics+of+dead+bundy+cattle&client=firefox-a&hs=Tku&rls=org.mozilla:en-US😱fficial&channel=sb&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ei=cFpcU-jTCam-sQS1u4DwDg&ved=0CCcQsAQ&biw=1920&bih=926&dpr=1#facrc=_&imgdii=_&imgrc=ikKhpweNPfcQnM%253A%3B0mxU2SInKxGOgM%3Bhttp%253A%252F%252Fstatic.infowars.com%252Fbindnfocom%252F2014%252F04%252FcattleslaughterBundy.jpg%3Bhttp%253A%252F%252Fwww.infowars.com%252Fbundy-family-uncovers-suspected-blm-cattle-grave%252F%3B640%3B494

 

[Ms Tree]

 
So grazing some cattle on frikkin' desert land's nowadays worth risking the lives of many people...I see...Sigh!
 
"As for the threat of violence, he did declare a range war..." How can any individual citizen supposedly "declare" any "war"? What constitutes a "war"? Do you even know? "...and he did have numerous people on his land who were armed with rifles and other weapons." This might well astonish you, but many millions of Americans are "armed with rifles and other weapons." Does that of it's self make them a body that's threatening anyone? "The BLM acted accordingly." Indeed?...So spending who-knows-how-many-dollars for killing some cattle, while leaving fresh calves to starve unattended, smashing down at least one nest of the sacred tortoises supposedly "protected", tasing people, threatening them with dogs, surrounding an area with armed thugs with automatic weapons, armored vehicles and even snipers, qualifies as having "acted accordingly" for you?...Over some cattle grazing in violation of a court order ? You're insane...Period.

 

Did not have to be.  Bundy threatened a range war and had armed persons there to defend his right to steal from the Fed.
 

 
I would take that threat pretty seriously. 
 
He has failed to abide by court orders.  Refused to comply with law enforcement.  Engaged in armed resistance.  Asking nicely did not work so the BLM brought in force.  Would you like them to come with a few hand guns to make it a fair fight?  I was not aware criminals should be treated with kid gloves.  You are supporting the armed resistance of criminal and the use of arms to prevent the BLM from carrying out a lawful order from a US court.  And I'm the insane one.  Lol

 

[EastUS1]

 
..... Bundy threatened a range war and had armed persons there to defend his right to steal from the Fed.
 
 Engaged in armed resistance....................And I'm the insane one.  Lol

 
"Engaged in armed resistance..."? So what federal people were at all injured in any way, and do you even pretend to understand the term "armed resistance" at all better than you do "war"? Here's a small hint: Both generally result in people being killed, most especially war. "And I'm the insane one. Lol"..? Yep, and proven more so by each posting you make here.
 
"I was not aware criminals should be treated with kid gloves." Who's been in any way harmed by your supposed "criminals" in this case? Additionally; what was at all accomplished by the whole fiasco? Did Bundy pay up? Is he in jail? Did even his surviving cattle stay in the possession of the government? Sigh! How about at least some mercy for innocent cattle, or would even that be far too much to ask for? 😉
 
"I would take that threat pretty seriously." Some people would take the "threat" of their own shadow "pretty seriously"....but mounting a major expedition of force, when just turning a bit more towards the sunlight would serve, isn't at all a rational countermeasure to such fears.
 
"Asking nicely did not work so the BLM brought in force."...? Since you've apparently some grand expertise in this case, and especially in determining just when potentially deadly force should be mounted; would you be kind enough to delineate just how the courts and all possible legal avenues of "Asking nicely", placing liens, etc, were completely exhausted, before the automatic weapon armed thugs were sent in?

 

[Ms Tree]

Shots do not need to be fired for armed resistance.  They are heavily armed and refusing abide by the court order.  Not sure how else to define this.  Bundy does not recognize the Federal Government.  He is of the belief that the County Sheriff is the highest law enforcement in the US.  He believes he is a sovereign citizen. 
 
Bundy is a thief.  He has used public lands without paying user fees like every other rancher.  He has threatened violence to any federal officer who tried to arrest him.  And you support this nut job.  That speaks for it's self.
 
I have more concern and respect for a cat turd than I do for your opinion of me.

 

[Glenn Quagmire]

Say this were taking place in inner city Detroit. The armed ones were all crips and bloods refusing to give up the public housing project they were getting evicted from, would you be here defending them?

What kind of force would you be advocating?

Would you be defending them as you are the welfare cowboy?

 

[EastUS1]

Say this were taking place in inner city Detroit. The armed ones were all crips and bloods refusing to give up the public housing project they were getting evicted from, would you be here defending them?

What kind of force would you be advocating?

Would you be defending them as you are the welfare cowboy?

 
I'm not at all defending Bundy, but simply advancing the observation that government actions there were insanely inappropriate and accomplished nothing, save to kill some cows.  You raise an interesting question though. Is it your opinion that your theoretical people in Detroit should be killed over a property dispute with the government, through the use of snipers, armored vehicles, dogs, etc? What truly IS the value you "Left" lunatics place on human or any other life? I'm seriously wondering about that lately....

 

[EastUS1]

I have more concern and respect for a cat turd.....

 
That would go some distance towards explaining your mindless love for those currently in government, and political leanings and chosen candidates as well. Since you apparently hold even cat feces in reverent awe; why have you no concern for needlessly killed cattle?...Unarmed women being tackled by armed thugs?...People being tased and threatened with attack dogs, while offering no threat?...The very real threat however, of people being insanely killed over essentially nothing of dire consequence?...Or is all of that just fine, so long as they disagree with your personal politics?

 

[Ms Tree]

 
That would go some distance towards explaining your mindless love for those currently in government, and political leanings and chosen candidates as well. Since you apparently hold even cat feces in reverent awe; why have you no concern for needlessly killed cattle?...Unarmed women being tackled by armed thugs?...People being tased and threatened with attack dogs, while offering no threat?...The very real threat however, of people being insanely killed over essentially nothing of dire consequence?...Or is all of that just fine, so long as they disagree with your personal politics?

The people were interfering with Federal officers doing their job.  They should be in jail.  There was a mob mentality that could very easily have escalated.  Bundy and his crew want to escalate then any blood is on their hands.

 

[Glenn Quagmire]

Great twitter post:

@wkamaubell
#ClivenBundy, I see your racism and I raise you one #DonaldSterling, a racist who actually owns black guys. #RacistPoker
9:13 AM - 26 Apr 2014

 

[EastUS1]

There was a mob mentality that could very easily have escalated.

 
And here you had earlier posted bizarre justifications about supposed "armed resistance" and even "war"...? Now it's merely something that "could very easily have escalated"? Perhaps you first should work on making up what "mind" you can summon to the task here. Have a fine evening.

 

[Ms Tree]

 
And here you had earlier posted about supposed "armed resistance" and even threatened "war"...? Now it's merely soemthing that "could very easily have escalated"? Perhaps you should work on making up what "mind" you can summon to the task.

The mob was a separate incident.  Nice try though.

 

[EastUS1]

The people were interfering with Federal officers doing their job.  They should be in jail.  There was a mob mentality that could very easily have escalated.  Bundy and his crew want to escalate then any blood is on their hands.

 
Well, let's examine some historical fallout from "officers doing their job", that should apparently, NEVER dare be at all even questioned...? "They should be in jail."...?
 
"1942:U.S. government places in barbed wire encircled "relocation camps" some 110,000 Japanese Americans. Guards are ordered to shoot anyone seeking to leave."
 
"1967:Sparked by a police raid on a black power hangout, Detroit erupts into the worst race riots ever in the nation, with 43 people dead, including 33 African Americans and 10 whites. During the nine months of the year, 164 other racial disturbances are reported across the country, including major riots in Tampa, Cincinnati, Atlanta, Newark, Plainfield and Brunswick, New Jersey, which kill at least 83 people."  Was that a good result in your estimation?
 
"1969: A June 27 police raid on the Stonewall Inn, a Greenwich Village bar catering to homosexuals, results in two nights of rioting and is the symbolic beginning of the gay rights movement. The event is commemorated each year by Gay Pride demonstrations across the nation."
 
"1973:May 9, a 71-day siege by a force of more than 1,000 FBI agents, U.S. Marshals, Bureau of Indian Affairs (BIA) police and U.S. military advisers is ended at the symbolically important hamlet of Wounded Knee at Oglala Sioux reservation in South Dakota. The village was occupied by the American Indian Movement (AIM) in an effort to spur talks with the U.S. government on violated treaty rights, BIA abuses on the reservation and civil rights concerns of Native Americans. Federal agents surrounded the town claiming that the Indians were holding "hostages" from the white trading post in the hamlet and demanded the surrender of all those occupying the village. During the siege, two AIM supporters are killed in firefights." Were those two deaths fully acceptable to you?
 
http://www.civilrights.org/resources/civilrights101/chronology.html
 
Consider also aspects of the Waco nightmare. "The Waco siege ended with a blaze that killed 76 people including two pregnant women and over 20 children." http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/world-news/waco-siege-20-years-on-1838748 I can't see that as an ending much acceptable, or to EVER be wished for by anyone, and the use of serious force should ALWAYS be both kept to a minimum and even then, only employed as a very last resort. It's been my experience that people, once killed...tend to stay dead for a very long time, and no "justifications" or coulda', woulda', shoulda' much help after the fact.

 

[Ms Tree]

Were the actions taken in NV illegal?

How about we look at this incident?

1973

■ Cliven Bundy pays grazing fees to the BLM for the next 20 years.

1993

■ The BLM modifies Bundys grazing permit by reducing the size allowed for his herd to 150 and restricts where his cattle can graze in the Gold Butte area. He refuses the permit and stops paying grazing fees. The BLM cancels his permit.

1994

■ The BLM issues an order requiring Bundy to remove his cattle.

1995

■ The BLM issues another order requiring Bundy to remove his cattle.

1996

■ Nevada Legislature and voters, seeking to take control of federal land in the state, repeal the so-called Disclaimer Clause of the states 1864 constitution that had declared people in the territory disclaim all right and title to the unappropriated public lands.

1998

■ U.S. District Court of Nevada issues an order to stop Bundy from grazing cattle on the Bunkerville allotment.

1999

■ The 9th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals upholds the District Courts permanent injunction.

2000

■ Cliven Bundy, whose grandparents, Abraham and Ella Bundy, settled in the Parashant area in 1877 near Mount Trumbull on the Arizona strip, voices concern for President Bill Clinton establishing Grand Canyon-Parashant National Monument. He says its a land grab, telling the Review-Journal, The terrible thing about it is there is private property, customs and lifestyles at stake.

2008

■ The Interior Board of Land Appeals hears Bundys appeal of the BLMs cancellation of his range improvement authorizations and affirms the BLMs decision.

2011

■ The BLM sends a cease-and-desist order to Bundy and a notice of intent to gather his cattle.

2012

■ The BLM conducts aerial surveys of the Gold Butte area and prepares to round up 500 to 900 cattle but suspends the operation indefinitely in April 2012 out of safety concerns for people involved with the roundup.

2013

■ The U.S. District Court of Nevada in July orders Bundy to remove his cattle from public land within 45 days and says the U.S. can seize and impound any remaining cattle.

■ The court reaffirms in October that Bundy has no legal right to graze the federal land and, again, directs him to remove his cattle within 45 days, ordering Bundy not to interfere with an impoundment action.

2014

■ The BLM issued a Notice of Intent to Impound Unauthorized Livestock grazing on BLM and National Park Service lands on March 19.

■ The roundup begins April 5.

■ More than 300 cattle that had been rounded up and held in a corral are released April 12. The operation is canceled by the BLM out of safety concerns for employees. To avoid violence and restore order at the scene, officials in charge of the roundup decide not to stop the demonstrators release of the cattle.