Delta loads new DAL flights

[FrugalFlyerv2.0]

As long as DAL is open, there is no legal or moral basis for arguing that WN should be allowed access but other carriers cannot.

 
I won't speak here about legal and moral basis.  However, I will point out that over the years, no other carriers except UA and AA, off and on throughout the years, have shown any interest in access at DAL.  Certainly not DL.

 

[FrugalFlyerv2.0]

...All I asked was, what traffic DL will pull from DAL that they can't get from DFW and you go to deflecting as usual....

 
Its highly likely you won't get an answer to your question. 
You will get a reply, but not an answer.

 

[WorldTraveler]

WN COULD fly to DFW just like DL could fly to DAL... wait DL already does.
 
So where does WN regardless if the DOJ supports them or not find legal or moral basis for saying they should dominate an airport because they don't want to compete at the airport that everyone else moved to but now WN wants to have it all to themselves.
 
Fine.  Let them pay for that airport that other carriers can't serve or not be allowed to land at other airports where carriers can't also serve DAL from the other direction.
 
This won't go away.
 
You can add this to the WN invasion of ATL that has turned into a full scale retreat, the refinery failure, and the denial of AA's financial issues - things I said all along but the crowd here denied.
 
I'm glad it is so well documented on here... but you will all still deny I was right.

 

[swamt]

Actually LD3, Delta was going to fly the same routes as they do from DFW, maybe there was one or two added routes, but most all that they listed were not newly added markets out of the N.Tx. market.  I also believe that VX was doing the same routs they already fly out of DFW therefore once again no newly added markets which I believe was one of the items the DOJ wanted to see or was requiring as part of the awarding of the gates.  Plain and simple, SWA will bring the most flights, the best competition, lowest fares, best economic results for the city of Dallas as well as the airport and it's concessions within the airport.  SWA will also be the best choice to help keep the N. Tx. air fares competitive.

 

[WorldTraveler]

DL doesn't fly LAX from DFW so it would be new service...and it still doesn't matter what DL flies.
 
The US government is not permitted under the airline deregulation act to select carriers or influence pricing on domestic markets.
 
This isn't a route case.  It is about access to a federally funded airport.
 
The vestiges of the WA will be overturned and there will be requirements for WN to give up gates or face limitations on what it can serve from DAL if other carriers are not provided access.
 
Count on it.
 
WN took decades to get the freedom to fly DAL to the entire US... the process will be a whole lot faster for it to be overturned.
 
WN has a revenue PREMIUM or has equivalent fares in markets they serve from DAL that are duplicated by AA at DFW.  WN is not a driver of low fares. 

 

[swamt]

SWA has NEVER said they want to dominate an airport nor have they ever said they don't want any other airlines there,  nice try WT.
 
Tell you what WT.  Now that Delta is out of the equation for the LF gates are you going to agree and tell me I was right from the very get go?  When you pony up, then I will.  However, once again your prediction in 2005 came after my very well documented 2003 prediction, therefore how can you take the credit for something someone else predicted.  Now you could say, Yea I too agree with what SWAMT predicted in 2003, but please don't try and sit here at put it out that it was all you that started it all, I won't sit here and let you do it.  Matter fact I believe Kev was sometimes part of those conversations, as sometimes I believe we were in disagreement with each other at times.  I do know it was during the big AMFA drive at AA and we were hearing AMFA was trying to get in at Delta (for mechanics).  It's been over 10 years ago but I do remember it because it was a very passionate time during the AA/TWU concessions trains running over the membership at AA...

 

[LD3]

 

Actually LD3, Delta was going to fly the same routes as they do from DFW, maybe there was one or two added routes, but most all that they listed were not newly added markets out of the N.Tx. market.  I also believe that VX was doing the same routs they already fly out of DFW therefore once again no newly added markets which I believe was one of the items the DOJ wanted to see or was requiring as part of the awarding of the gates.  Plain and simple, SWA will bring the most flights, the best competition, lowest fares, best economic results for the city of Dallas as well as the airport and it's concessions within the airport.  SWA will also be the best choice to help keep the N. Tx. air fares competitive.

 
Thanks, and I was cracking wise about SW in DFW....

 

[WorldTraveler]

SWA has NEVER said they want to dominate an airport nor have they ever said they don't want any other airlines there,  nice try WT.
 
Tell you what WT.  Now that Delta is out of the equation for the LF gates are you going to agree and tell me I was right from the very get go?  When you pony up, then I will.  However, once again your prediction in 2005 came after my very well documented 2003 prediction, therefore how can you take the credit for something someone else predicted.  Now you could say, Yea I too agree with what SWAMT predicted in 2003, but please don't try and sit here at put it out that it was all you that started it all, I won't sit here and let you do it.  Matter fact I believe Kev was sometimes part of those conversations, as sometimes I believe we were in disagreement with each other at times.  I do know it was during the big AMFA drive at AA and we were hearing AMFA was trying to get in at Delta (for mechanics).  It's been over 10 years ago but I do remember it because it was a very passionate time during the AA/TWU concessions trains running over the membership at AA...

if you and WN don't get that controlling 90% of the gates at any airport is DOMINATION then you won't get it... but Congress and the courts will get it.
 
Enjoy it while you have it.  It will end. 
 
glad you predicted a BK filing in 2003... since AA walked up to the courthouse steps to demand concessions, it wasn't a great prediction they were going to file.
 
It took little time to demonstrate the 2003 filing did what was needed.
 
Pull up a few posts about how you have documented AA's financial woes... I don't recall you having demonstrated much involvement or understanding of their issues....

 

[eolesen]

Pull up a few posts about how you have documented AA's financial woes... I don't recall you having demonstrated much involvement or understanding of their issues....

Stalking others to try and win, eh?...

You trying to "win" over your predictions reminds me of long-gone poster TWA007... he was always so proud when his stock predictions came true...

Anyone could have predicted that AA would file for bankruptcy eventually (especially when oil hit $100/bbl), but how much of the specifics did you get correct? I'd predicted in December 2007 that they'd go file for bankruptcy with a huge cash balance ($7B) in order to avoid the hassles of DIP financing, and also in mid-2007 that they'd go in with their labor contracts unresolved, and 2009, that whatever AA had proposed as a contract opener was likely to be imposed following an abrogation.

 

[WorldTraveler]

you accusing someone else of stalking?  now that is truly rich.
 
What you post on this site under your own name is hardly called stalking.
 
I have no idea who TWA007 was nor do I care nor do I make any connections to you or me.
 
I said for years that AA was losing buckets of money flying to Asia and that its domestic yield was falling relative to other carriers but you defended them.
 
It's not just about AA, though.  You were one of the most vocal in arguing of the damage that WN would do to DL in ATL (perhaps that is why you are so desirous of arguing that AA won't be affected by WN in N. Texas and that DL will be locked out?)
 
I don't really care who writes what... but when you or anyone - including me - makes statements that clearly turn out to be proven wrong in reality, then the difference between what two people say is apparent.
 
swamt can argue for the benefit of what WN will achieve at DAL as much as he wants.  I have never told Kev to stop believing in his dream to see more unions at DL.  I have never told you to stop defending AA.
 
But I will stand by that the situation that WN is building at DAL is unlike what exists at any other airport in the US and the DOJ's actions will be challenged if there is even half of the value to DAL which WN and DL believe there is.
 
You cannot expect for other carriers including DL to accept being locked out of a market based on some "local" preference laws that affect interstate commerce. 
 
Either DAL has value to the entire US and it will be accessible by any carrier that wants to serve it - which exists even for slot controlled airports - or there will be processes implemented to pry it open, including potentially stripping WN of gates if necessary to ensure a level playing field.

 

[eolesen]

Hey, you're the one who thought it would be fun to look up who you thought my boss was, name him here on the site, and say you were emailing him. And you you've gone so far as to name the county to file your fictitious anti-stalking lawsuit.

None of that information was ever posted here, Reverend. You chose to unstuff the pillow, you can live with the consequences.

Did he ever respond to your email, btw? The French have very strict laws about responding to harassment.

 

[WorldTraveler]

now you know what I have put up from you for years on this site...
 
you can thank someone on here who intervened and talked me out of it.  You don't know how close I was.  I have all the information at my fingertips now. 
 
BTW, winning is playing by the rules so that everyone can participate which is precisely why I have had such a beef about WN and DAL.... it is about dominating the market and cutting others out.
 
that is NOT WINNING.

 

[swamt]

SWA is not the one restricting anyone WT.  Get a clue man.  It is the DOJ as far as the 2 gates, and it is the 5 parties involved in the W/A repeal agreement that made the restrictions as far as number of gates, non international flights ect...  Why do you constantly blame SWA for the restrictions brought forth?  WHY.  SWA is simply applying for the 2 gates that AA has to divest at LF in order to fill the request of the DOJ.  It's not SWA forcing all this crap at LF it is in fact the DOJ.  You keep trying to blame SWA for the restraints at LF and it is not SWA's fault.  And as far as your actuations that SWA will have to give up gates in some sort of future law suit from Delta that were wronged is completely false and inaccurate.  As long as all the participants bidding for the 2 gates at LF follow the DOJ's requirements and win the gates, which will be awarded by the city of Dallas, and then approved by the DOJ as long as all requirements set forth by the DOJ are followed then there is no grounds for a lawsuit and therefore Delta will be wasting their money and time trying to find a crack to get back in at LF.   Delta had their chances to get into LF during the 7 years waiting period of the W/A going away, and where the hell was Delta then WT?  Huh, where were they?  They just assumed they would automatically be granted access, and when it was not granted, YOU, and Delta went ape-shite as you both saw you lost all grounds to maintain what you had at LF.  Now. lay this crap to rest until the final decision comes out, will you?  You are looking like a complete a$$ the more you continue to go on and on and on and on.  But we all know you will keep going on this issue, as you just love to beat a DEAD HORSE!!!

 

[WorldTraveler]

save the "we didn't do it, we're just taking what we can get"
 
You touted on here about how DL had failed to run to the judge and DOJ to get into the bidding process but B6 and WN did.  and sure enough, B6 and WN walked away with the majority of the slots in the divestiture process.
 
Where in federal law does it say that access to any US airport is dependent on sucking up to the DOJ?
 
No place which is why the whole divestiture process is one of skating on thin ice.
 
Your whole "they should have been here"  is meaningless... what other airport in the US did carriers have to make a reservation  to serve years in advance?  DAL and the WA IS the problem and it is legally indefensible what is happening there and that is the issue that will be pursued as much as you want to believe otherwise. 
 
The reason why the legal process hasn't started is because there is a lot of effort in process to keep from engaging in a legal and public relations disaster that WN wants to avoid. 
 
After closing 18 stations since the merger and now being faced with being accused of benefitting if not promoting exclusionary dominance of  an airport in a major city, WN is not keen to all of a sudden become a target of Congressional and legal access that could make the bags fly free campaign look childish in comparison.
 
But since DL will benefit from the AA/US merger if for no other reason that AA's further not WINNING at NYC, DL isn't going to go after the merger itself but rather access to DAL 
 
Again, DL hasn't pulled their flights to/from DAL.  They don't think the issue is over.  Thus, it is worth discussing. 

 

[robbedagain]

not too long ago  the GOVT  the DOJ/DOT says DL is not a good candidate    that says a lot  
 
DL pretty well lost the 2 gates at DAL   Its  a battle btwn WN and VX   but who knows if anthr LCC will come into play