Hourly Pay Rate

[pilot]

Truly pathetic. Here's a guy unwilling stand up for the profession then blaming his fellow pilots for his plight.

Tell me sparky, are the DAL, NWA, and now Maseba guys wrong? Should they just roll over like you and your GAG brethern did or take a stance like they are now doing. Willing to strike if the judge absolves their contract.

Would YOU be willing to strike if ......... never mind. It's all the RC4's fault.

pilot

 

[Mtnman928]

And for this little excersize in chest beating, I lost 25% of my vacation, 90% of the value of my stock and a minimum fleet count that cost us over 40 aircraft. We're reduced to name calling and a stupidity that defies all logic. We hire high priced accountants, lawyers and advisors and then refuse to follow their advice. The fact that people toss around names like GAG and RC4 tells me that they don't care about this pilot group as a whole, just their little faction whatever it may be. LOA 93 was a failure. It was the product of poor negotiating and a disfuntional union.

We deserve what ever we get because we cannot get along. Everyone wants to think they are right and when things blow up in their face, look for others to blame. This pilot group suffers from a lack of education. The information is out there but they won't take the time to reseach the facts. Emotionalism and rumor have taken over.

The hayday is over and we have no one to blame but ourselves.

A320 Driver <_<

They also suffer from apathy. Do any of these people even go to union meetings? I’ve been to them and sorry to say I’ve seen as few as 11 people there.

It’s nice to throw little bomblets around and blaming one group or another about their problems, the fact is people are satisfied with letting someone else look after their interests. Just don’t loose my job.

Ballot after ballot has shown that the pilots here will do just about anything to be able to walk around a terminal in an ersatz fighter ace leather jacket. So what if people south of their seniority get shafted. I’m protected.

Mtnman

 

[pilot]

You got it right man. There is no unity an no resolve within the U group to protect the profession. Only to protect the "jobs". 57% voted yes to basically gutting pay, working conditions and leaving fellow pilots hanging out to dry.

I truly hope the AWA guys have some guts because they are about to have their eyes opened very wide. And, the U MEC chairman and his GAG mentality will tell them to roll over and "live to fight another day".

Problem is, with this group, there will never be another day. The "job" is all that is important.

pilot

 

[insp89]

Neither is that. If that's what they told you at CCY, they weren't shooting straight. WN only 5% hedged for 2006? Only in US' managements' wildest dreams. Here's WN's fuel hedging discussion as of 12/31/04 (from their 2004 earnings release in Jan. 2005):
http://phx.corporate-ir.net/phoenix.zhtml?...4088&highlight=

And here's the same discussion a year later as of 12/31/05:
http://phx.corporate-ir.net/phoenix.zhtml?...5522&highlight=

WN's hedging benefits aren't perpetual. But by time WN is paying market price for gas, some other airlines might have run out of cash and options.

FWAAA, Thank You for the latest numbers on Southwest's Fuel Hedging.

 

[markkus757]

If you guys had SW management, half of the employees wouldn't survive because they would wear you out. The SW employees does more for their money. Comparing them is kinda stupid; I would even go as far to say that they don't do the same job as you do.

 

[insp89]

If you guys had SW management, half of the employees wouldn't survive because they would wear you out. The SW employees does more for their money. Comparing them is kinda stupid; I would even go as far to say that they don't do the same job as you do.

B.S.

 

[insp89]

Fuel Hedging is not a whole lot different then a trip to Atlantic City.

Forecast (Guess) wrong and your company can be wiped out financially. Forecast correctly and you look like a business genius.

What everyone forgets is SWA has a more efficient system that allows them to take a greater on hedging and pay employees more.

In a raw Eyeball to Eyeball showdown SWA will ALWAYS have lower total cost than US Airways. In order to thrive US needs the revenue premium that it's Hubs and Focus Cities provide to offset SWA's cost advantage.

Further it needs to dramatically improve aircraft utilization and streamline all of their business processes in order to get costs low as possible. Everything from ratio of employee to planes to the IT budget needs to be and is being examined. When you have a lower cost structure and the presense that US has in the big east coast cities you can make the other guy bleed cash while you eek out a profit until you drive them off which is EXACTLY what SWA did and does.
Bottom line Point to point from a strict cost only point of view will kick Hub and Spoke in the pants every time.

Bob, Ratio of employees to planes can be very decieving..

For example, Southwest outsources more of their Aircraft Heavy Maintenance than Usairways does..

While there is no doubt that Southwest has less mechanics than Usairways,

Mechanic's from other maintenance facilities are maintaining Southwest's aircraft..These mechanic's are not employed by Southwest, but have to be added to Southwest's "Ratio of Employees to planes" to come up with a true comparision.

 

[pilot]

If you guys had SW management, half of the employees wouldn't survive because they would wear you out. The SW employees does more for their money. Comparing them is kinda stupid; I would even go as far to say that they don't do the same job as you do.

Yeah, flying jets is really different at Southwest.

So is catering, maintenance, inflight service, reservations, etc......

What's kinda stupid is your post.

pilot

 

[Bob Owens]

We had no support from the other groups and as a result, everyone now works for pennys on the dollar of their pre-BK pay and benefits if they have not been subed out.

When were the pilots refused support?

Seems that pilots have a long history of not supporting anybody, nor do I ever recall them asking for support.

I do recall that when Lorenzo busted the IAM at Continental the ALPA represented pilots had no problem crossing the IAM picket lines. I recall how they stuck it to PATCO. I even recall how pilots testify that there is nothing wrong with outsourcing everyone elses jobs.

So please, if you want to justify 80hrs a month grossing you six figures by all means go right ahead, in fact I agree that you guys should be paid very well, but many like you feel that you deserve everything and everyone else should settle for nothing.

 

[sfb]

Bob, Ratio of employees to planes can be very decieving..

For example, Southwest outsources more of their Aircraft Heavy Maintenance than Usairways does..

While there is no doubt that Southwest has less mechanics than Usairways,

Mechanic's from other maintenance facilities are maintaining Southwest's aircraft..These mechanic's are not employed by Southwest, but have to be added to Southwest's "Ratio of Employees to planes" to come up with a true comparision.

Well, Southwest doesn't outsource its reservations, nor does it outsource any of its outstations, nor does it outsource its IT.

 

[insp89]

Well, Southwest doesn't outsource its reservations, nor does it outsource any of its outstations, nor does it outsource its IT.

sfb, So what? That does not change the fact that "Ratio of employees to planes" comparisons are decieving.

The question is, what exactly is a person looking for in these comparisons, The TRUTH ? or just HALF-TRUTHS.

 

[insp89]

Pilot, From a fellow business owner and pilot, I wish I could have articulated that well.

There was also a belief amongst other groups, that the pilots were the problem and when they were cut down to a "reasonable rate", all would be well with the world. You see it at Delta and NWA today. I knew everyone would take it in the teeth, if the pilots were to give back. We had no support from the other groups and as a result, everyone now works for pennys on the dollar of their pre-BK pay and benefits if they have not been subed out. You can see that attitude even with this thread..."is it true that SWA pilots make...?"

autofixer, WOW, You're complaining about the lack of support for the pilot's from "other" groups ??

You must be proud of your pilot buddies over at Northwest with all the support they gave the mechanics..