How Delta Plays Politics in Washington: Who Needs Eric Cantor?

[737823]

Horse s**t 
 
You really think EK and QR are going to stop flying airplanes? No. Airbus alone simply can't meet the demand of the world. 
 
All this would do is make EK and such play a fair ball game. As an airline employee you have to be completely stupid to support ExIm. Just wait for American to have a JV with QR. All those cheap planes take over all your long haul flying......lay-offs. etc. etc.

He has been separated from US Airways since 2005. I have no interest in having my tax dollars subsidize the sale and financing of aircraft to large Middle East carriers from governments connected to terrorist groups while threatening US jobs at US carriers at the same time. So yes Ex-Im may contribute to some union jobs at Boeing but come at a high cost to everyone else in the USA.

Josh

 

[700UW]

A mind is a terrible thing to waste, and you allegedly aren't an AA, US employee nor an IAM or TWU member. And the bank doesn't use tax dollars and makes a profit.

 

[737823]

A mind is a terrible thing to waste, and you allegedly aren't an AA, US employee nor an IAM or TWU member. And the bank doesn't use tax dollars and makes a profit.

Then why does it need to be reauthorized by Congress? Do you want to support carriers connected to terrorist organizations?

Josh

 

[700UW]

Lying again? It need to be authorized again as the Federal Government offers the guarantee. And that bank supports thousands of American workers. So terrorism has nothing to do with this and billions of tax dollars have supported dictatorships and terrorism, who funded the taliban? Who funded Sadam against Iraq?

 

[737823]

Lying again? It need to be authorized again as the Federal Government offers the guarantee. And that bank supports thousands of American workers. So terrorism has nothing to do with this and billions of tax dollars have supported dictatorships and terrorism, who funded the taliban? Who funded Sadam against Iraq?

I'm referring to carriers like Emirates, Etihad and Qatar.

Josh

 

[WorldTraveler]

Lying again? It need to be authorized again as the Federal Government offers the guarantee. And that bank supports thousands of American workers. So terrorism has nothing to do with this and billions of tax dollars have supported dictatorships and terrorism, who funded the taliban? Who funded Sadam against Iraq?

whether the bank makes money or not and whether it actually costs the US government anything is not the point.

the point is that by having a government guarantee, loans are made at rates that are lower than commercially available rates and US carriers cannot obtain loans from the Exim bank.

The ExIm bank distorts the market and limits a group of airlines from obtaining those preferential rates.

For someone who is so quick to tell others that their mind is wasted and that they are lying, you are hopelessly clueless about why the issue matters to DL employees.

what is perfectly clear is that you once again have taken a position that is counter to that of DL employees - I told you they stand behind their execs on this issue - because you as the IAM are more interested in pleasing the largest group of constituents which is not airline employees but rather aerospace workers.

The IAM is willing to sell out its loyalties to one group of employees in order to pacify another.

And once again it is obvious why DL employees want nothing to do with the IAM or any other multi-industry, multi-employer union.

DL employees - 50,000 and the IAM ZERO

 

[700UW]

And when an US Based airlines buys Airbus, they can get the same thing from the European ExIm Bank.
 
So why dont you tell us how DL is financing the A321s and the A330s?
 
And US based airlines get a huge discount from Boeing on planes purchased.
 
Who said anything about the IAM?
 
Get a life dude, your obsessed, this is about Politics, Delta and the ExIm Bank, no one except you has made it into a union thread, that all ready exists.

 

[WorldTraveler]

no, dead wrong, no.

US and European airlines ARE NOT eligible for discounts from either Airbus or Boeing.

Discounts are not the issue; financing is. Government backed loans provide lower interest rates and tens of millions of dollars difference in price over the life of the aircraft.

Once again, you have no idea of the issues involved and yet you are happy to give away US jobs.

I have a life... it is a valid concern which you are happy to speak against, contrary to the will of DL employees.

As chief spokesperson for the IAM, your message is clearly identified as the IAM's.

 

[700UW]

Hey Clueless.
 
No US Based airline pays list price for a plane from Boeing, they didnt tell you that in Brazil?
 
You must have me confused, with yourself who is brainwashed, speaks for all the Deltoid employees and is a major hypocrite.

 

[robbedagain]

All airlines when buying either airbus or boeing always gets huge discounts thats a fact jack

 

[metopower]

Robbed I guess you just don't get it. It has nothing to do with the price of the aircraft. It has to do with the financing . If Emerates gets financing that is below market (which is what you get when your loan is guaranteed by the Exim bank) your competition is at a great disadvantage. Those loans were never intended for rich government airlines like Emerates or Qatar but for third world airlines. Besides at the number of aircraft that Emerates buys they get pricing and interest rates far favorable then other airlines. Why give them even greater advantage with Exim back loan guarantees.Level playing field is good for everyone.

 

[WorldTraveler]

thank you, Meto.

and congratulations for standing up for an issue which other airline employees just simply don't even understand.
and clearly the unions don't get it - or least 700 as the IAM's representative on here.

and, of course, the airlines get hefty discounts - virtually all of them that buy in large enough quantities.

but participants on airline chat forums - this and others - simply do not understand the cost of financing to the total cost of an asset.

when an airline has to pay even a percent higher in interest rates on an asset that is worth hundreds of millions of dollars, the increased costs add up quickly.

The fact that so few people understand that principle is probably the same reason that so many Americans are in debt for years and can't get out... because even the cost of "low" interest rates add up but when compared to "retail" rates, ExIm rates look like a bargain - and they are. The difference between an ExIm rates and commercially available rates amounts to tens of millions of dollars in costs per year per aircraft.

The cost of debt is precisely the reason why DL is buying older model aircraft and paying as much for cash as possible; but DL obviously has to buy some new, modern aircraft and it simply isn't fair that government supported airlines with spotty human rights records that are using their assets to invade US and European markets should also be able to use lower cost financing to compete against US carriers.

The issue matters and DL is succeeding at convincing members of Congress that hurting the US airline industry in order to help Boeing is not a fair tradeoff, even if the IAM is willing to do exactly that in order to protect its largest source of aviation dues.

 

[robbedagain]

thanks meto   but even so though with the deep discounts  that would obviously have a cheaper loan attached with it wouldn't it?   as far as favorable  how much of that would be attributed to the fact the govt over there owns Emirates as well as Qatar and Eithad     Wouldn't Middle East Airlines also fall into that category too?

 

[700UW]

I am not the IAM's spokesman, unlike you who speaks for all of DL's employees, you took the money and ran, and collect a frozen pension check.
 
I dont work for the IAM unlike you who probably gets paid by Ford and Harrison since you beg for $2,500 a month to live.

 

[WorldTraveler]

I have never said I speak for ANY DL employees but I do HEAR what they say and know that the issue of loan guarantees to the Middle East 3 airlines (Them R Rats, Etihad, Qatar) matters do DL employees and should matter to anyone who is interested in a viable US airline industry.

It is impossible to have a level and fair playing field if some carriers receive loans which are backed by US government loan guarantees which is what the ExIm Bank offers.

Even if the sales price is the same, ExIm clients benefit from lower financing costs worth tens of millions of dollars per aircraft over the life of the loan. Having the US government back aircraft financing is no different than the fact that the US government gets better interest rates than US corporations.

Whether you speak for the IAM or doesn't change that the IAM will not speak out against the ExIm bank because the IAM has tens of thousands of union dues payers at Boeing who do benefit from the ExIm Bank's ability to offer loan guarantees. The IAM is simply not going to take a stance that is contrary to the well-being of the employer of one of its largest groups of employees, even if in doing so they alienate thousands of DL employees who absolutely do understand what is at stake.

I'm not sure it really matters, though, at least as far as the IAM goes because DL employees decided years ago for a whole lot of other reasons that the IAM or any other union is not an alternative which the majority of DL employees want.