More RJ''s less 737''s

cltvff

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Aug 20, 2002
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Yup... stinks and hurts. That's why I go way out of my way to fly NW metal.... nothing but CO RJs out of CLT anymore.
 

CLEfan

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Aug 20, 2002
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On 12/20/2002 7:42:10 AM mrf777 wrote:

Check out the fall schedule for 2003
CLE-MIA -737 TO RJ
CLE-DEN - 737 TO RJ
CLE-MSY - 737 TO RJ

THIS STINKS!
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Looks like CLE-MIA will be 1 ERJ a day and 1 737 on saturday
CLE-DEN is still 2 737's but an ERJ too for added frequency
CLE-MSY is 2 ERJs a day instead of 1 737.

This does stink, but hopefully they use the 737's on new routes out of CLE. Any other rumors floating around?
 

AAG2000

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Aug 20, 2002
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[blockquote]
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On 12/20/2002 8:00:12 AM ITRADE wrote:

CLE-MIA in a RJ. Thats 1080 miles.

That HuRtS!!!!!
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Yes it does, but not as much as these other recently-started COEX routes: EWR-OMA (1131 miles), IAH-PSP (1268 miles), and EWR-OKC (a butt-numbing 1324 miles). Thank Embraer for building the ERJ-145XR...transcon RJ's can't be too far off...
 

ITRADE

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Aug 19, 2002
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[P]
[BLOCKQUOTE][BR]----------------[BR]On 12/20/2002 7:02:26 PM Management Guru wrote:
[P]If FAT-IAH starts next year as rumored that's 1480 miles.[/P]----------------[/BLOCKQUOTE]
[P][/P]Double ouch. I think that ALPA had a point when it wanted to cap RJ flights to 1000 miles. This is just too much/
 

Tango-Bravo

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Aug 29, 2002
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With all due respect to RJ drivers and the fine job they do...

How long will they go on working for apprentice wages when the reality hits home that their apprenticeship has become more of a dead-end than the stepping-stone (to a mainline "real" job) they thought it would be? The irony to me is that it seems RJ drivers are putting themselves out of the mainline jobs for which they are willing to serve a low-paid apprenticeship by their very willingness to do so. As I recall, was this not a central issue of the Comair pilots strike?

And one more question on the subject of RJs...

How long before ATC puts its foot down about the majors' seeming obsession with putting 3 RJ flights into congested airways and hub airports when 1 737 can do the same job?
 
Aug 20, 2002
664
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[blockquote]
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On 12/20/2002 10:25:00 PM Tango-Bravo wrote:

"With all due respect to RJ drivers and the fine job they do...

How long will they go on working for apprentice wages when the reality hits home that their apprenticeship has become more of a dead-end than the stepping-stone (to a mainline "real" job) they thought it would be? The irony to me is that it seems RJ drivers are putting themselves out of the mainline jobs for which they are willing to serve a low-paid apprenticeship by their very willingness to do so. As I recall, was this not a central issue of the Comair pilots strike?"


What do you propose? Negotiate a higher wage? Wow, what a concept. That might be hard though. After all it isn/t a "real" job, so it probably doesn/t deserve a "real" wage. Maybe the regionals could demand a better wage if their productivity wasn/t controlled by others. Don/t get me wrong, I understand the need for SCOPE agreements and I agree 100% with the reasoning, but you/ll have a hard time convincing me that it isn/t a factor itself in keeping regional pay rates low.

One other thing, I bet in a couple years this will all be moot. I think as the mainline pilots are forced to loosen their SCOPE grip by current economic realities and the RJ fleets expand, the regional pay scales will start to come closer to mainline. Especially when it looks like, at least in the short term, mainline pay scales will be stagnating and/or actually dropping.

"And one more question on the subject of RJs...

How long before ATC puts its foot down about the majors' seeming obsession with putting 3 RJ flights into congested airways and hub airports when 1 737 can do the same job?"

Wow, that/s a blast from the past. I haven/t heard that argument for a couple years now.

It just doesn/t seem like congestion is really a giant concern at the moment. In fact it has suddenly become such a non-issue that there was talk of delaying the ORD expansion project because the extra capacity was no longer needed. Just a personal observation, the taxiways do not seem nearly as clogged as they once were. I don/t know what exactly to attribute that to, although the airport I work at has been "depeaked". Also, I think the ATC guys are a little more worried about their own jobs and privatization right at the moment.

One last thing, I, and my checkbook, do not really like being the low cost alternative to mainline. However, when it comes to negotiating contracts, the deck is truly stacked against us. The company tries to do all it can to keep our wages subpar and mainline tries to keep us so inefficient that we barely make money. (Again, I understand why)

Times may be a'changin though. I just read the APA's "It's Time - One Airline" proposal. It seems they figure, "If you can/t beat 'em, make them join you"


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CALFLYBOY

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Aug 20, 2002
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You guys are looking at the fall '03 schedule? You have to remember that the fall schedule is not finalized. It has a chance of looking quite different when it is indeed finalized so don't get your "knickers in a knot" quite yet.
 

7.5victim

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Aug 20, 2002
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Given CO's habit of replacing mainline service with RJ's in CLE, jumping the gun isn't out of question. My 2003 CO Elite card has been earned mainly by flying NW. Sorry, but I won't fly 3 hours+ on an RJ. I'd rather connect at DTW. Hour, 90 minutes max on an RJ. Maybe I'm slightly claustrophobic, but the darn RJ's are too small for me on the longer flights.
 

gogogadget

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Aug 21, 2002
140
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[blockquote]
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On 12/20/2002 10:25:00 PM Tango-Bravo wrote:

With all due respect to RJ drivers and the fine job they do...

How long will they go on working for apprentice wages when the reality hits home that their apprenticeship has become more of a dead-end than the stepping-stone (to a mainline "real" job) they thought it would be? The irony to me is that it seems RJ drivers are putting themselves out of the mainline jobs for which they are willing to serve a low-paid apprenticeship by their very willingness to do so. As I recall, was this not a central issue of the Comair pilots strike?

And one more question on the subject of RJs...

How long before ATC puts its foot down about the majors' seeming obsession with putting 3 RJ flights into congested airways and hub airports when 1 737 can do the same job?


Hard to say, but right now it is like the pay for training scheme back in the early and mid 90's. At some point things will balance out and cariers will not be able to pimp out the pilots and FA's. (Unless the work out of Nevada;) )

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