The TWU Conssesions History

[swamt]

Why in the freakin world would any of you AA mechanics want to stay with the TWU when they have ALWAYS caved to the companies demands of conssesions evry single time they wanted them??? 1993= CONSSESIONS! 2003= CONSSESIONS! 2013= CONSSESIONS! Along with all these years of conssesions they also include lay-offs, rifs, relocations, families uprooted, mechs having to commute, reductions in overtime pay, sick pay, hol pay, day trades, if you guys even had them. What will it take for you guys to stop the company union from ripping everything you guys have left out of your hands??
This really is sad to watch. Take control of your union as well as you lives, vote in AMFA and watch each and every one of you say, damb, we should have done this DECADES ago. With your current union the company knows what they can get by with. The 50.25% yes votes proves this very fact. Unbelievable what you guys are willing to continue to go thru with the TWU. And some of you are willing to trade the TWU for the crooked and coruped teamsters. WOW!!

 

[swamt]

Why in the freakin world would any of you AA mechanics want to stay with the TWU when they have ALWAYS caved to the companies demands of conssesions evry single time they wanted them??? 1993= CONSSESIONS! 2003= CONSSESIONS! 2013= CONSSESIONS! Along with all these years of conssesions they also include lay-offs, rifs, relocations, families uprooted, mechs having to commute, reductions in overtime pay, sick pay, hol pay, day trades, if you guys even had them. What will it take for you guys to stop the company union from ripping everything you guys have left out of your hands??
This really is sad to watch. Take control of your union as well as you lives, vote in AMFA and watch each and every one of you say, damb, we should have done this DECADES ago. With your current union the company knows what they can get by with. The 50.25% yes votes proves this very fact. Unbelievable what you guys are willing to continue to go thru with the TWU. And some of you are willing to trade the TWU for the crooked and coruped teamsters. WOW!!

No reply's speaks volumes gentlemen. Sorry for the harsh comment but some of you guys need a rude awakening.

 

[rifbound]

Really? You might think that is so simple just but it's not. Y'all at SWA did it but you're not as big as AA. We have tried several different times and each time something else was added to a certain work group or what not that would change the amount needed. The TWU is like cancer, it will always be there no matter how hard you try to get tid of it!

So, by you running you throat yogurt hole and not really knwoning the fight alot of us have been through to try to get tid of the TWU, you can't say "No reply's speaks volumes gentlemen." You don't know S**T! Don't think SWA is all high and mighty either. Their time will soon come as well. Leaner, less labor cost, and conssesionary contracts will hurt them. Don't fool yourself. I know many people there, some union and management. They can already read the writing on the wall.

When/if that day comes I will fill sorry for all that are affected. But since i don't work there or am a part of the union i wouldn't run my mouth about their affairs.

 

[swamt]

Really? You might think that is so simple just but it's not. Y'all at SWA did it but you're not as big as AA. We have tried several different times and each time something else was added to a certain work group or what not that would change the amount needed. The TWU is like cancer, it will always be there no matter how hard you try to get tid of it!

So, by you running you throat yogurt hole and not really knwoning the fight alot of us have been through to try to get tid of the TWU, you can't say "No reply's speaks volumes gentlemen." You don't know S**T! Don't think SWA is all high and mighty either. Their time will soon come as well. Leaner, less labor cost, and conssesionary contracts will hurt them. Don't fool yourself. I know many people there, some union and management. They can already read the writing on the wall.

When/if that day comes I will fill sorry for all that are affected. But since i don't work there or am a part of the union i wouldn't run my mouth about their affairs.

Like I said, I know it was harsh, but it was in fact very true. Trust me, I know more than you know how hard you guys are working on it. AND I do know how you guys get "non-members" added at will by the company. I have NEVER said SWA is invinceable, and never will I ever say that. By all means, my comment was not towards the hard working men and women trying to get change at AA by removing the TWU (complete company union) It was for all the TWU and teamster brain washed people that can't see what a difference AMFA would make at AA. But I will still say to you all at AA. WTF does it take for you all to make change?? The TWU has been agreeing to conssesions, rifs, lay-offs, relocations, reductions in bennies, ect.. for decades with the company. Really, what does it take for you guys to wake up??

 

[JAFI]

Which year and contract was it that SWA began doing maintenance in El Salvador? The biggest crisis of our trade has been foreign repair station outsourcing. Can't really call it outsourcing for SWA because all they did was move it from a US repair station to a foreign repair station.

Your post wasn't harsh, it was just hypocritical.

 

[swamt]

Which year and contract was it that SWA began doing maintenance in El Salvador? The biggest crisis of our trade has been foreign repair station outsourcing. Can't really call it outsourcing for SWA because all they did was move it from a US repair station to a foreign repair station.

Your post wasn't harsh, it was just hypocritical.

2008-2012 The current contract. And it was a sec 6 nego by AMFA. The problem was that AMFA took over the contract from the teamsters that had absolutely no restrictions for the company to farm out overseas. And BTW I voted no on the last contract.

 

[strikeforce]

Why in the freakin world would any of you AA mechanics want to stay with the TWU when they have ALWAYS caved to the companies demands of conssesions evry single time they wanted them??? 1993= CONSSESIONS! 2003= CONSSESIONS! 2013= CONSSESIONS! Along with all these years of conssesions they also include lay-offs, rifs, relocations, families uprooted, mechs having to commute, reductions in overtime pay, sick pay, hol pay, day trades, if you guys even had them. What will it take for you guys to stop the company union from ripping everything you guys have left out of your hands??
This really is sad to watch. Take control of your union as well as you lives, vote in AMFA and watch each and every one of you say, damb, we should have done this DECADES ago. With your current union the company knows what they can get by with. The 50.25% yes votes proves this very fact. Unbelievable what you guys are willing to continue to go thru with the TWU. And some of you are willing to trade the TWU for the crooked and coruped teamsters. WOW!!

Tell me....What AMFA would have done to stop AA from abrogating the agreement.....like they just did with the pilots?? After 22 years with AA, I'm totally relieved of paying any union to continue the outsourcing train. There's no fight left in beaten down.....concession weary amt's, at any airline. most do just enough to save their A&P. The love of aviation has come and gone........most come to work, and do very little, and as long as the paycheck doesn't bounce.....they're content. At this point....whether it's TWU, AMFA or Teamsters....the airlines have figured out ways to beat the union. And, do you think management is that stupid to pay top dollar for little to no work being done by some of the slugs....most unions protect. Tell me.....when have you ever seen any union try and weed out the slugs??? At AA, management doesn't get the bang for the buck from it's amt's! Management may have mis-managed AA...but, the union's have mis-managed their duties to control the members. If I sat across the table from the union during negotiations.....I would also question the fact "that you want me to pay your mechanic $40/hr.....so he can come to work and play with his laptop, cry when he's handed a job, and then #### and moan that the company's "F"ing him". That's why DL, UA, AA, and all the other carriers farm out the work.....right? They get the bang for the buck....and it's cheaper. At least that's the way I see it. And I don't have a business degree......it's called common sense.

 

[737823]

The TWU may have given concessions in the past but they did not start the post 9/11 concessions train, that would be the IAM at USAir in 2002.

Josh

 

[Overspeed]

Why in the freakin world would any of you AA mechanics want to stay with the TWU when they have ALWAYS caved to the companies demands of conssesions evry single time they wanted them??? 1993= CONSSESIONS! 2003= CONSSESIONS! 2013= CONSSESIONS! Along with all these years of conssesions they also include lay-offs, rifs, relocations, families uprooted, mechs having to commute, reductions in overtime pay, sick pay, hol pay, day trades, if you guys even had them. What will it take for you guys to stop the company union from ripping everything you guys have left out of your hands??
This really is sad to watch. Take control of your union as well as you lives, vote in AMFA and watch each and every one of you say, damb, we should have done this DECADES ago. With your current union the company knows what they can get by with. The 50.25% yes votes proves this very fact. Unbelievable what you guys are willing to continue to go thru with the TWU. And some of you are willing to trade the TWU for the crooked and coruped teamsters. WOW!!

NWA = All but 900 jobs lost
AS = Entire overhaul base shutdown OAK and ~400 jobs and should be making more than WN. AS chased WN out of the Northwest US and stock price is going nowhere but up. Where was the AMFA "balls"?
UA = All airframe overhaul jobs allowed to be outsourced ~4,000 jobs lost
WN = Not even a whimper when overhaul lines sent to El Salvador with maybe 100 jobs added in return and only expended the IBT contract. Where are the AMFA "balls"

TWU = Had number two in pay until the AMFA sympathizers (Owens, Peterson, Pike, Chuck, and Ken) managed to shoot it down and we would have had all our overhaul in-house. That would have been a major win for the TWU and stomped all over all the other contracts. The TWU Int'l highly recommended this contract along with Luis, Woodward, Meyers, and Clark to name a few. They obviously realized the gravity of the situation and the facts. We would have been opening up on a new contract in 2013 but now what. The "leaders with balls" recommended against the advice of the Int'l and said we could get better. Instead the "will of the membership" prevailed (something you erroneously say the TWU does not have) and decided to give the Vote No Coalition, or VNC (AMFA/AMP guys) the opportunity to prove themselves. Now we are in BK which is what the VNC dismissed as pro-company propaganda from the TWU Int'l. Well that wasn't true now was it. Was the VNC responsible for AA going to BK? Of course not however they grossly miscalculated and now you and other AMFA and IBT advocates claim it is the TWU's fault we got a crappy deal in BK? WTF when will the VNC and the other union organizers wake up. We all own this and now will live it. If we had taken the May 2010 deal as recommended, we would most likely be in the same boat as the MCTs. They got to keep their pay rate from the May 2010 deal and we would have been haggling over work rules and outsourcing. But here we are. Can AMFA fix our current position? Hell no! Can the IBT? Hell no. We are totally screwed like the UA, DL, and US guys were after BK and we will be living this for at least four years (early openers) but at least we are not like NW. AMFA led them totally off the cliff and they never recovered.

Sorry for the harsh facts brother.

 

[700UW]

The TWU may have given concessions in the past but they did not start the post 9/11 concessions train, that would be the IAM at USAir in 2002.

Josh

Are you sure about that?

How many times are you going to post lies and misinformation.

ALPA was the first union on the property to give concessions in 2002, they did it before US filed chapter 11. The IAM was the last union to agree to concessions in the 2002 Chapter 11 case, and we voted down the concessions the first time.

Once again, dont let the facts get in your way.

And by the way the TWU started the concessions way back in 1983, way before anything ever happened at US.

 

[strikeforce]

The TWU may have given concessions in the past but they did not start the post 9/11 concessions train, that would be the IAM at USAir in 2002.

Josh

does it really matter who started the concession train? The reality is....the airlines will find the cheapest fbo's to get their airplanes fixed....whether it's here or abroad. So, in order to gain a competitive edge over the competition...the union's need to have the best of the best mechanics. The TWU, AMFA and IBT will continue to lose work, as long as, the workers fail to produce. The mx field is loaded with fbo's, all over the world, that won't blink for a second to gain this work from the TWU, AMFA & IBT. The new generation airplanes can go anywhere in the world.....and so goes their maintenance. Yes, it angers me to see these good paying jobs shipped overseas.....but, that's all part of doing business around the world. And, when you combine cheap labor and airplanes that can fly to cheap labor countries.....it's a recipe for disaster for our union's and amt's.
And, let me just say.....my colleagues in MX Control can't say enough about the work done by contractors.....they usually criticize the amt's work here. kind of tells you something.

 

[737823]

Are you sure about that?

How many times are you going to post lies and misinformation.

ALPA was the first union on the property to give concessions in 2002, they did it before US filed chapter 11. The IAM was the last union to agree to concessions in the 2002 Chapter 11 case, and we voted down the concessions the first time.

Once again, dont let the facts get in your way.

And by the way the TWU started the concessions way back in 1983, way before anything ever happened at US.

Then explain this to me:

Yea, we can look and see what a great job they did at USAIR, the IAM started the concessions train in 2002 by opening up their contract to supposedly avoid BK, they gave the company everything they wanted, the company filed, then went back for two more rounds of concessions in BK, then they helped NWA bust AMFA only to be rewarded by being decertified when the owners of NWA sold the company to Delta.

The IAM abandoned their members at TWA. The IAM had a successorship clause but abandoned it rather than risk being screwed out of money TWA owed their pension plan and lease payments for an engine they owned.

I once had a high opinion of the IAM, they have negotiated many good contracts over the years but for the last ten they have been in a downward spiral.

http://www.airlineforums.com/topic/50215-aaapfa-negotiations/#entry777489


Was the IAM the first to give concessions for M&R after 9/11? (We aren't talking about 1983)

Josh

 

[rifbound]

TWU = Had number two in pay until the AMFA sympathizers (Owens, Peterson, Pike, Chuck, and Ken) managed to shoot it down and we would have had all our overhaul in-house. That would have been a major win for the TWU and stomped all over all the other contracts. The TWU Int'l highly recommended this contract along with Luis, Woodward, Meyers, and Clark to name a few. They obviously realized the gravity of the situation and the facts. We would have been opening up on a new contract in 2013 but now what. The "leaders with balls" recommended against the advice of the Int'l and said we could get better. Instead the "will of the membership" prevailed (something you erroneously say the TWU does not have) and decided to give the Vote No Coalition, or VNC (AMFA/AMP guys) the opportunity to prove themselves. Now we are in BK which is what the VNC dismissed as pro-company propaganda from the TWU Int'l. Well that wasn't true now was it. Was the VNC responsible for AA going to BK? Of course not however they grossly miscalculated and now you and other AMFA and IBT advocates claim it is the TWU's fault we got a crappy deal in BK? WTF when will the VNC and the other union organizers wake up. We all own this and now will live it. If we had taken the May 2010 deal as recommended, we would most likely be in the same boat as the MCTs. They got to keep their pay rate from the May 2010 deal and we would have been haggling over work rules and outsourcing. But here we are. Can AMFA fix our current position? Hell no! Can the IBT? Hell no. We are totally screwed like the UA, DL, and US guys were after BK and we will be living this for at least four years (early openers) but at least we are not like NW. AMFA led them totally off the cliff and they never recovered.

Sorry for the harsh facts brother.

OMG, LMFAO!!!! Somebody was super thirsty and drank a whole lot of kool-aid! How are you still alive?

 

[Realityck]

[background=rgb(242, 242, 242)]
Overspeed, on 14 September 2012 - 11:36 AM, said:[/background][background=rgb(252, 252, 252)]

TWU = Had number two in pay until the AMFA sympathizers (Owens, Peterson, Pike, Chuck, and Ken) managed to shoot it down and we would have had all our overhaul in-house. That would have been a major win for the TWU and stomped all over all the other contracts. The TWU Int'l highly recommended this contract along with Luis, Woodward, Meyers, and Clark to name a few. They obviously realized the gravity of the situation and the facts. We would have been opening up on a new contract in 2013 but now what. The "leaders with balls" recommended against the advice of the Int'l and said we could get better. Instead the "will of the membership" prevailed (something you erroneously say the TWU does not have) and decided to give the Vote No Coalition, or VNC (AMFA/AMP guys) the opportunity to prove themselves. Now we are in BK which is what the VNC dismissed as pro-company propaganda from the TWU Int'l. Well that wasn't true now was it. Was the VNC responsible for AA going to BK? Of course not however they grossly miscalculated and now you and other AMFA and IBT advocates claim it is the TWU's fault we got a crappy deal in BK? WTF when will the VNC and the other union organizers wake up. We all own this and now will live it. If we had taken the May 2010 deal as recommended, we would most likely be in the same boat as the MCTs. They got to keep their pay rate from the May 2010 deal and we would have been haggling over work rules and outsourcing. But here we are. Can AMFA fix our current position? Hell no! Can the IBT? Hell no. We are totally screwed like the UA, DL, and US guys were after BK and we will be living this for at least four years (early openers) but at least we are not like NW. AMFA led them totally off the cliff and they never recovered.

Sorry for the harsh facts brother.


The truth is a powerful weapon, but don't expect the AMFA sympathizers to admit it. Owens, Peterson, Pike, Chuck & Ken won't admit they screwed up, but the members won't forget their Vote No push on the 2010 Agreement. They said Vote No and things would get better, and they didn't. Some even suggested the Judge won't abrogate the APA Contract, and he did. Now they #### about our wage scale when they were the ones that convinced the majority of AMTs to vote No on the 2010 T/A. Remember these leaders of men who led you down the garden path and over the cliff.[/background]

 

[whatajoke]

[background=rgb(242, 242, 242)]Overspeed, on 14 September 2012 - 11:36 AM, said:[/background]

[background=rgb(252, 252, 252)]TWU = Had number two in pay until the AMFA sympathizers (Owens, Peterson, Pike, Chuck, and Ken) managed to shoot it down and we would have had all our overhaul in-house. That would have been a major win for the TWU and stomped all over all the other contracts. The TWU Int'l highly recommended this contract along with Luis, Woodward, Meyers, and Clark to name a few. They obviously realized the gravity of the situation and the facts. We would have been opening up on a new contract in 2013 but now what. The "leaders with balls" recommended against the advice of the Int'l and said we could get better. Instead the "will of the membership" prevailed (something you erroneously say the TWU does not have) and decided to give the Vote No Coalition, or VNC (AMFA/AMP guys) the opportunity to prove themselves. Now we are in BK which is what the VNC dismissed as pro-company propaganda from the TWU Int'l. Well that wasn't true now was it. Was the VNC responsible for AA going to BK? Of course not however they grossly miscalculated and now you and other AMFA and IBT advocates claim it is the TWU's fault we got a crappy deal in BK? WTF when will the VNC and the other union organizers wake up. We all own this and now will live it. If we had taken the May 2010 deal as recommended, we would most likely be in the same boat as the MCTs. They got to keep their pay rate from the May 2010 deal and we would have been haggling over work rules and outsourcing. But here we are. Can AMFA fix our current position? Hell no! Can the IBT? Hell no. We are totally screwed like the UA, DL, and US guys were after BK and we will be living this for at least four years (early openers) but at least we are not like NW. AMFA led them totally off the cliff and they never recovered.

Sorry for the harsh facts brother.


The truth is a powerful weapon, but don't expect the AMFA sympathizers to admit it. Owens, Peterson, Pike, Chuck & Ken won't admit they screwed up, but the members won't forget their Vote No push on the 2010 Agreement. They said Vote No and things would get better, and they didn't. Some even suggested the Judge won't abrogate the APA Contract, and he did. Now they #### about our wage scale when they were the ones that convinced the majority of AMTs to vote No on the 2010 T/A. Remember these leaders of men who led you down the garden path and over the cliff.[/background]

Do not forget the misfits at 514 where all guilty of promoting vote no. I recall they put out a letter stating such.