Two US airmen dead in Germany

[Ms Tree]

Honestly, I just picked a number. Sorry.

I'm so NOT putting her on ignore, not today, not tomorrow or anytime soon. She keeps the shite up and the moderators fail to act I'lll just file a Cyber stalking complaint and let someone else figure it out. This state I live in has a pretty broad statute, so maybe we let a Judge decide.

Like I said I DON'T initiate force, however I'm not opposed to its use in defense as would be the case here. I changed my screen name to get rid of a stalker and all I have to do is contact the law and then we see who's who and doing what.

Funny thing is she dances and dances around the real issue of our continued adventurism that puts or GI's in danger in 139 countries. While it may have been a crazed Muslim extremist you also have to ask the question, "If we had not engaged in this 60+ years of global adventurism would the 2 soldiers be in Germany and would the extremist be so extreme?

I think our adventurism is only part of the issue. We have an addiction to oil which we refuse to deal with. We are in the ME to protect our interest in oil. I think Korea and Viet Nam were due to paranoia and would have happened regardless. The ME is happening because we are selfish and short sighted. The fact that we are out an about does give those who hate us ample targets so in that I do agree with you.

 

[dapoes]

Honestly, I just picked a number. Sorry.

I'm so NOT putting her on ignore, not today, not tomorrow or anytime soon. She keeps the shite up and the moderators fail to act I'lll just file a Cyber stalking complaint and let someone else figure it out. This state I live in has a pretty broad statute, so maybe we let a Judge decide.

Bra ha ha, please stop. My sides are aching already.

 

[SparrowHawk]

Bra ha ha, please stop. My sides are aching already.

Try me!

Been down the road before. It's very difficult to mask an IP Address or prevent your ISP from cooperating. You touched a nerve the other day with your insult. Like I said I'm opposed to initiating force, however I've no problem responding once provoked.

So you keep at it my dear and we shall see just how pacifist this Libertarian is. Remember there is a history and they may well assume its been you all along. Do what you feel comfortable with as I will do likewise.

 

[dapoes]

Try me!

Been down the road before. It's very difficult to mask an IP Address or prevent your ISP from cooperating. You touched a nerve the other day with your insult. Like I said I'm opposed to initiating force, however I've no problem responding once provoked.

So you keep at it my dear and we shall see just how pacifist this Libertarian is. Remember there is a history and they may well assume its been you all along. Do what you feel comfortable with as I will do likewise.

You are a joke.

 

[SparrowHawk]

You are a joke.

Perhaps yes? Perhaps no? Only time will tell! Now run along and leave me alone unless you have a salient point in the debates on the Water Cooler.

I sent you a PM requesting you not insult, but stick to the topics, you refused. I'm asking you here, now publicly to refrain from personal attacks or the use of my first name.

 

[dapoes]

Perhaps yes? Perhaps no? Only time will tell! Now run along and leave me alone unless you have a salient point in the debates on the Water Cooler.

I sent you a PM requesting you not insult, but stick to the topics, you refused. I'm asking you here, now publicly to refrain from personal attacks or the use of my first name.

Sure i guess.

Neville is a rather pleasant sounding name right? 😉

 

[dapoes]

Yes it's called Islam but ask yourself this. If the US military didn't have a presence in 139 countries including Germany would there be any US soldiers for Islamic Extremists to kill?

Perhaps if we stopped our imperialist/interventionist ways we wouldn't have so many people trying to kill us.

Heres a reality check for you and your USA hating liberal lefty self.

 

[SparrowHawk]

I'm sure what one has to do with the other?

President Eisenhower cautioned us regarding allowing the Government to be taken over vy what he called "The Military Industrial Complex". Now I don't thin most would consider him a "Liberal Lefty", yet his admonishment does resonate with me.

To me there is no valid foreign policy or national defense issue that requires us to have a military presence in 139 countries. We have the industrial and military might to fight a "push button war" until we can get troops on the ground. We have this capability because the Freedom & Liberty guaranteed us by God/Creator has allowed us to have an economy that throughout history has been the Juggernaut of world wide Freedom & Liberty,

Our Imperialism & adventurism gave us the Korean War, Viey Nam, Grenada, 2 go rounds in Iraq, Panama and the ever popular Afghanistan. Not to mention ensuring Castro's rise to power by backing Batista. Fast forward to the Somoza and the Sandinistas, Allende begot Pinochet and on it goes. I'd remind the gentle readers that this is but a short list of failures of a policy of intervention over issues & events that are frankly none of our concern, Might be the concern of US corporations, but not the citizens of the nation. We've spent to damn much money and to lose one US Soldier's life protecting American business overseas is one to many!

It's just like the situation now in Libya where everyone wants to "Do Something"! Do what? It's none of our business! Last time looked Libya is a sovereign nation and is capable of determining what kind of government its citizens prefer. The only appropriate role for the US is to at best leave them alone and at worst open up Uncle Sam's discount house of military hardware. Let the rest of the world deal with that nut bag, or pay us to do it for them cash in advance. If any of those 139 countries desire our military presence let them write us a freaking check to cover the costs in full, in advance. It;s funny the French have always hated us right up until the German troops mass at the border

 

[dapoes]

I'm sure what one has to do with the other?

President Eisenhower cautioned us regarding allowing the Government to be taken over vy what he called "The Military Industrial Complex". Now I don't thin most would consider him a "Liberal Lefty", yet his admonishment does resonate with me.

To me there is no valid foreign policy or national defense issue that requires us to have a military presence in 139 countries. We have the industrial and military might to fight a "push button war" until we can get troops on the ground. We have this capability because the Freedom & Liberty guaranteed us by God/Creator has allowed us to have an economy that throughout history has been the Juggernaut of world wide Freedom & Liberty,

Our Imperialism & adventurism gave us the Korean War, Viey Nam, Grenada, 2 go rounds in Iraq, Panama and the ever popular Afghanistan. Not to mention ensuring Castro's rise to power by backing Batista. Fast forward to the Somoza and the Sandinistas, Allende begot Pinochet and on it goes. I'd remind the gentle readers that this is but a short list of failures of a policy of intervention over issues & events that are frankly none of our concern, Might be the concern of US corporations, but not the citizens of the nation. We've spent to damn much money and to lose one US Soldier's life protecting American business overseas is one to many!

It's just like the situation now in Libya where everyone wants to "Do Something"! Do what? It's none of our business! Last time looked Libya is a sovereign nation and is capable of determining what kind of government its citizens prefer. The only appropriate role for the US is to at best leave them alone and at worst open up Uncle Sam's discount house of military hardware. Let the rest of the world deal with that nut bag, or pay us to do it for them cash in advance. If any of those 139 countries desire our military presence let them write us a freaking check to cover the costs in full, in advance. It;s funny the French have always hated us right up until the German troops mass at the border

All that nonsense above ^ ...well all I can say is history says otherwise. Standing alone and watching the world meltdown around you doesn't insure that it wont come to your backyard. Then what? Give em a big fat wet kiss? You have no defenses, so you are now in a weakened position.

And to all the other countries in turmoil and bloodshed? Let them all die like in Rwanda? Its not happening in your backyard so no big deal right? With your logic you probably would think it would have been acceptable to let the jews in Germany during WW2 to continue to be exterminated, as "It's none of our business!"

 

[SparrowHawk]

All that nonsense above ^ ...well all I can say is history says otherwise. Standing alone and watching the world meltdown around you doesn't insure that it wont come to your backyard. Then what? Give em a big fat wet kiss? You have no defenses, so you are now in a weakened position.

And to all the other countries in turmoil and bloodshed? Let them all die like in Rwanda? Its not happening in your backyard so no big deal right? With your logic you probably would think it would have been acceptable to let the jews in Germany during WW2 to continue to be exterminated, as "It's none of our business!"

Actually unless and until the US is attacked or as in WWI worldwide chaos breaks out as it did in Europe and as a result directly threatens our long term domestic security then I say the "boys" stay home. If it were 1942 and the conflict was restricted to Germany and they're killing each other (jew or otherwise) then it's NOT a United States Problem. However when the tanks rolled across the polish, Holland, Belgium and others it became a US Problem.

Like I said let the Libyans kill each other! God can sort them out.

 

[dapoes]

Actually unless and until the US is attacked or as in WWI worldwide chaos breaks out as it did in Europe and as a result directly threatens our long term domestic security then I say the "boys" stay home. If it were 1942 and the conflict was restricted to Germany and they're killing each other (jew or otherwise) then it's NOT a United States Problem. However when the tanks rolled across the polish, Holland, Belgium and others it became a US Problem.

Like I said let the Libyans kill each other! God can sort them out.

Lovely attitude. Not.

 

[SparrowHawk]

Lovely attitude. Not.

Well you were never faced with conscription into the military were you? You never faced having to make the decision to go to jail rather than become conscripted into the armed forces as a dupe for US and worldwide business interests as I was now were you?

to me it's like Ali said "I ain't got no quarrel with no Viet Cong"

 

[Ms Tree]

Actually unless and until the US is attacked or as in WWI worldwide chaos breaks out as it did in Europe and as a result directly threatens our long term domestic security then I say the "boys" stay home. If it were 1942 and the conflict was restricted to Germany and they're killing each other (jew or otherwise) then it's NOT a United States Problem. However when the tanks rolled across the polish, Holland, Belgium and others it became a US Problem.

Like I said let the Libyans kill each other! God can sort them out.

I do not think that you can use a blanket policy like that. Most of the conflicts that the US has been involved in should not have been undertaken. Pearl Harbor or not, I believe we would have and should have entered WWII. We are part of the human race and as such I believe that trumps the sole interests of the US. I do not believe we can or should solve all the world problems but I do believe we have an obligation to help those we can. I do not believe we should just sit idly by as people suffer. Situations have to be looked at on a case by case basis. Iraq, Afghan, Egypt, Libya ... no. I think the chance of success is slim and they do not like the west because the west sticks their nose where it does not belong. Other situation do warrant intervention.

I do agree with you that we do not need a presence all over the world. The ability to deploy our forces on short notice if quite advanced and with the money saved on closing international bases, more could be developed on that front.

 

[dapoes]

Well you were never faced with conscription into the military were you? You never faced having to make the decision to go to jail rather than become conscripted into the armed forces as a dupe for US and worldwide business interests as I was now were you?

to me it's like Ali said "I ain't got no quarrel with no Viet Cong"

No I didn't serve, but my family has a long legacy in the military. As my husband and my younger brother. They never thought twice about it. They gladly joined. Its called courage and honor. Something surely lacking in your case.

 

[SparrowHawk]

I do not think that you can use a blanket policy like that. Most of the conflicts that the US has been involved in should not have been undertaken. Pearl Harbor or not, I believe we would have and should have entered WWII. We are part of the human race and as such I believe that trumps the sole interests of the US. I do not believe we can or should solve all the world problems but I do believe we have an obligation to help those we can. I do not believe we should just sit idly by as people suffer. Situations have to be looked at on a case by case basis. Iraq, Afghan, Egypt, Libya ... no. I think the chance of success is slim and they do not like the west because the west sticks their nose where it does not belong. Other situation do warrant intervention.

I do agree with you that we do not need a presence all over the world. The ability to deploy our forces on short notice if quite advanced and with the money saved on closing international bases, more could be developed on that front.

Well of course they have to be looked at on a case by case basis. I was responding to someone who only deals in absolutes. As to WWII if we had not interceded it is highly likely that Hitler's Scientists would have developed the Atomic Bomb and we'd be speaking German.

Conversely our polict of Imperialism and adventurism has caused countless more problems than it solved with WWII being the most notable exception.