U.S. May Ease Rule On Labor Vote

[LukeAisleWalker]

This is actually great news! It really shows the true colors of the AFA.
I WAS all for this coming together quickly, however if we can fly the
A330/747 but not mix the crews? Hey what's a few years. I'd take
it and the AFA will continue to rake in the due's from the PMNW f/a's.....

Of course! This makes perfect sense for people like you...because, as always, it's ALL ABOUT YOU!
YOUR Adays, YOUR trips, YOUR base, you, you, you..
No sense of the collective "we".

in all seriousness this is just sad. The current rules have not stopped
any Unions from getting in, in fact look at the majority of the transportation
system and you will see Unions in every aspect.

OK, I have asked this question on this forum before but no one will answer me.
Please list the last union elections of a size of over, even 5,000 people, and the outcome in recent years. You will find that United, NW, AA, US/Piedmont/Aleghenny, TWA, Braniff, and on and on ...all of their union elections were held years ago with much, much smaller employee groups that didn't have thousands of people on leave, spread out over the globe.
But just keep thinking you're comparing apples to apples but guess what? You're not.
NOTE: I'm NOT talking about changing unions. I am speaking of THIS situation--going(majority) non-union to union.

And for those who talk about anti-AFA supporters.....You know damn well
the same can be said about the AFA supporters and then some. Gotta love
the arrogance.... And hypocrisy.

I never meant to suggest that pro-AFA internet posters are ALL respectful because, of course, they are not. I was pointing out the overall general tone of posters from the two FB sites. They don't even compare in temprament, writing style, command of the English language and more..

One good thing that will come of this....Those who have chosen to remain
quiet in the past as far as whether they want a Union. I think we will
be hearing from them loud and clear. The Silent Majority will be awoken.

Good for them!! It's important to voice your opinions. Just make sure they are INFORMED opinions or you come off looking foolish...this goes for both sides.
And guess what? You might see some of the silent "minority" start speaking out as well. It goes both ways.

Even my Die hard former Pan Am f/s's can't believe the ineptitude of this
Union and will vote NO this go around.

Really, I just flew with 2 of them and they LOVE what's transpired the past 2 days.

Like I said earlier, it's going to be
a bumpy ride, but let me add....fun to watch ;-)

You always were a drama queen. LOL 😀

 

[dapoes]

You are a real grudge-holder, aren't you BB? That's sad.
If you would reread my previous posting, I said (regarding Dignity's stance) "that is your perogative." Where did I "turn on" her?
It's funny that when a contract/union supporter speaks out,asks questions about someone's stance, it is "turning on" someone, yet when a paid hack like dapoes performs her ridiculous, archaic, 1930s "disruption of interstate commerce" gag, it's considered open expression, welcomed opinion, etc..
Careful, your biASs is showing. :down:

Careful Luke, wouldn't want you to be confused with "nastiness and character assassinations" that you so harshly disapprove of others.

 

[LukeAisleWalker]

Careful Luke, wouldn't want you to be confused with "nastiness and character assassinations" that you so harshly disapprove of others.

Dapoes: I'm speaking of REAL character assassinations using REAL people's names, cutting remarks that go right to a named person's reputation and standing within our FA community. I'm not speaking of fake-named internet lurkers like you or "Mya Westmoreland."
By the way, are you admitting to being paid by Ford and Harrison??

 

[dapoes]

Dapoes: I'm speaking of REAL character assassinations using REAL people's names, cutting remarks that go right to a named person's reputation and standing within our FA community. I'm not speaking of fake-named internet lurkers like you or "Mya Westmoreland."
By the way, are you admitting to being paid by Ford and Harrison??

Luke, how many times have we had this discussion? Think what you want, I really could care less about you or your conspiracy theories. I really haven't been paying attention to this section on the forum for a while. I'm over it. Ive moved on, so should you.

 

[southwind]

Of course! This makes perfect sense for people like you...because, as always, it's ALL ABOUT YOU!
YOUR Adays, YOUR trips, YOUR base, you, you, you..
No sense of the collective "we".

And "Socialism" rears its ugly head again !

It's worked so well in other country's too ! :down:

Did you ever stop to think the "WE" you are referring to , are in the minority and should not push their ideas on the majority........................................ by changing the rules !

 

[dapoes]

And "Socialism" rears its ugly head again !

It's worked so well in other country's too ! :down:

That collective mentality worked out so well for the Steel and Auto workers didn't they? Right straight down the toilet. :down:

 

[LukeAisleWalker]

Luke, how many times have we had this discussion?

Maybe once, but I wouldn't call it a "discussion." It was just a flip remark from you...per usual.

I really could care less about you

I know that. I think people of your mindset, or the mindset you've projected on this forum, mostly only care about their own selfish pursuits.

I really haven't been paying attention to this section on the forum for a while.

Now, THAT is truly a laugh-riot!!! Then I guess all those posts from "dapoes" on this thread are from your alter-ego??

I'm over it. Ive moved on, so should you.

Believe me, I've moved on. I only come when there is something interesting to comment on.
Only, you've finally helped me learn that it's really not that interesting reading commentary from the usual posters here, like someone who compares our President to Hitler. Disgusting.
PS: You're NOT over it and you know it.

 

[dapoes]

Of course not, silly...it's about ensuring a democratic process is carried out in the vote.

So humor us. How is the current process not "democratic". Everyone currently has the opportunity to vote, Nobody is denied the right to vote. What part of the democratic process are you fuzzy about? What AFA is wanting is what is more aptly called a Direct Democracy. The election process in the US is more like a Representational Democracy. The framers of the constitution advocated a representative democracy in the form of a constitutional republic over a direct democracy.

For example, James Madison, in Federalist No. 10 advocates a constitutional republic over direct democracy precisely to protect the individual from the will of the majority. He says, "A pure democracy can admit no cure for the mischiefs of faction. A common passion or interest will be felt by a majority, and there is nothing to check the inducements to sacrifice the weaker party.

BTW, do you realize that there is no such word as "Democracy" in the Declaration of Independence or Constitution? Do you know why?

It is a republic as spelled out Article IV Section 4.

The United States shall guarantee to every State in this Union a Republican Form of Government, and shall protect each of them against Invasion; and on Application of the Legislature, or of the Executive (when the Legislature cannot be convened) against domestic Violence.

James Madison defined republic in terms of representative democracy as opposed to only having direct democracy.

The word 'republic' is derived from the Latin phrase res publica which can be translated as "a public thing" or "the law".

Thats why the framers of the constitution choose the rule of law over the rule of the majority.

So when AFA proponents talk about a true democratic process, they really have no idea what they are talking about.

Education lesson over. Thank you.

 

[LukeAisleWalker]

Dapoes,
For someone who is "over it", you certainly don't know when to quit.
You are mixing our form government with the way(s) in which we vote.
For instance, you are correct in saying that we are a republic, however, the way in which we vote for our representatives in this republic is by the majority OF THOSE PARTICIPATING.
All that the NMB (the 2 members anyway) want to know is the INTENT of the voters. A non-vote doesn't necessarily mean the person on the eligibility list intends to not be represented by a union. Why is this so difficult for you to comprehend??
Continue, Googling "Democracy" and "Republic", copying and pasting, and whatever else it is that you are "over" until your fingers fall off. All you do is make yourself look more and more foolish.

 

[Dignity]

The Supreme Court has twice upheld the majority rule, and the Mediation Board has four times rejected requests to change it, as recently as last year. The majority rule has been used in more than 1,850 elections, and unions have won more than 65% of the time

this particular situation appears to reek of bias, because there is an election ongoing that is following the 50 percent plus one format and the conclusion must be it is a fair process.

since the NMB itself has rejected changes upheld by the Supreme Court.. a real concern is simply we will not have an election after 60 days, but an undetermined timeline while it is debated back and forth.

clearly this is not going to serve the group well at all.

knowing for a fact the Union has won significantly in the past,

whats the problem?

there is never going to be a right time.. for someone who is insecure coming to terms regarding the results of an election.

are people just scared to find out how the majority feels and decides or what?

 

[Dignity]

(regarding Dignity's stance) "that is your perogative." Where did I "turn on" her?

thats right just my personal opinion!

its not that the election or someone's view is the issue, but rather, right now.. nothing is being accomplished!

(it would be nice to have at least something filed prior to the SOC...)

should we keep our fingers crossed?

 

[dapoes]

Dapoes,
For someone who is "over it", you certainly don't know when to quit.
You are mixing our form government with the way(s) in which we vote.
For instance, you are correct in saying that we are a republic, however, the way in which we vote for our representatives in this republic is by the majority OF THOSE PARTICIPATING.
All that the NMB (the 2 members anyway) want to know is the INTENT of the voters. A non-vote doesn't necessarily mean the person on the eligibility list intends to not be represented by a union. Why is this so difficult for you to comprehend??
Continue, Googling "Democracy" and "Republic", copying and pasting, and whatever else it is that you are "over" until your fingers fall off. All you do is make yourself look more and more foolish.

Thanks, im happy to know that after all this time, yanking your chain is the sure fire way to send you off the deep end. Box of tissues madam?

 

[LukeAisleWalker]

Thanks, im happy to know that after all this time, yanking your chain is the sure fire way to send you off the deep end. Box of tissues madam?

In this one statement you have proven everything your detractors have been writing about you for years.
You weren't able to refute my argument about voting processes. My having discourse about those processes is hardly someone going "off the deep end."
You were only able to retort with some sort of churlish, vindictive, shallow remark.
I feel sorry for you.

 

[southwind]

That collective mentality worked out so well for the Steel and Auto workers didn't they? Right straight down the toilet. :down:

And don't forget about the UAW @ GM. Oppss, that's right , Me, being a "Tax Paying American" helped save their job, whether I wanted to or not !

How's that for "The Collective" Luke ? :down:

 

[700UW]

I guess you forgot about all the free money the airlines got from our tax dollars after 9/11 and the govt and tax payers got nothing in return.

Ten days after the terrorist attacks, Congress passed a $15 billion aid package for the airline industry: $5 billion in direct cash handouts and $10 billion more in government- backed loan guarantees.

The goliaths of the industry are getting most of the money: $644 million for United, $583 million for American, and $528 million for Delta. America West, the nation's eighth largest carrier, is getting $98 million in direct federal aid..

Funny I didnt see you complain about the $528 Million DL got and never had to pay back and that came from the tax payers, at least with GM they got stock and ownership and will get a return on the loan and investment.