US Airways "gay friendly ranking"

[SparrowHawk]

If you have a group that goes about rating employers based upon how they treat a "group" say a article "Top ten Minority employers" or Top 100 places to work corporations to work for if you're gay" Then the rights issue is on the table. Maybe not the main course but it's there.

DECLARATION OF INDEPENDENCE
James R. Stoner, Jr., Louisiana State University

No public document gives more prominence to the idea of natural law, nor relies more crucially upon natural law as a premise, than the Declaration of Independence. To understand why this is so and what it means for American constitutionalism requires reading the text of the Declaration in its political, historical, and philosophical context.

As a political statement, the Declaration was the culmination of a series issued by the several Continental Congresses, the voluntary associations of representatives of thirteen British colonies in North America that spoke for the colonists as a whole. These documents catalogued grievances against British colonial policy, appealing for the most part to liberties and privileges claimed under the English constitution and the common law. Declarations and petitions of this sort were themselves part of the English constitutional tradition, from Magna Charta in 1215 through the 1689 Bill of Rights.

Rest of the story

Natural Law in the Declaration of Independence
The Declaration of Independence says that all people “are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable rights,” and “that among these are life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness.” [1] Note that it does not say that people ought to have the right to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness, it does not say that general well-being is enhanced when people are allowed such rights, it says that people have these rights as a gift from their Creator.

Thus the founding of the United States is based on the premise that rights are part of the essence of a human, inherent in what it means to be a human being. A government does not grant rights, for these already belong to people. If a person does not enjoy his rights under his government he is not being denied a privilege, he is the victim of a theft.

Simply put, what is assumed in the Declaration of Independence is the existence of a natural law which exists independently of humanity, but is discernible by humans. Right and wrong, according to this idea, are woven into the very fabric of things, and present themselves immediately to human consciousness.

rest of blog

In 539 B.C., the armies of Cyrus the Great, the first king of ancient Persia, conquered the city of Babylon. But it was his next actions that marked a major advance for Man. He freed the slaves, declared that all people had the right to choose their own religion, and established racial equality. These and other decrees were recorded on a baked-clay cylinder in the Akkadian language with cuneiform script.

Known today as the Cyrus Cylinder, this ancient record has now been recognized as the world’s first charter of human rights. It is translated into all six official languages of the United Nations and its provisions parallel the first four Articles of the Universal Declaration of Human Rights.

From Babylon, the idea of human rights spread quickly to India, Greece and eventually Rome. There the concept of “natural law” arose, in observation of the fact that people tended to follow certain unwritten laws in the course of life, and Roman law was based on rational ideas derived from the nature of things. Documents asserting individual rights, such as the Magna Carta (1215), the Petition of Right (1628), the US Constitution (1787), the French Declaration of the Rights of Man and of the Citizen (1789), and the US Bill of Rights (1791) are all examples of the application of Natural law sating from the Cyrus Cylinder, Aristotle through to out founding fathers.

 

[ChockJockey]

If you have a group that goes about rating employers based upon how they treat a "group" say a article "Top ten Minority employers" or Top 100 places to work corporations to work for if you're gay" Then the rights issue is on the table. Maybe not the main course but it's there.

The only thing that webpage has to do with rights is equal rights. Nowhere does it indicate or advocate "special" rights or privileges for specific groups, that was your addition.

In 539 B.C., the armies of Cyrus the Great, the first king of ancient Persia, conquered the city of Babylon. But it was his next actions that marked a major advance for Man. He freed the slaves, declared that all people had the right to choose their own religion, and established racial equality. These and other decrees were recorded on a baked-clay cylinder in the Akkadian language with cuneiform script.

Known today as the Cyrus Cylinder, this ancient record has now been recognized as the world’s first charter of human rights. It is translated into all six official languages of the United Nations and its provisions parallel the first four Articles of the Universal Declaration of Human Rights.

From Babylon, the idea of human rights spread quickly to India, Greece and eventually Rome. There the concept of “natural law” arose, in observation of the fact that people tended to follow certain unwritten laws in the course of life, and Roman law was based on rational ideas derived from the nature of things. Documents asserting individual rights, such as the Magna Carta (1215), the Petition of Right (1628), the US Constitution (1787), the French Declaration of the Rights of Man and of the Citizen (1789), and the US Bill of Rights (1791) are all examples of the application of Natural law sating from the Cyrus Cylinder, Aristotle through to out founding fathers.

🙄
Really? Dodge all of my questions and all you can come up with is to copy and paste other people's historical interpretations? I'm not interested in what those people have to say, they don't post here.

Come on man, this is easy. Just explain, in your own words, how it came to be that a Creator "conferred rights on us", and not group rights, but individual rights, and why we should accept this as plain fact.

 

[Dont call me Shirley]

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if the repub's win in 2012, your gonna learn about animal farm baby....and if your posting here, your the same trash gettin thrown out with me..... welcome to the jungle.........

http://www.englishbaby.com/lessons/grammar/your_vs_youre


Now, back to our topic....I forgot what it was.

 

[UPNAWAY]

Choc Jockey your view is extreme and dangerous and runs counter to history.

If our rights only come from man, they are meaningless and can be taken away by others at any point for any reason. Whatever the next despot decides is as moral as any others ideas if they are not inalienable. I am certain most third world dictators share your view.

 

[gabby]

Maybe we can make an e tea $50 payout if we get in the top three?

 

[nic4us]

Really? Where does the Bible talk about individual political rights?

You have no idea what you're talking about.

You are soooo far off base, it is easy to throw you out.

1. "Give to Caesar what is Caesar's", one of thousands of references in the Bible regarding an individual's political rights.

2. Aristotle died something like 2300+ years ago, and his philosophy was studied throughout the ages. It did not take 1800 years and then all of a sudden somebody in the new world decided to right a declaration of independence and use his ideas for the first time in history.

3. The web page is indeed a special interest group, seeking benefits for members within the group it supports. Nothing fair or impartial about it. No different than if the AARP put out a list of senior friendly corporations.

Chockjokey quote-("Come on man, this is easy. Just explain, in your own words, how it came to be that a Creator "conferred rights on us", and not group rights, but individual rights, and why we should accept this as plain fact")

4. Do you have the right to breath? What gives you that right? I believe you get the right to breath from the same place you get the right to persue "life" "liberty" and "happiness", and yes, that is a very plain fact.

 

[gabby]

Actually the founding ideals of this country was that all men were to be created equal. (Under the law)

Ever hear the expression "All the kings men"? Well it was a term to describe those people that were above the law. People who could rape steal, well all the things we shouldn't do. And get away with it.
Americans wanted nothing to do with the king and all his men.
So they created this country with everyone being punishable under the law. Thus making us all equal. Except for George B.II and Enron CEO's and a host of others...

This is a ultra short version of why america was created.

 

[Phoenix]

....But even if for your sake we assume there is a Creator, what is your justification for arguing that said Creator knowingly and willfully conferred rights to humankind, .... You're right, they weren't perfect, and just because people write things on paper doesn't make them true, even if that paper is The Declaration of Independence....

There has never been a shortage of those who proclaim themselves enemies of self-evident truths. The Declaration of Independence was merely a notice of war to such.

 

[SparrowHawk]

The only thing that webpage has to do with rights is equal rights. Nowhere does it indicate or advocate "special" rights or privileges for specific groups, that was your addition.


🙄
Really? Dodge all of my questions and all you can come up with is to copy and paste other people's historical interpretations? I'm not interested in what those people have to say, they don't post here.

Come on man, this is easy. Just explain, in your own words, how it came to be that a Creator "conferred rights on us", and not group rights, but individual rights, and why we should accept this as plain fact.

For the record, I neither care nor worry what you think feel or are interested in. I've provided information to support an argument. All you have provided is the normal atheist drivel. It has been duly noted and dismissed out of hand.

It is a widely held belief in a higher power than Mankind. It manifests itself as Christian, Muslim, Hindu, Shinto, Judaism and so forth. The notion has been around since recorded time. Even the pagan faiths believe in Mother Earth as a sort of God Head and more. Consistent in all of these faiths and belief systems is the notion of certain rights are conferred upon each individual. Additionally the "Three Fold Rule" of Wicca states that what you do to others comes back to you three times. This again points to the individual and how rights are conferred be they under natural law or spiritual guidance.

Whether our "Creator" is a spiritual, mythical God Head or merely evolution from the Big Bang theory of creation, we none the less have a Creator and the Natural Rights conferred by said Creator and those rights are INDIVIDUAL in Nature.

 

[ChockJockey]

Choc Jockey your view is extreme and dangerous and runs counter to history.

If our rights only come from man, they are meaningless and can be taken away by others at any point for any reason.

My good friend, that history that you claim I run counter too is chock full of examples of exactly this. For the majority of human history, might has made right, and whatever your dearest held beliefs or theories were they didn't account for dung if you couldn't protect them against the approaching phalanxes of your enemies. Whatever, if you want to give me some hemlock I'll be your Socrates...I'll even put a toga on for you...

1. "Give to Caesar what is Caesar's", one of thousands of references in the Bible regarding an individual's political rights.

lol, that was Christ telling his followers to submit to civil authority (and pay their taxes). Reading that a basis for a doctrine of rights is wishful thinking, at best. Thousands, really?

2. Aristotle died something like 2300+ years ago, and his philosophy was studied throughout the ages. It did not take 1800 years and then all of a sudden somebody in the new world decided to right a declaration of independence and use his ideas for the first time in history.

That's not what I was trying to say. My claim is that the idea of rights, like most abstractions, came about through an evolutionary process. That is in fact exactly my claim, that rights and the idea of rights are a product of human reflection and experience and not some divine gift that sat on a heavenly shelf for 4.5 billion years waiting to be "conferred".

3. The web page is indeed a special interest group, seeking benefits for members within the group it supports. Nothing fair or impartial about it. No different than if the AARP put out a list of senior friendly corporations.

Yep, and group advocacy and freedom of speech are things we can all enjoy living in this really cool country.

4. Do you have the right to breath? What gives you that right? I believe you get the right to breath from the same place you get the right to persue "life" "liberty" and "happiness", and yes, that is a very plain fact.

I breathe just as well whether I've a right to or not. I have a right to breathe only by virtue of my willingness to defend my ability to do so. As such, that right, and the means and will to maintain it come all from me.

For the record, I neither care nor worry what you think feel or are interested in. I've provided information to support an argument. All you have provided is the normal atheist drivel. It has been duly noted and dismissed out of hand.

Concession accepted. B)

It is a widely held belief in a higher power than Mankind. It manifests itself as Christian, Muslim, Hindu, Shinto, Judaism and so forth. The notion has been around since recorded time. Even the pagan faiths believe in Mother Earth as a sort of God Head and more. Consistent in all of these faiths and belief systems is the notion of certain rights are conferred upon each individual. Additionally the "Three Fold Rule" of Wicca states that what you do to others comes back to you three times. This again points to the individual and how rights are conferred be they under natural law or spiritual guidance.

I also believe in higher powers than mankind, but I'm not so arrogant or ignorant to presume that in all of the universe, the inner and individual workings of the human species is their foremost concern. I see those religions and strains of faith you mentioned as the best attempts of ancient peoples to make sense of their worlds and build societies with only the tools and means they had; what couldn't be explained or if something was thought to be very important the people were told that it was the will/work of their respective higher power. Deus ex machina. People still do it all the time, every day.

Whether our "Creator" is a spiritual, mythical God Head or merely evolution from the Big Bang theory of creation, we none the less have a Creator and the Natural Rights conferred by said Creator and those rights are INDIVIDUAL in Nature.

lol, okay bud. I guess the difference between you and I is that I'm able to value, love, and protect my rights without having to sugar-coat adorn them with otherwordly ribbons and bows...

Oh and congrats to US Airways for our relatively high placement on this list. I think it's great to be working somewhere that recognizes the value of diversity and equality.

 

[SparrowHawk]

lol, okay bud. I guess the difference between you and I is that I'm able to value, love, and protect my rights without having to sugar-coat adorn them with otherwordly ribbons and bows...

Oh and congrats to US Airways for our relatively high placement on this list. I think it's great to be working somewhere that recognizes the value

I'll concede that the ranking is "Nice" it is however not necessary in order to promote individual Freedom and Liberty. I'm just not wired as a collectivist by nature. Not because I think it evil or misguided, just not part of me. I don't belong or go to a Church or work a Union job. For me both are equally unhealthy mentally & emotionally. I prefer life as a road warrior and individual contributor. No desire to lead the flock even though at times I have.

To me it's simple, Chock Jockey has rights, Sparrowhawk, UPNAWAY, Phoenix all have rights. However, there are no "Aviation junkie" rights. 😀