USAPA/ALPA US Pilot Labor Thread 5/10-5/17

[Richard]

OK pick it up here--and do not make it personal.

 

[uSAPs Need 2 B United]

Long time lurker who would like to get a straight answer from USAirways East. Why the hysterical effort to convince the America West pilots that UAL is a bad thing for them? UAL clearly will not go for Date of Hire. UAL pilots will clearly dictate the terms of the labor integration to Parker and who gets cut. UAL pilots clearly know what they are dealing with in terms of US Airways East. UAL will surely mean the immediate return of ALPA to both properties. With the East basically defacating in Herndon's livingroom after having been totally placated by ALPA, do you guys really believe that you haven't totally screwed yourselves at this point? Do you really believe you will have any credibility once you are back in ALPA? Do you realize that you are facing a total acceptance of Nicolau, with the East absorbing a sizable portion of the synergies in order to placate UAL ALPA? Anyone? Bueller?

 

[fr8tmastr]

Clearly this was not a sincere series of questions

 

[NiceLandingCaptain]

Clearly this was not a sincere series of questions

As usual, no eastie has been able to answer any of the hard questions - ever.

So hey, here's an easy one. King of usapa has received official contact information for every pilot in the company. King of usapa is now responsible for representing every pilot in the company. Yet no west pilot has been provided any information from usapa on exactly what this neo-union intends to do for them. How come no contact? Too low on funds? Scared? Inept? Or what? :blink:

By the way, this is likely the last week this thread will be called usapa/ALPA US Pilot thread. Soon it will be ALPA/usapa/ALPA US/United Pilot labor thread. Notice there's two ALPA's for every usapa.........hahaha King of usapa has no clothes.....HAHAha!!!!!

 

[uSAPs Need 2 B United]

Clearly this was not a sincere series of questions

You don't need to answer all of them. Just one will suffice.

Take care. And good luck too!!! You're really going to need it this time.

 

[sharktooth]

Long time lurker who would like to get a straight answer from USAirways East. Why the hysterical effort to convince the America West pilots that UAL is a bad thing for them?

I have not seen that. Please provide examples, especially the "hysterical" ones.

UAL pilots will clearly dictate the terms of the labor integration to Parker and who gets cut.

and UAL is dictating those terms to another corporation from a position of strength, I assume. I've got popcorn. I'd really like to see this.

With the East basically defacating in Herndon's livingroom after having been totally placated by ALPA, do you guys really believe that you haven't totally screwed yourselves at this point?

It was ALPA that placed the largest pilot base in trusteeship after the reps refused to run counter to their constituents will and fondle ALPAs gonads, all the while ALPA supported the second largest pilot base reps for ignoring a completely legal request for recall being placed on a regular meeting agenda. Who represents who? It seems the largest base reps have integrity, the second largest and ALPA National, not in a million years. I think your comment including defecating and placated would be completely reversed were you familiar with what happened ... when you get information second hand, it sure is difficult to post in an intelligent fashion.

 

[Pi brat]

Long time lurker who would like to get a straight answer from USAirways East. Why the hysterical effort to convince the America West pilots that UAL is a bad thing for them? UAL clearly will not go for Date of Hire. UAL pilots will clearly dictate the terms of the labor integration to Parker and who gets cut. UAL pilots clearly know what they are dealing with in terms of US Airways East. UAL will surely mean the immediate return of ALPA to both properties. With the East basically defacating in Herndon's livingroom after having been totally placated by ALPA, do you guys really believe that you haven't totally screwed yourselves at this point? Do you really believe you will have any credibility once you are back in ALPA? Do you realize that you are facing a total acceptance of Nicolau, with the East absorbing a sizable portion of the synergies in order to placate UAL ALPA? Anyone? Bueller?

There is no answering your questions because you have all the answers. I can't say what will happen in a US/UAL merger, but from my merger experience, I don't think it will be pretty for any US pilot. Why do you think UAL will distinguish between east and west? I think we are all US to them. They will protect themselves as any group would do.

 

[LGA Fleet Service]

Could that signature picture be any frickin' larger? Seriously.

 

[EastUS]

Long time lurker who would like to get a straight answer from USAirways East. .

"Why the hysterical effort to convince the America West pilots that UAL is a bad thing for them?" "hysterical"?..Umm..correct me if I'm in error here, but your (originally/since moderated)billboard-sized signature picture is of a actor playing the part of a psychotic gang leader, and cowardly assassin, clinking beer bottles together, and rejoicing in the hopeful notions of imminent future murders (The Warriors/1980 I think)...is it not? Wait,... it is that film. I earlier missed your designer signature = "“Waaaarrrrrriiiorsss, come out to pla-ay!”. No matter...just seeking to establish some zone within which to determine any proper reference degrees of "hysterical" :blink:

I've many concerns about ANY merger, and don't personally feel that one with UA's anything worth sounding trumpets over. I'm very concerned with "marriage" to an entity that's currently bleeding money from all major arteries, and evaluating significant, if not ultimately enormous reductions...but; all are entitled to their opiinions, both east/west/wherever and whomever. As far as whether or not this merger will happen?; Inking any deal's not much up to any of us, and it really doesn't much matter what employees think about that, when countered by the many millions that upper management can immediately pocket for themselves. Refresh my memory: Did anyone "vote" on the last one? 😉

"UAL clearly will not go for Date of Hire." They'll try to look out for their group's best interests...

"UAL pilots will clearly dictate the terms of the labor integration to Parker and who gets cut." How you figure that's a bit mysterious, but only time and events will tell.

"UAL will surely mean the immediate return of ALPA to both properties" It seems very likely that alpa would tragically be "back", but not so likely that it'd be as "immediate" as you may assume. Again..we'll have to see how things unfold.

"Do you realize that you are facing a total acceptance of Nicolau,...with the East absorbing a sizable portion of the synergies in order to placate UAL ALPA? Anyone?"
Nothing's impossible in the future, but I make no assumptions until events take shape. "You won't even get 200 cards!"...Remember? 😉

"With the East basically defacating in Herndon's livingroom after having been totally placated by ALPA, do you guys really believe that you haven't totally screwed yourselves at this point? Do you really believe you will have any credibility once you are back in ALPA?" I couldn't give the smallest hair off a hamster's hind end about what alpa "thinks". I'd first have to have even the slightest respect for that pustule of corruption and ineptitude..and I hardly believe in basing any future concerns on ANY level of "fear-based" frets or thoughts in any case. I don't need this job, and have only a very few years left of airlining around to go, regardless of what's on the industry horizon. My "beef" was/is with ALPA, and there's little need to attempt any condensed rehashing of all I find contemptible, corrupt, and entirely dysfunctional. I'd love to see ALPA, as it currently exists, become extinct, for the simple reason that it's served to do nothing other than sabotage the nation's commercial pilots for many years now, and I expect no changes in that sorry trend in the forseeable future. My thinking was and is, that dumping Alpa is both a principled and reasonable action. If there are to be, as you so gently imply, any adversarial consequences to doing so...know that I would do exactly the same thing again, and consider any/all still supportive of alpa to be at best, short-sighted, and at worst...just a buncha' self-serving drones, with zero actual concern for the piloting profession.....period. I believe it's incumbent on any person holding actual principles of any serious sort, to always strive to do what's Right..even it such might, in the most severe of circumstance, require sacrificing one's life...much less merely putting up with some irritation at any workplace..This stuff I don't lose sleep over 😉

"UAL pilots clearly know what they are dealing with in terms of US Airways East." I hope so.

PS: I see that your previously "billboard-sized" signature pic, which was the size of a full post card, has been reduced by a moderator to tiny icon size, so excuse the initial reference 😉

 

[dariencc]

As usual, no eastie has been able to answer any of the hard questions - ever.

I think EastUS just did.

So hey, here's an easy one. King of usapa has received official contact information for every pilot in the company. King of usapa is now responsible for representing every pilot in the company. Yet no west pilot has been provided any information from usapa on exactly what this neo-union intends to do for them. How come no contact? Too low on funds? Scared? Inept? Or what? :blink:

Exactly when did USAPA receive the contact information, Brainchild? The answer to that question would explain the lack of contact you bemoan. Patience.

Too low on funds? Hardly. Plenty of cash in the till, and the company has even begun advancing USAPA money as it works through the dues checkoff backlog.

Scared? Now that is rich, coming from one who trembles at the thought of routine fuel management during ETOPS operations.

By the way, this is likely the last week this thread will be called usapa/ALPA US Pilot thread. Soon it will be ALPA/usapa/ALPA US/United Pilot labor thread. Notice there's two ALPA's for every usapa.........hahaha King of usapa has no clothes.....HAHAha!!!!!

You should really consider changing your screen name, since this is a public site. Might be best not letting on that you are a "Captain" for our fine airline. <_<

 

[EastUS]

As usual, no eastie has been able to answer any of the hard questions - ever.

So... What's your question? Attitude hardly constitutes any inquiry.

 

[ableoneable]

Check this out.

Prater and friends appear determined to drive ALPA into the ground.

Even if there is a UAL merger ALPA may not be around.

This is from PSA's hotline. 1-800-4JTSFLY

ITEM 5: ALPA National Updates
5a: In light of the recent or impending loss of a large number of
pilots from ALPA, including those from US Airways, America West,
Skyway, Aloha, ATA, and Champion, ALPA faces a significant shortfall
in its operating budget from diminished dues revenues. The ALPA
Executive Council and Executive Board, at its recent meeting this
week, took action on two items that will help close the gap on this
funding shortfall.
The first initiative passed by the Council and the Board were the
adoption of two resolutions to change both the Constitution and By-
Laws and the Administrative Manual to allow 401(k) contributions to
be subject to ALPA dues for all ALPA pilots. Current policy exempts
401(k) contributions from dues if a 401(k) plan is the only form of
retirement plan available to a pilot group, such as here at PSA. If a
pilot group had access to a Defined Contribution or similar plan,
their 401(k) contributions would be subject to dues. With the
freezing or elimination of virtually all of these available plans at
those carriers, the pilots of those carriers find themselves paying
dues on 401(k) contributions while that plan is their sole remaining
retirement vehicle. In the interest of fairness and with
consideration of the fiscal shortfall, the Council and Board adopted
the proposed resolutions to subject all 401(k) contributions to ALPA
dues. This change will not take effect until it is approved by a 2/3
majority vote of the Board of Directors.
The second initiative passed by the Council and the Board was the
adoption of a resolution to change the way LEC surpluses are handled
by the Association. Currently, LEC budgets are funded from the
Administrative and Support (A&S) account based on a per capita rate
for each pilot in that domicile, with any LEC budget surpluses at the
end of the year being credited to that airline's MEC account for use
in the future. The resolution adopted by the Council and Board will
change policy to direct any LEC budget surpluses back to the A&S
account at the end of each year. This change will help close the
shortfall in A&S account funding and preserve the services available
to pilots, LEC's, and MEC's from the Association.

If this passes people are going to be canceling their DCO at a furious pace.

 

[EastUS]

Check this out.

Prater and friends appear determined to drive ALPA into the ground.

Even if there is a UAL merger ALPA may not be around.




If this passes people are going to be canceling their DCO at a furious pace.

"Golly!..Gee!" Why am I not surprised in the slightest? 🙄 Porky Prater and the Porcine-Princess-Prancers up at Herndon can't afford to "miss lunch"...nor THEIR ridiculous, paid-by-line-pilots, hefty pensions/salaries/housing allowances/expense accounts/limos/etc. I'm guessing that I"m not the only one wryly noting that, after the great brains and steel spines in Alpa tossed away the piloting professions' pensions and futures wholesale...that they're "back for more", purely for their own purposes. For the futures of actual, working line pilots they allegedly "represent"..and even if with nothing more than pitiful wages and merely a 401K?...Well..in prances Porky: "Badeee, Badeee..That's all folks!" Words simply fail me..and not enough pilots, nationwide..yet "get it" it seems...but..times do change.

Are there any devout Alpoids waiting in the wings to chime in on this latest? 🙄

For myself?...I'll stick with: "I'd love to see ALPA, as it currently exists, become extinct, for the simple reason that it's served to do nothing other than sabotage the nation's commercial pilots for many years now, and I expect no changes in that sorry trend in the forseeable future. My thinking was and is, that dumping Alpa is both a principled and reasonable action."

 

[Bear96]

From your predictable response, can we assume this means one day if (when) USAPA has to raise dues (if it is around that long), you will have the same type of reaction?

 

[767jetz]

It was ALPA that placed the largest pilot base in trusteeship

Yes, by no fault of their own in your eyes, no doubt. Interesting how the East is always the victim and never has any responsibility in anything that happens to them.