What to do about Columbus??

[N905AW]

The problem with the possibility of Dash-8's coming into Columbus is that they are flown by Mesa. Since Mesa will no longer be operating as America West Express in Columbus by late this year, I don't think there's much of a chance of seeing those aircraft in CMH.

What I would like to see is for Chautauqua to receive some ERJ-135's, as well as ERJ-170's, to fly under the America West Express banner. As previously stated, cities like Toledo, Flint and Louisville could probably do very well with service to Columbus. CMH could serve as an excellent alternative to fortress hubs such as CVG and ORD, as well as provide more low-fare service to these cities. However, a smaller aircraft than the ERJ-145 would probably be needed. The ERJ-135 seats as many people as a Dash-8, and would complement Chautauqua's current fleet of ERJ-145's and ERJ-140's.

In addition, I think Chautauqua really needs to get a larger RJ to serve as America West Express from CMH. Flights to cities such as Toronto and Baltimore from Columbus are constantly overbooked and could definitely warrant a larger aircraft, but not as large as an A319 or a 737-300. CRJ-700's would be great, however they are Mesa jets and will probably stay West of the Mississippi. Bringing in the ERJ-170 would expand the number of available seats to these cities as well as bring the possibility for new routes from CMH, such as MSY and MCI.

In order to make connecting through CMH more appealing though, America West should really add more Western destinations from Columbus, mainly Seattle and San Francisco. We currently have a one-stop flight to SEA through PHX, which many people do take advantage of. It would be great if America West would build on it and start nonstop service between the two cities. Not only would it quell the O&D demand for the flights, but bring another connection opportunity for cities in the America West system from Columbus.

While these enhancements would be nice, they're not very praticle at the moment. As previously stated, look for most of America West's expansion to stay in Phoenix. Hopefully, eventually, America West will resume expansion plans for their hub in Columbus.

 

[Columbia blue]

OK...Mesa is going to be out of CMH...(and it only took about 4 posts for me to figure it out)[] I still will argue the point to build up Columbus..although the Saab's just arent going to cut it..Why? Because pax hate flying them. Yes PHX is the emphasis certainly, but if you put all your eggs in one basket..well that's great..but what if the basket breaks?? AWA is too dependent on PHX. LAS is too low yield and LAX is fine but tough to expand there with all the WN-B6 fare wars going on. That leaves CMH and the field stations...take your pick. Oh by the way...a few weeks ago it was reported that CAK had a double digit rise in pax traffic, bucking the national trend.[:bigsmile:]

 

[alphafloor]

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On 8/30/2002 12:09:34 AM


What I would like to see is for Chautauqua to receive some ERJ-135's, as well as ERJ-170's, to fly under the America West Express banner.

I would like to see AWA stop subsidizing Chautaqua's losing operation in CMH and begin operating the necessary aircraft themselves. According to the 7-year plan submitted to the ATSB (SEC website), the Chautaqua operation is forecast to lose millions of dollars per year for every year of the 7 year plan. Chautaqua (or Mesa for that matter)isn't entitled to be sheltered from the effects of a turbulent industry, especially when that protection comes at the expense of AWA personnel and their career progression.

If any major can operate their own small-jets (and they can), it's AWA.

 

[N905AW]

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On 8/30/2002 1118 AM

I would like to see AWA stop subsidizing Chautaqua's losing operation in CMH and begin operating the necessary aircraft themselves. According to the 7-year plan submitted to the ATSB (SEC website), the Chautaqua operation is forecast to lose millions of dollars per year for every year of the 7 year plan.

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I don't think I really understand your message. Do you mean that since America West has a regional affiliate flying RJ routes out of Columbus that the airline is therefore loosing money, since they could fly the routes themselves? Or do you mean that the flights to cities such as Boston, Philadelphia, and Toronto are themselves loosing money? Was Mesa loosing money in CMH before Chautauqua came in last year to takeover operations? Mesa RJ's were introduced to the CMH hub in 1998 to replace mainline jets and add more frequencies to cities along the East Coast. Is there something on the ATSB's website that could shed more light on the situation? I find this somewhat disturbing.

 

[TomBascom]

There would be a lot of local interest in Northern New England if MHT were to be served by HP. WN is already there though.

 

[motnot]

AWA needs to establish itself in all the good non-LUV cities before it adds somewhere like MHT. I think that's why AWA's avoided MHT and PVD while serving BDL and BOS.

Given the booming tech industry in New Hampshire, I'd expect MHT to be the second LUV city added to AWA's route system (after BNA).

But I think we'll see CLT, CVG and MEM. The first two would be big successes, IMO, given the ludicrous fares U and DAL have there. Actually, I could see AWA holding off on CVG awhile, just because a lot of people drive from there to CMH and IND for reasonably priced tickets.

 

[TomBascom]

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AWA needs to establish itself in all the good non-LUV cities before it adds somewhere like MHT. I think that's why AWA's avoided MHT and PVD while serving BDL and BOS.

That makes sense.

But I think we'll see CLT, CVG and MEM. The first two would be big successes, IMO, given the ludicrous fares U and DAL have there. Actually, I could see AWA holding off on CVG awhile, just because a lot of people drive from there to CMH and IND for reasonably priced tickets.

Why not expand PHL considerably? Sky high fares and a lot of pissed (or scared) passengers with pretty limited service west of PIT... No need to compete with LUV there.

 

[lowfareair]

I'd vote for PHL too. There are four empty gates right now, and they already share a couple with CO right next to the empty ones. Although FL is moving into two of the vacant gates, a deal could be negotiated.

 

[alphafloor]

The 7 year plan is available on the SEC website.

If RJ operators want to strike out on their own (no pun intended) and provide connecting service out of airports served by major airlines, more power to them. But for any airline in these times to act as an incubator for lower-cost alter-egos is, IMHO, a perfect example of corporate irresponsibility.

 

[N905AW]

Okay, now I understand what you mean. Thanks for explaining it a bit further.

 

[motnot]

As for PHL gates, from what I understand from reading documents available on the airport's Web site, AirTran has two gates in the "commuter" terminal and will be getting four new ones in being built as part of an expansion in another terminal (then relinquishing the other two).

 

[motnot]

Expanding in PHL has always been my AWA dream. It's a market desperately in need of low-fare service. But even with U really in no position to retaliate against AWA, I think a move like that is one that will lose money. And that's the last thing any airline needs to do right.

But AWA's getting so close to breakeven, who knows, if National Airlines folds in LAS and the overall picture in the industry improves, AWA could be profitable in the next few months and that could open the door to some interesting possibilities.

But I still think anything happening in PHL is a long shot.

BTW, lowfareair mentioned some gates being open in PHL. Who vacated these, because as far as I knew, all gates were filled. That's the logistical problem with expanding in PHL.

 

[lowfareair]

>>As for PHL gates, from what I understand from reading documents available on the airport's Web site, AirTran has two gates in the "commuter" terminal and will be getting four new ones in being built as part of an expansion in another terminal (then relinquishing the other two).<<

That is apparently the old plan. Now that AAI has BWI, the new one is to only get two gates and keep the flights they have, maybe slowly adding up to 6-8 more flights over time. BWI is the new player.

 

[MiAAmi]

I see CMH-RSW is back this winter

 

[7.5victim]

'Tis true, FL currently operates from the commuter terminal at PHL. Saw the 717's while I was waiting for my RJ to CLE.
[]

HP announced additional CMH-YYZ service today:

http://biz.yahoo.com/prnews/020904/law059_1.html

PHL can't look as good is it did before the Ch. 11 filing. Now US can afford to fight HP's lower fare structure a little more. Of course, the fact that they just p***** off all their high level Dividend Miles members might make it a good time to jump in the market with some status comps to FlightFund....