Who Needs Safety?

[ualdriver]

UniTED even set the precedence at other Legacy Carriers to shed their heavy maintenance responsibilities in lew of supposedly cheaper and better quality maintenance services at the MRO'S.

[post="273973"][/post]​

Actually, that is not true for a couple of reasons. One, I doubt that our management (or any airline management, for that matter) thinks they'll get better QUALITY maintenance by outsourcing. I'm sure they realize that if they hired the best people they could find to design and execute a maintenance program for their own aircraft, they'd probaby be able to obtain better quality, especially in the long run. Management doesn't want the best "quality." They want ADEQUATE quality. And ADEQUATE quality maintence is cheaper than BEST quality maintenance. So they'll outsource to obtain cheaper, ADEQUATE quality maintenance rather than pay more for the BEST quality maintenance.

Two, there's a reason why UAL is outsourcing maintenance. Most of our low cost competitors do in one form or another! Since AMR, DAL, NWA are no longer our "real" competitors anymore and haven't been for years, we have to do what the Frontier's, JetBlue's, AirTran's of the world do. If they're outsourcing and getting it done more cheaply, so do we. It's pretty simple. And before you come up with, "Well airline X does Y and Z maintenance in house.........," we know that. But other airlines don't, and that's the problem. We have to have cheap maintenance across the board by outsourcing or we're at a competitive disadvantage. And considering we spent 3/4 of a billion dollars in maintenance last year, it's can be a big disadvantage. It sucks, but the bar keeps getting set lower and lower in other areas besides labor pay!

 

[Bob Owens]

Actually, that is not true for a couple of reasons. One, I doubt that our management (or any airline management, for that matter) thinks they'll get better QUALITY maintenance by outsourcing. I'm sure they realize that if they hired the best people they could find to design and execute a maintenance program for their own aircraft, they'd probaby be able to obtain better quality, especially in the long run. Management doesn't want the best "quality." They want ADEQUATE quality. And ADEQUATE quality maintence is cheaper than BEST quality maintenance. So they'll outsource to obtain cheaper, ADEQUATE quality maintenance rather than pay more for the BEST quality maintenance.

Two, there's a reason why UAL is outsourcing maintenance. Most of our low cost competitors do in one form or another! Since AMR, DAL, NWA are no longer our "real" competitors anymore and haven't been for years, we have to do what the Frontier's, JetBlue's, AirTran's of the world do. If they're outsourcing and getting it done more cheaply, so do we. It's pretty simple. And before you come up with, "Well airline X does Y and Z maintenance in house.........," we know that. But other airlines don't, and that's the problem. We have to have cheap maintenance across the board by outsourcing or we're at a competitive disadvantage. And considering we spent 3/4 of a billion dollars in maintenance last year, it's can be a big disadvantage. It sucks, but the bar keeps getting set lower and lower in other areas besides labor pay!

[post="274014"][/post]​

Yea AMR is not the "real" competitor with over 1000 aircraft and a route system that serves more of the same cities as UAL than anyone else, its Jet Blue with their 60 airplanes out of JFK that pose the real threat.

Give me a break! The fact is that if you said that the other major carriers were your Real competitors you would not have the excuse to go after the workers.

Maybe UAL needs Jet Blues and Airtrans pilot cost structure?

 

[ualdriver]

Maybe UAL needs Jet Blues and Airtrans pilot cost structure?

[post="274020"][/post]​

Ummmm, Bob? Our narrowbody guys (737/A320) already make less in TOTAL compensation and HOURLY compensation than those guys flying the same (737/A320) airplane now that we've lost our pensions. Not even counting the time and half the JB guys get above 70 hours. I think I'd switch contracts with any of those guys if I could.

Bob, AMR is not the competition UAL is worried about, nor should it be. Being "big" doesn't mean better. UAL was the biggest airline in the world for many years and you can see what that got us. If you look at the "big picture," Bob, it's not AMR or DAL or NWA that put us into Chapter 11. It was the combination of SWA, JetBlue, AirTran, Frontier, etc., slowly growing, slowly nibbling, constantly undercutting, slowing stealing market share. I kind of laughed when I read the following sarcastic statement from you: "Yea AMR is not the "real" competitor with over 1000 aircraft and a route system that serves more of the same cities as UAL than anyone else, its Jet Blue with their 60 airplanes out of JFK that pose the real threat." Bob, that's probably one of the most ignorant statements you've written. It's the same kind of ignorance from UAL's management and unions, for that matter, that got us exactly where we are today. I'm sure UAL management laughed at the threat posed by SWA when they "only" had 60 airplanes. I'm sure DAL laughed when a little upstart low cost carrier called Valujet started ops in ATL just a few years back. "They only have 20 airplanes!" they'd laugh. Funny.

Don't worry Bob. AMR with those 1000 airplanes are safe from the likes of JetBlue and others with significantly fewer airplanes. Don't forget- "full pay to the last day!"

 

[mrfish3726]

ualdriver,

Frontier doesn't outsource maintenance, it is done in house here in Denver!!!

 

[Fly]

ualdriver,

Frontier doesn't outsource maintenance, it is done in house here in Denver!!!

[post="274069"][/post]​

Note to anyone considering flying out of Denver:



Holy ####!!!!! This guy is doing maintenance on your plane!!!!!

 

[N230UA]

remove before flight