AMT morale in the toilet

[Hackman]

<_< ---- So if we had the AMFA vote today, do you feel it would turn out the same way? :huh:

One scenario is for certain, manAAgement would again lie, cheat, and steal to keep its lapdog twu "Working Together" and on the property at all costs.

The bigger question would be if MCI would again fight the drive to dump the twu???

 

[Wretched Wrench]

That would be a good question for MCI and Tulsa, the rest of us still are ready for a change.

Since the NWA debacle, I don't hear much pro-AMFA comment from the boys. The TWU is hated even more, but AMFA is not as attractive as it once was.

 

[Ken MacTiernan]

Since the NWA debacle, I don't hear much pro-AMFA comment from the boys. The TWU is hated even more, but AMFA is not as attractive as it once was.

"Attractive" is what I want in a democratic, craft union. If I can vote for all elected positions AND if I don't think my ELECTED officers are doing a well enough job I want the ability to ELECT them out of office. THAT has always been AMFA's structure. I find that attractive.

I did NOT elect ANY twu atd int. officer into office.

Now, someone asked the question if things would be different if AMFA was on the property. The answer is YES and NO.

NO: Things would remain the same in the sense that management would continue to lie and increase their greed at the workers expense.

YES: Things would change because with AMFA there will be people willing to fight FOR the members and not AGAINST the members. Many future AMFA officers will have been twu LOCAL officers. There are many. The difference will be at the International level.

AMFA will allow full information going to the membership. The company will continue to chant slogans and mantras, ie, "Shared Sacrifice", "Pull together-Win Together" (my favorite ). But AA AMFA officers will not be swallowing the smoke & mirror effects. With an International that doesn't get effected by concessions why should the twu fight for our craft at AA?

I believe that with AMFA representing AA AMTs we will be better informed and protected. Because with AMFA the AMTs are the union. With the twu it is the international that is the union. The AMTs are simply metal cut outs of ducks on a conveyer belt with bulls-eyes painted on them.

 

[Hackman]

Since the NWA debacle, I don't hear much pro-AMFA comment from the boys. The TWU is hated even more, but AMFA is not as attractive as it once was.

You call the NWA AMFA strike a "debacle" (even thought it cost Stealin' a cool $100 million and BK). What would you have called it if AMFA just played possum and rolled over like the twu has for 25 years??? A "debacle"???

What will be your solution if/when the compAAny decides in 2008 they don't want our sevices anymore because we just can't give them enough twu concessions, and they lock and load the cannon pointed at us???

Will you run or will you fight??? Would you vote for the contract that cuts 50% of the M@R heads and another 20% paycut of those left???

Again......WILL YOU RUN, OR WILL YOU FIGHT???

 

[TWU informer]

because we just can't give them enough twu concessions,

I wonder if there is such a thing?

 

[Bear96]

You call the NWA AMFA strike a "debacle" (even thought it cost Stealin' a cool $100 million and BK).

What would you call it -- "labor's finest moment"?

What would you have called it if AMFA just played possum and rolled over like the twu has for 25 years???

Thanks to NW management outsmarting them every step of the way, and hoardes of qualified mechanics willing to do their job for less, they were in a no-win situation. Therefore their choice was either (1) to be employed possums, (2) to be unemployed strikers, or (3) to leave the crazy airline mechanic world and go get a job that you feel more appropriately rewards you for your skills.

What will be your solution if/when the compAAny decides in 2008 they don't want our sevices anymore because we just can't give them enough twu concessions, and they lock and load the cannon pointed at us???

I predict possums.

 

[High Speed Steel]

"Attractive" is what I want in a democratic, craft union. If I can vote for all elected positions AND if I don't think my ELECTED officers are doing a well enough job I want the ability to ELECT them out of office. THAT has always been AMFA's structure. I find that attractive.

I did NOT elect ANY twu atd int. officer into office.

Now, someone asked the question if things would be different if AMFA was on the property. The answer is YES and NO.

NO: Things would remain the same in the sense that management would continue to lie and increase their greed at the workers expense.

YES: Things would change because with AMFA there will be people willing to fight FOR the members and not AGAINST the members. Many future AMFA officers will have been twu LOCAL officers. There are many. The difference will be at the International level.

AMFA will allow full information going to the membership. The company will continue to chant slogans and mantras, ie, "Shared Sacrifice", "Pull together-Win Together" (my favorite ). But AA AMFA officers will not be swallowing the smoke & mirror effects. With an International that doesn't get effected by concessions why should the twu fight for our craft at AA?

I believe that with AMFA representing AA AMTs we will be better informed and protected. Because with AMFA the AMTs are the union. With the twu it is the international that is the union. The AMTs are simply metal cut outs of ducks on a conveyer belt with bulls-eyes painted on them.

You say the AMFA structure is "attractive" and you desire for the ability to vote upon each position filled within the international.

How exactly do the candidates campaign for such required positions?

Do the required positions go unfilled until you have the opportunity to have your say?

I don't see how you could possibly function as an association, without appointments to required positions.

 

[Wretched Wrench]

You call the NWA AMFA strike a "debacle" (even thought it cost Stealin' a cool $100 million and BK). What would you have called it if AMFA just played possum and rolled over like the twu has for 25 years??? A "debacle"???

What will be your solution if/when the compAAny decides in 2008 they don't want our sevices anymore because we just can't give them enough twu concessions, and they lock and load the cannon pointed at us???

Will you run or will you fight??? Would you vote for the contract that cuts 50% of the M@R heads and another 20% paycut of those left???

Again......WILL YOU RUN, OR WILL YOU FIGHT???

Hopefully, I can cash in my chips and retire. I'm tired.

 

[eolesen]

Hopefully, I can cash in my chips and retire. I'm tired.

I doubt AA will do a buy-out if they haven't done one yet for the TWU, so why wait for retirement? Leaving AA has probably added 10 years to my life, a lot more to my checking account, and that in turn will enable me to consider retiring 5 to 10 years earlier than if I'd stayed at AA...

 

[High Speed Steel]

I doubt AA will do a buy-out if they haven't done one yet for the TWU, so why wait for retirement? Leaving AA has probably added 10 years to my life, a lot more to my checking account, and that in turn will enable me to consider retiring 5 to 10 years earlier than if I'd stayed at AA...

ModerAAtor, I don't think taking the position of a "smart a$$" was respective in response to Mr. Wrench :angry:

He only expressed his desire to retire.

If he is eligible. I encourage him to enjoy the opportunity, and wish him only the best.

 

[Hackman]

What would you call it -- "labor's finest moment"? This isn't NWA bear69, but I'll address your rant. I call it "Dougies $100 million dollar gamble with an airline". Looks like it might be a big Chapter 13 failure on his part in the near future. That's where its heading. Will that then be a win for the AMFA strikers?? Yes and no, but the albatross will be around the neck of Dougie Stealin' and his band of management a$$holes

Thanks to NW management outsmarting them every step of the way, No, it was AMFA's following of the tainted RLA and not going out on a wild cat while Dougies' scabs were training in Arizona. If AMFA would have gone on strike after finding out about the "scab plan" and broke the law like management did (not bargaining at all and hiring scabs a year in advance), the outcome would have been the near immediate flushing of Scab Air, instead of the slow death underway.

and hoardes of qualified mechanics willing to do their job for less, they were in a no-win situation. Nay, the bottom of the barrel, lied to by NWA and many have quit. Also 72% of the NWA AMFA strikers have resigned

Therefore their choice was either (1) to be employed possums, Not an option, Dougie wanted them (AMFA) locked out.

(2) to be unemployed strikers, Majority voted to go on strike, simple fact. Most are now gainfully employed, and not at Scab Air.

(3) to leave the crazy airline mechanic world and go get a job that you feel more appropriately rewards you for your skills. Many are doing just that. The FAA recently predicted a major shortage in the near future.

I predict possums. I predict your continued anti-worker, anti-union nonsensical flaming bullsh*t to continue on at the UAL threads, the US Air threads, the AA threads, the Delta threads, the NWA threads. Did I leave any out??? After reading your many ignorant quips where you constantly run your big mouth bear69, I surely have no doubt.

http://www.amfa11.com/postings/AMFA_Local5_thx.pdf

 

[eolesen]

ModerAAtor, I don't think taking the position of a "smart a$$" was respective in response to Mr. Wrench :angry:

He only expressed his desire to retire.

Oh, bite me. I wasn't being a smart a$$ -- just brutally honest, which is probably a foreign concept to many of you.

Everyone I know who has left the industry said it was like a weight being lifted off their shoulders, but I never really believed it until I left last year.

I know too many people who are hanging on in a job they hate and praying for a buy-out. I just don't see it happening anytime soon.

I had a desire to retire from AMR as well, but it wasn't worth waiting another ten years simply for the promise of flight benefits. Instead I can be building up a 401K, spending more time with my kids before they move onto college, and enjoying a lower cost of living in my new hometown than even Texas had to offer me.

My wife and I were both die-hard airline people when we met. If the two of us can get over AA, anyone can.

 

[Ken MacTiernan]

What would you call it -- "labor's finest moment"?
Thanks to NW management outsmarting them every step of the way, and hoardes of qualified mechanics willing to do their job for less, they were in a no-win situation. Therefore their choice was either (1) to be employed possums, (2) to be unemployed strikers, or (3) to leave the crazy airline mechanic world and go get a job that you feel more appropriately rewards you for your skills.
I predict possums.

"Labor's finest moment?" No. I do call it, labor standing and fighting for the members. The IAM stood up at Eastern. They did not lose. Lorenzo did. Same thing at NWA. Management lost.

"Hoards of qualified mechanics"? No. Just enough SCABS to keep tires falling off aircraft.

It seems as if your lack of a solid substance that constitutes a back bone denies you the ability to stand when needed. Fortunately the honorable men and women at AMFA stand for those willing to follow.

 

[eolesen]

In both cases, the IAM and AMFA were baited into a strike by Lorenzo and Steeland respectively. That's a rare situation in the airlines, and I wouldn't expect to see it repeated anytime soon.

I don't know if I'd say upper management lost at EAL, though.

In some ways, Lorenzo and Texas Air made out a lot better by being thrown out of Eastern and ultimately at Continental. The price they were paid for their stock was many times more what they'd have managed to hold onto during Eastern's liquidation and Continental's second bankruptcy.

 

[MCI transplant]

One scenario is for certain, manAAgement would again lie, cheat, and steal to keep its lapdog twu "Working Together" and on the property at all costs.

The bigger question would be if MCI would again fight the drive to dump the twu???

<_< ---No Hackmen! The real question is would TUL vote AMFA? Or are they harder in the head than those here at MCI?-----