More Jobs Cut in MSP

[WorldTraveler]

Kevin really isn't of the type that will do Hail or Our Anything - and I wouldn't expect him or anyone else to be something they aren't.
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But it still doesn't change the fact that it is highly doubtful that any company made a promise that any job classification or location would be unaffected by any corporate downsizing/outsourcing etc... if for no other reason that those statements do have the potential to be legally used against the company - and those types of promises really can't be upheld given the uncertainty of business and the larger economy today.
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But if someone did hear that kind of statement being made, they should at the very least confront DL leadership who made that statement - but only after seeing a lawyer and preparing a class action suit against the company. There are no shortage of lawyers who would be happy to take the case on if it had merit.
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What is pretty certain is that alot of PMNW people believed that DL's statements that it would not lay off (not fire, but lay off) full-time personnel meant they were home free in their present positions and locations - but I have never seen DL or any other company make a statement of that kind.
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I appreciate it, Dawg, for you clarifying what I have asked for several months regarding what is actually happening in MSP. Obviously like everyone else I am disappointed to hear that DL will have no heavy maintenance capabilities in MSP and I don't know why they came to that decision but would like to.
But it also validates that DL after AA is through cutting will likely have the most extensive maintenance operations employing the most mechanics among any US airline - and perhaps the uncertainty of what is happening with AA and its maintenance capabilities and decisions does in fact affect what DL is doing.
For whatever reason, DL took none of Pan Am's maintenance capabilities - and although there wasn't much left of NW's - DL apparently desires to concentrate its heavy scheduled maintenance capabilities in ATL. You and I would think that an airline the size of DL could have more than one heavy maintenance based - but the numbers of global carriers that do so is not terribly long.
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The argument about outsourcing is valid and has been made... the real question is whether airlines insource and the size of what DL insources is what makes DL distinctive in the industry.
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DL apparently doesn't need to have ever made a mistake to win the favor of its employees and investors - but it apparently does make a whole lot less mistakes than its competitors - or else the investors who have given DL a $1B plus market cap premium over any other US airline are woefully ignorant and the employees don't realize that they could have it better some other way.

 

[Kev3188]

No exchanging hangars. Delta is dumping 3 bays in MSP. Period.

They are how ever building a state of the art complex for Overhauls.........in Mexico. :angry:

and delta could do 100% in house if they wanted to. HMVs going out only saved ~48M. The company(i mean TechOps) made 600M plus so 600M-48M= 552M. Also if Delta did HMVs it would drive down its cost for more HMV MRO work and the company could very well cover its losses with more MRO work (thus making its own HMVs cheaper to do). Tony Just doesn't want them done in house. Period. I hope that our next President (again TechOps) wants to do DELTA work in house along with a large MRO company. Technik seems to have no problem with it...

Charraf (sp?) is now off to drum up MRO business. Maybe West will see it differently? I wouldn't hold my breath, though...

Oh no, Kev. In the alternate universe where Delta is like the Virgin Mary...without sin or error, such a statement would never be made. The Arch-Cardinal for Atlanta and surrounding counties, His Excellency WT has spoken. Now go to your room and do 100 Hail Deltas and 20 Our Mothers, and ask for forgiveness.

Lol. Trust me; there's no shortage of acolytes at the Widget, and they will go to amazing lengths to rationalize the company's actions.

Just wait. The NW ramp has yet to get the DGS treatment... Nothing says Change like DGS having more employees than the mainline ramp. :angry:

Oh, I'm sure it's coming. Not a matter of "if," but rather "when."

Speaking of cuts: Word from a friend in MSP is that 60 stock clerk spots will stay; the rest go "poof."

 

[WorldTraveler]

Lol. Trust me; there's no shortage of acolytes at the Widget, and they will go to amazing lengths to rationalize the company's actions.

which would seem to indicate that my positions are not so "other worldly" as some would like to make them... or at least that there are a whole lot of other people who populate that realm as well.
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In 15 flights on Delta/Delta connection over the past month with the majority being through PMNW hubs and on PMNW staffed FA flights, the vast majority at least believe that working for DL is not any worse and in some cases better than it was at NW.... but all expressed a desire for success at DL - and believe it was quite reasonable to have those expectations.

It would appear that my assessment is accurate that the majority of DL employees including PMNW employees believe that life is no worse off and in some cases better than it was at NW - and none expressed any significant reservations about their ability to succeed at DL.

 

[topDawg]

Charraf (sp?) is now off to drum up MRO business. Maybe West will see it differently? I wouldn't hold my breath, though...




Lol. Trust me; there's no shortage of acolytes at the Widget, and they will go to amazing lengths to rationalize the company's actions.




Oh, I'm sure it's coming. Not a matter of "if," but rather "when."

Speaking of cuts: Word from a friend in MSP is that 60 stock clerk spots will stay; the rest go "poof."

Blah he should focus on only MRO. Thats his baby....as for West... not going to change a thing. If he does it will only get worse.

and your right. People always have a reason for why its ok Delta did this or that. As long as its not there ars on the chopping block its fine.

 

[topDawg]

which would seem to indicate that my positions are not so "other worldly" as some would like to make them... or at least that there are a whole lot of other people who populate that realm as well.
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In 15 flights on Delta/Delta connection over the past month with the majority being through PMNW hubs and on PMNW staffed FA flights, the vast majority at least believe that working for DL is not any worse and in some cases better than it was at NW.... but all expressed a desire for success at DL - and believe it was quite reasonable to have those expectations.

It would appear that my assessment is accurate that the majority of DL employees including PMNW employees believe that life is no worse off and in some cases better than it was at NW - and none expressed any significant reservations about their ability to succeed at DL.

No one wants the company to fail. I hate A LOT of things about Delta, but i really, really want the company to do well. The problem is this company isn't Delta anymore. We use to have a reason to be non-union. Our QOL was always on par or better than every other company. The company did everything they could to keep us employed. Now this place is no better than any other airline and its starting to get old. If Delta would go back to being DELTA things would be great. Sadly they just say they care about us when the real story is all they care about walking away with their pay checks. If it takes cutting 20,000 employees they do it just like that.

Anderson always talks about Mr. Woolman and how he said this and did that, but fact is he would fire all those a** holes for what they are doing to us. Like it or not.....and some of us are finally taking the widget glasses off and are tired of being screwed. :angry:

 

[2BlacknBlue]

No one wants the company to fail. I hate A LOT of things about Delta, but i really, really want the company to do well. The problem is this company isn't Delta anymore. We use to have a reason to be non-union. Our QOL was always on par or better than every other company. The company did everything they could to keep us employed. Now this place is no better than any other airline and its starting to get old. If Delta would go back to being DELTA things would be great. Sadly they just say they care about us when the real story is all they care about walking away with their pay checks. If it takes cutting 20,000 employees they do it just like that.

Anderson always talks about Mr. Woolman and how he said this and did that, but fact is he would fire all those a** holes for what they are doing to us. Like it or not.....and some of us are finally taking the widget glasses off and are tired of being screwed. :angry:

Dang, topDawg! I think I might know you! lol

 

[topDawg]

Dang, topDawg! I think I might know you! lol

possible but unlikely. I don't know anyone on here. (or at least that i'm close with.)

and hopefully you know someone like me....More people with my goals in Atlanta wouldn't be a bad thing.

 

[Kev3188]

No one wants the company to fail. I hate A LOT of things about Delta, but i really, really want the company to do well.

Exactly.

The manufactured idea that someone wishing for change must "hate" DL is really getting old.

Anderson always talks about Mr. Woolman and how he said this and did that, but fact is he would fire all those a** holes for what they are doing to us. Like it or not.....and some of us are finally taking the widget glasses off and are tired of being screwed. :angry:

If I was someone who had been at DL for many years, I would find RA's talk about the history/culture as if he'd been there for decades to be really insulting. I also find it humorous that his southern accent has magically reappeared.

 

[WorldTraveler]

I don't talk to a whole lot of people who are enthralled with DL leadership the way they were with Woolman or any other airline's employees were with their historic leader....
but Anderson has learned the culture into which he chose to work and has figured out how to thrive in it - and he is respected for that both within and outside of DL.
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I don't believe anyone said that you hated DL if you wanted change.... but a lot of people keep expecting DL to be the one to change into the likeness they desire. DL is far bigger than any single person so perhaps the more reasonable expectation is to figure out what it is DL wants to be and learn to adapt in that environment.
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The entire world is not what it used to be - DL included. Housing was once a rock solid investment... now it is a rock solid noose on the necks of millions of Americans. The US government used to be capable of delivering on any promise it made... now the investment community thinks others do a better job....
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IN the zeal to note the movement away from what DL once was, how about considering that DL and PMNW employees (and a higher percentage of PMNW employees at that) have FROZEN pension benefits (controlled by the company instead of the PBGC) in an industry where terminating DB plans and handing them to the government has been the norm. It would seem to me that DL has shown the moral high road in keeping more of its own obligations than any other network carrier in the industry... and note that many low fare carriers never started down the road with DB plans in the first place so they never had to cross that road.
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As AA's BK progresses and as they emerge, as US' future becomes less clear without the ability to raid one of their larger network peers, as the UA/CO and WN/FL mergers finally face the difficult labor integration issues and attempt to deliver the same level of revenue improvements that DL/NW did while building on instead of cutting out the foundation that was bought, then maybe DL will be seen to be at least as good as its peers - but certainly no worse off than others in total - and in some respects a whole lot better.

 

[topDawg]

I don't talk to a whole lot of people who are enthralled with DL leadership the way they were with Woolman or any other airline's employees were with their historic leader....
but Anderson has learned the culture into which he chose to work and has figured out how to thrive in it - and he is respected for that both within and outside of DL.
.No he hasn't. Real Delta culture is treating us better than those at US,AA,WN,UA etc. Right now we are damn near last in every aspect of benefits other than pay. Telling the employees thanks for this and thanks for that isn't the Delta culture.....its just ars kissing 101
I don't believe anyone said that you hated DL if you wanted change.... but a lot of people keep expecting DL to be the one to change into the likeness they desire. DL is far bigger than any single person so perhaps the more reasonable expectation is to figure out what it is DL wants to be and learn to adapt in that environment.
.No but some make it out like we should just be happy to bend over and should say/do nothing about it.
The entire world is not what it used to be - DL included. Housing was once a rock solid investment... now it is a rock solid noose on the necks of millions of Americans. The US government used to be capable of delivering on any promise it made... now the investment community thinks others do a better job....
.Don't care about the world, i care about Delta. Delta has made 2B+ thanks to my and my peers sacrifices. Its about time we start seeing benefit for the 60% we lost. I get that i wont get it all back, but the fact the United is doing about as good as Delta tells me that i should have a much better QOL. If the company can't afford that then Anderson and Co. aren't doing their jobs.
IN the zeal to note the movement away from what DL once was, how about considering that DL and PMNW employees (and a higher percentage of PMNW employees at that) have FROZEN pension benefits (controlled by the company instead of the PBGC) in an industry where terminating DB plans and handing them to the government has been the norm. It would seem to me that DL has shown the moral high road in keeping more of its own obligations than any other network carrier in the industry... and note that many low fare carriers never started down the road with DB plans in the first place so they never had to cross that road.
.Do you know what a frozen pension means to a junior guy vs a PBGC pension and 401K match? hint option B is better for me. (and i don't believe in dumping a pension off on the gov....but lets not act like Delta did me a great big favor. Take the widget glasses off....It was one more way i get forced to bend over and smile)
As AA's BK progresses and as they emerge, as US' future becomes less clear without the ability to raid one of their larger network peers, as the UA/CO and WN/FL mergers finally face the difficult labor integration issues and attempt to deliver the same level of revenue improvements that DL/NW did while building on instead of cutting out the foundation that was bought, then maybe DL will be seen to be at least as good as its peers - but certainly no worse off than others in total - and in some respects a whole lot better.

Delta wont be in with its peers till they start giving back. UA/CO and FL/WN aren't going to do much taking from their employees. They aren't hiding behind a judge anymore.....its not a simple as you like to think


and i forgot to add. Guess who has new 787s on order and guess who is building hangar space in EWR and IAD? Guess who wont get 787s for 8 more years and is dumping as much hangar space as they can? Yeah Delta is just friggin peachy :angry:

*but Mexico should be coming online soon* :angry:

 

[topDawg]

Exactly.

The manufactured idea that someone wishing for change must "hate" DL is really getting old.



If I was someone who had been at DL for many years, I would find RA's talk about the history/culture as if he'd been there for decades to be really insulting. I also find it humorous that his southern accent has magically reappeared.

They all do it. Leo did it, Ron did it. I mean its so funny to me that people really think Richard and Ed really give a flying f**k about us. They would be tickled s**tless if they could do just like what happened to YX to us. 767 size and up AirFrance/KLM dba DELTA and 757size and lower Republic/SkyWest Dba DELTA. Remember who owned half of YX when they got screwed........

 

[tech2101]

My link

MSP Stores gone.

Delta Air Lines is considering moving as many as 150 jobs from the Minneapolis-St. Paul International Airport to Atlanta as part of a plan to consolidate its warehouse operations.
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Gov. Mark Dayton "had the clear impression from [CEO Richard] Anderson that the job situation in Minnesota would remain stable," said Katharine Tinucci, the governor's press secretary. Moving the jobs "would be contrary to that assurance."

Tinucci said Dayton plans to write Anderson about the possible transfers.

In June, Delta announced that it was moving 400 training and technical positions from Eagan to Atlanta to trim costs. The decision outraged Minnesota politicians because it appeared the airline was reducing its presence in the state even after Delta vowed to maintain it after its 2008 merger with Northwest Airlines.

Workers advocating for a union at Delta vented about the possible job transfers on their Facebook page, called Blue Notes Newsletter-Online. Without a union, workers said it is up to Delta to determine seniority and who will move. They also noted that many employees aren't in a position to pick up and relocate to Atlanta.

Got a laugh from the portion of the quote that I put in bold italics.