1AA
Veteran
. What did you expect with the lowest paid and least benefits? Family to support. Monday thru Friday, 9 to 5?????
Three 13 hour Shifts
- Thread starter Ronin
- Start date
Tex-Mech
Veteran
But this is what nearly 80% of the Tulsa base wanted and voted for. And I say this with the utmost respect for those, like you Old Guy, who fought for a NO vote on the base, but the YES crowd got exactly what they asked for. The contract says up to 12 hour shifts, so I say No to 13 hour shifts on a deal cutting for Tulsa only like Sam Siri is looking to pull. If the company wants 13 hour shifts, I say make them open the contract and fix all the other stuff, like pay.
Tex-Mech
Veteran
The NTSB seems to agree with you...
http://www.aviationweek.com/Article.aspx?id=/article-xml/awx_01_29_2013_p0-542382.xml
So, are you going to hunt down that AMT who signed the log book, and ask him/her how long they've on duty?
Hackman
Veteran
- Sep 30, 2003
- 3,997
- 898
Strange that your worried about some tired AMT working on your flying junker....but most fly boys have no problem flying it out of the China or El Salvador chop shops. Where they can't even speak English, are not drug tested, and are unlicensed. I know which one would be on my mind.
Not to worry, our ATD will team up with industry lobbyists and defeat any measure that would limit the amount of hours we can work and big Don will make sure that no matter how many hours we work we still cant pay our bills.
4-10's are the S*^#, I've been working them for quite a while. I'd be willing to try 3-13's, but I think that a whole day would be used just for sleep, but I'd still have 3 complete days left to enjoy.
If its true that Tulsa is removing the flexibility that they have allowed in the past then its obvious that they are doing so in an effort to insure failure. This way when they do outsource the 767s and the MD-80s go away, resulting in massive headcount reductions, which would happen no matter how good of a job Tulsa does, they will claim that they did so because the workers failed to perform.
We have seen this before on the line, with the movement of B-cks. most dont buy it but some do. I recall when we lost the 767 Bck out of JFK, the checks performance was excellent, so they could not blame performance, but they shifted itto LAX due to routing.
The company figures that if they make movements of work look like punishment that workers brought upon themselves that others will work harder to insure it doesnt happen to them or that if they work hard enough they will get more work brought in.Sadly our appointed reps in the ATD run around supporting this hoax. But they dont move work because one station works harder than the other-they would replace management if that was the determining factor-work ends up where aircraft can be routed to places they have the time and facilities to do it.
JFK realized back with the 767 that it doesnt matter one way or the other. Tulsa is likely being provoked into a response, but whether they respond or not the result will be the same, they will lose work if AA can find a place to do it cheaper and as old planes are replaced by the 500 new ones they have coming.
You know as well as I do how tough that is to do.
If someone is changing a reading light and mentions he's been on duty for 13+ plus, I'm not going to have a problem. If another(s) tell me he's(they) are pulling 20 hours straight while swapping Left and Right HYD pumps or two generators backed up by a flaky APU before an ETOPS leg, I probably would refuse the jet without somebody who isn't dead tired signing it off.
Make a mistake, nobody is perfect, including the pilots.
Make a mistake because you gotta make a payment on your F-250? I'd call that criminal negligence. You guys need duty time limits like the pilots.
Exactly when did I say i wasn't concerned about them or our lovely outsourced buddies in a mid-atlantic state?
Well, it's a good thing that people did not mention how many hours they have worked continuosly within your earshot, you would have refused a lot of flights. Long shifts happen, especially on field trips to fix an OTS aircraft.
Hackman
Veteran
- Sep 30, 2003
- 3,997
- 898
You didn't personally, I was generalizing to the fact that pilots don't seem to be that concerned about the flying abortions China and some other outfits put out. At least we don't hear much on the subject. I'd like to know how the AA 777 pilot feels when he has to strap in on that first flight out of Hong Kong. A tired AMT is a concern, but overtime is the only way the AMT's today can make a living with all the concessions that have been forced upon the industries carriers that have had to endure the airline bankrupcy trend.
Most of the people I know at AA would be screwed without CSs!
Many only work 20 hrs a week to make this part time and work full time elsewhere.
I wonder if US allows giving away half of you hours?
Many only work 20 hrs a week to make this part time and work full time elsewhere.
I wonder if US allows giving away half of you hours?
Not asking you to fight our battles but we really dont hear too much concern from the pilots about it.
ALPA mentioned some concerns a few years back ( http://coscapsa.org/Safety/Problems%20with%20Aging%20Aircraft.pdf ) but never really made too much noise about it.
You opened the door when you commented about fatigued mechanics here, (which I took as supportive of our position, but others may not have). Guys get defensive because this is how they cope with the huge losses that have been imposed on us.
I feel you are right to be concerned about it but the reality is that low wages have made fatigued mechanics a fact of life, even if the FAA cracked down on duty times, which I think they should, that would not prevent mechanics from using those same skillsets elsewhere to make ends meet. Here in NY more and more guys are working full time at the MTA fixing subway cars and buses then doing the same at AA. Some trade away shifts to guys who basically live at work. Obviously its a condition that can not be maintained indefineatly. There is a fix for it, higher wages. Duty time limits could help over the long term, limits would reduce the amount of hours available to the airlines, in effect reduce the supply without reducing demand, that should drive wages up. Thats why the Airlines will fight it tooth and nail, whats really disturbing is that the TWU, our union, sided with the airlines against more restrictive duty times. Sure it would be painful for those guys who work 7 days a week with a few doubles thrown in (this allows guys to maintain full time jobs elsewher as they give away their shifts) but over the longer term all mechanics would benefit.
Again, I agree, you should be concerned, not only do we have the problem of stuff being outsourced overseas but you have the problem of the Line guys being more likely to miss something because they are fatigued. After all you guys end up paying the ultimate price.
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