100 Seaters For Eagle?

[InclusiveScope]

Mr. Peter Bowler, President
American Eagle Airlines
1700 West 20th Street
PO Box 612527
DFW Airport, Texas 74261-2527

October 17, 2003

Dear Peter,

On Oct. 17, Gerard Arpey was quoted in a Dallas Morning News article as
saying that he would like to sit down with the unions "to try and figure
out if we need a 100-seat airplane."

Knowing that AMR has a corporate interest in this issue, the pilots of
American Eagle, represented by the Air Line Pilots Association, would
like to inform you of our interest in placing larger aircraft, such as
the EMB 190 at our carrier. We believe the American Eagle cost
structure provides an inherent advantage in any effort to compete in
markets with lower cost carriers such as JetBlue Airways.

American Eagle is a robust company that can expand nicely into markets
that cannot be profitably served by American Airlines as it is currently
structured. With the advent of Small Jet aircraft in the 70-seat-plus
range, we believe that Eagle is uniquely positioned to take advantage of
the growth in this particular market sector. Additionally, since
American Eagle already operates Embraer aircraft, transitioning pilots,
mechanics, flight attendants, and ramp workers to the EMB
170/175/190/195 poses obvious advantages due to Eagle's cost structure
and commonality with our current Embraer aircraft.

We would be happy to discuss the details of this matter with you at your
convenience.

Sincerely,


Capt. Herb Mark, chairman
Eagle ALPA MEC

 

[wrx]

AA has 100 seat a/c they can give to AE! The Fokker 100's will be going buh bye to the desert very soon.

 

[G4G5]

SCAB!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Teflon]

Aren't the eagle pilots APA also?

 

[A/C FIXER]

AA has 100 seat a/c they can give to AE! The Fokker 100's will be going buh bye to the desert very soon.

We've already sent some to the desert, 14-15 of them so far, and as of Oct 10TH the last F100 light "C" check was completed, there will be from time to time an F100 come in as a drop-in, but as far as major work being done, its over.
We have also been told that somewhere around 60ish F100s have been sold to some European Consortium/Financial group, and they should be heading over there sometime next year.

 

[FWAAA]

Aren't the eagle pilots APA also?

No, Eagle pilots are ALPA.

 

[wrx]

SCAB!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Yeah, whatever buddy! A SCAB is someone who crosses a picket line and I was on the picket line in 1993!! Some f/a's have the 1993 SCAB list still on them. Ask around and then you can see who was a SCAB in 1993. A SCAB is also something you get when you mess your body up after it bleeds.

 

[G4G5]

Yeah, whatever buddy! A SCAB is someone who crosses a picket line and I was on the picket line in 1993!! Some f/a's have the 1993 SCAB list still on them. Ask around and then you can see who was a SCAB in 1993. A SCAB is also something you get when you mess your body up after it bleeds.

The last time I checked AA already had a 100 seat aircraft. The F100's.

The reason that AA continues to furlough and put pilots and their familes out on the street, is because of the loss of the 100 seat flying. The aircraft is not even completely parked.

The Eagle MEC decides to pick up the morning paper and he interpruts it as his opportunity to steal those jobs. Wait a minute those F100 Fo's (yes the ones who actually gave back somethng to the company, tell me again what the Eagle pilots gave back) have not even had a chance to place the, "For Sale" sign out on the front lawn.

While he has not crossed a picket line, he has crossed The Line.

 

[wrx]

The last time I checked AA already had a 100 seat aircraft. The F100's.

That's what I told you above.

 

[G4G5]

AA has 100 seat a/c they can give to AE! The Fokker 100's will be going buh bye to the desert very soon.

Tell that to the 100+ pilots that were furloughed in Oct
Tell that to the 100+ pilots that will be furloughed in Nov
Tell that to the 100+ pilots that will be furloughed in Dec

Already announced, firm numbers.

You can also tell that to the additional 500-800 scheduled to go as the F100 departs between Jan and May of 04.

These folks gave back countless contract concessions, heck they gave back their jobs. So tell me again about the transfer of 100 seat flying to Eagle? What did the Eagle pilots give back to get that 100 seat flying?

Show me where it is written that Eagle gets the 100 seat flying? It's not.

So what do yo call it when someone tries to steal your job? Obviously you feel Scab is not the correct term. You are correct, Scab is too polite a term to use.

 

[wrx]

Dude,

EVERY WORK GROUP AT AA GAVE MILLIONS IN CONCESSIONS!!! So, don't tell me that we didn't give it up. Even know the vote was tainted. The f/a group at AA has the most people on furlough 6,150!

In case you can't tell AA domestic is becoming AE domestic. I don't know if you work for AA or not, but I guess you don't. So don't tell me the sad story of all the AA pilots on furlough, who gave up concessions. I'm in the work group who has more furloughs then any department at AA. We have more f/a furloughs then Delta, US Airways and Northwest combined!

It will be cheaper for AA to get rid of the Fokker 100's then it would be to keep them. Fokker is no longer in business and MTC has to build parts to replace the ones they can't fix. It costs AA way to much to keep these planes in the sky!

Don't use the word SCAB, unless you know what it means. It's obvious you don't!

 

[G4G5]

Dude,





Don't use the word SCAB, unless you know what it means. It's obvious you don't!

You really need to read the above letter. It's in reference to the Eagle pilots and the ERJ190.

Please show me where it refers to flight attendants?
Since it makes no reference to FA's I will assume that you can't be bothered to read the post in which you are responding to. The letter is CLEARLY directed at the pilots.

You may also want to list the concessions that the Eagle pilots provided to AMR.

"It costs AA way to much to keep these planes in the sky!"
Could you please list the financial data that you are using to make this determination? Ottherwise your you kitchen table economics has little bearing upon the discussion.


"Don't use the word SCAB, unless you know what it means. It's obvious you don't!
What do you call someone who is willing to take another job and do it for less money? Please take the time to read the above letter.

Yes, I am a pilot at AA.

 

[jimntx]

As someone who is not directly involved in this dispute, let me tell you how it looks from the outside.

AA pilots are screaming SCAB at AE pilots because the AE folk are not really anxious to lose their jobs in order to make room for furloughed AA folk through the flowback part of the flowthrough/flowback procedure.

AE pilots and FOs appear to view the AA pilots as hypocrites because during the heady growth days of AA, AA was hiring new pilots off the street rather than allowing AE pilots to utilize the flow-through part of the flowthrough/flowback procedure.

If I am correct in my observations (and I admit, that as an outsider I don't know all the little details) then as the Bible says, "A POX ON BOTH YOUR HOUSES."


Unless my source at Merrill Lynch is way wrong, the truth is that you have a common enemy--AMR Corporation. AMR's long-term business plan for over 10 years now has been to move all domestic flying involving a/c smaller than the 757 to American Eagle leaving only International, Transcons, and long-haul heavy (such as, 757 DFW-YVR service) at AA. The events of the last 2-3 years have simply given AMR an excuse to really start moving the flying over more rapidly.

 

[Flying Titan]

Jim -
I agree completely. AMR is definitiely in the midst of a major shift of much of its mainline flying to AE. I believe the move to put EMB 190/195 class aircraft onto regional partners represents a fundamental shift in the domestic airline industry among all the majors. The 190/195 is really no different than a Fokker 100, a Boeing 717, an Airbus 318 or a Boeing 737-600. Capacity is very similar. Range is as good or better and size and weight are not that far off. The opening is created for this move because people see Embraer and automatically assume "regional jet." These are not RJs. These planes are direct competitors with all of the aircraft mentioned above. As a passenger, my problem with the direction this is taking is when I buy a ticket on AA (or any other airline) I want to fly on that airline - not some subsidiary or partner to whom the job has been farmed out. On this matter, I line up squarely with labor. While some further concessions may have to be made, any new aircraft in the 100 seat range should be flown on the mainline - at AA and every other major.

 

[G4G5]

I agree, flying should go to mainline and that is my point.

If we have learned nothing, we have learned that AMR will do whatever they want.

Who says that the ERJ flying will go to Eagle and not to another AA connection? Or some new mgt scam to hide ASM's (similar to their STL/AX deal). Allowing AMR mgt to shift 100 seat flying away from mainline, allows mgt to shift flying anywhere.

Remember the planned sale of Executive?