AA Accelerates TWA B757 Standardization
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TWAnr
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From my wife's email inbox:
[blockquote]The following message was incorporated into Jane Allen's Update for this week on the Flight Service website and the Flight Attendant Hotline.
This is Jane Allen with some additional information for this week. Today is Tuesday March 4, 2003.
As you know, we have spent many hours working on the integration of TWA into AA. Our decisions have all had the underlying objective of doing what is best for the long-term survival and eventual profitability of our company. Maintaining two operating certificates, separate maintenance programs, training programs, employee groups, and manuals drives expenses that we simply cannot afford in the current economic environment. To that end, American has decided to accelerate the standardization of TWA’s B757s a year earlier than originally planned. In July 2003, TWA’s B757s will begin standardization in MCI and once completed, they will enter AA service at a rate of 2 to 3 aircraft per month.
The current plan is to standardize 16 TWA B757s that have lease returns between January 2007 and January 2008. The remaining 11 TWA B757s, whose leases expire between December 2003 and August 2004, will be returned to the lessors as leases expire.
While the acceleration of the TWA B757 conversion is economically the necessary step for our company to take, it further complicates our manning outlook. We have recently received an operating plan for the balance of the year and we now must incorporate the accelerated conversion of the TWA B757s into this plan in order to determine the manning requirements for both AA and TWA LLC operations. Additionally, we will have 500 flight attendants returning from overage leaves on May 1 and we don’t yet know the impact this may have. As you are no doubt aware, moving flight attendants over the fence with the aircraft can only occur if there is no surplus of flight attendants. Therefore, the plan for integration training has not yet been determined. We are in the process of reviewing all of these factors and will provide more information as soon as we can.
Our goal is to keep all employees in the company advised of changes to our integration plan, and we hope you find this update helpful. The senior management team must make some very tough decisions regarding the survival of this company, and your continued support is vital to that effort.
[/blockquote]
[blockquote]The following message was incorporated into Jane Allen's Update for this week on the Flight Service website and the Flight Attendant Hotline.
This is Jane Allen with some additional information for this week. Today is Tuesday March 4, 2003.
As you know, we have spent many hours working on the integration of TWA into AA. Our decisions have all had the underlying objective of doing what is best for the long-term survival and eventual profitability of our company. Maintaining two operating certificates, separate maintenance programs, training programs, employee groups, and manuals drives expenses that we simply cannot afford in the current economic environment. To that end, American has decided to accelerate the standardization of TWA’s B757s a year earlier than originally planned. In July 2003, TWA’s B757s will begin standardization in MCI and once completed, they will enter AA service at a rate of 2 to 3 aircraft per month.
The current plan is to standardize 16 TWA B757s that have lease returns between January 2007 and January 2008. The remaining 11 TWA B757s, whose leases expire between December 2003 and August 2004, will be returned to the lessors as leases expire.
While the acceleration of the TWA B757 conversion is economically the necessary step for our company to take, it further complicates our manning outlook. We have recently received an operating plan for the balance of the year and we now must incorporate the accelerated conversion of the TWA B757s into this plan in order to determine the manning requirements for both AA and TWA LLC operations. Additionally, we will have 500 flight attendants returning from overage leaves on May 1 and we don’t yet know the impact this may have. As you are no doubt aware, moving flight attendants over the fence with the aircraft can only occur if there is no surplus of flight attendants. Therefore, the plan for integration training has not yet been determined. We are in the process of reviewing all of these factors and will provide more information as soon as we can.
Our goal is to keep all employees in the company advised of changes to our integration plan, and we hope you find this update helpful. The senior management team must make some very tough decisions regarding the survival of this company, and your continued support is vital to that effort.
[/blockquote]
coolflyingfool
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So if I understand the memo correctly, AA is going to downsize their fleet by 11 757's starting in December? Is this due to the fact that Boeing would not let AA out of their deliveries for 2003? just wondering aloud..........
ITRADE
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What is the standardization process?
Are TW's 75s configured like US's with essentially 3 cabins?
Are TW's 75s configured like US's with essentially 3 cabins?
Oliver Stone''s Apprentice
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[blockquote]
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On 3/5/2003 3:27:50 AM coolflyingfool wrote:
So if I understand the memo correctly, AA is going to downsize their fleet by 11 757's starting in December? Is this due to the fact that Boeing would not let AA out of their deliveries for 2003? just wondering aloud..........
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[/blockquote]
The only new information here is that the standardization will be taking place sooner.
We've known since April 2001 that the Pratt powered 757s would be eliminated as leases expire, and we've known since last year that there won't be any new deliveries to offset the lease returns.
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On 3/5/2003 3:27:50 AM coolflyingfool wrote:
So if I understand the memo correctly, AA is going to downsize their fleet by 11 757's starting in December? Is this due to the fact that Boeing would not let AA out of their deliveries for 2003? just wondering aloud..........
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[/blockquote]
The only new information here is that the standardization will be taking place sooner.
We've known since April 2001 that the Pratt powered 757s would be eliminated as leases expire, and we've known since last year that there won't be any new deliveries to offset the lease returns.
TWAnr
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[blockquote]
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On 3/5/2003 9:29:36 AM eolesen wrote:
The only new information here is that the standardization will be taking place sooner.
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[/blockquote]
I beg to differ. It is now clearer than ever that the company has no intention of training the TWA LLCers to crew planes flying under the AA certificate.
[blockquote]
As you are no doubt aware, moving flight attendants over the fence with the aircraft can only occur if there is no surplus of flight attendants. Therefore, the plan for integration training has not yet been determined.
[/blockquote]
P.S. The pilots' cross training has also been suspended, as stated in this answer posted by management:
[blockquote]
A:Given the uncertainty of the conflict in the MidEast and the volatility in the military leaves and retirements, we have suspended the training from TWALLC to AA until the manning levels stabilize. We are also aware of the uncertainty created by our current negotiations with the APA and the possibility of contract changes in the not too distant future
[/blockquote]
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On 3/5/2003 9:29:36 AM eolesen wrote:
The only new information here is that the standardization will be taking place sooner.
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[/blockquote]
I beg to differ. It is now clearer than ever that the company has no intention of training the TWA LLCers to crew planes flying under the AA certificate.
[blockquote]
As you are no doubt aware, moving flight attendants over the fence with the aircraft can only occur if there is no surplus of flight attendants. Therefore, the plan for integration training has not yet been determined.
[/blockquote]
P.S. The pilots' cross training has also been suspended, as stated in this answer posted by management:
[blockquote]
A:Given the uncertainty of the conflict in the MidEast and the volatility in the military leaves and retirements, we have suspended the training from TWALLC to AA until the manning levels stabilize. We are also aware of the uncertainty created by our current negotiations with the APA and the possibility of contract changes in the not too distant future
[/blockquote]
phllax
Veteran
Yes, the TWA 757's have the "3 Cabins" like the US 757's. I think US would have looked to take a few of them, being that they are relatively young in age. Unfortunately they have different engines (US has RR's and these are P&W) and completely different galley setups than what US has. (The TWA's have ovens in the coach galley as well as an aux galley in front of 2R.)
[blockquote]
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On 3/5/2003 10:36:41 AM TWAnr wrote:
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[/blockquote]
I beg to differ. It is now clearer than ever that the company has no intention of training the TWA LLCers to crew planes flying under the AA certificate.
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[/blockquote]
I think I'll have to agree with you on this one. Not that I feel that its right but I think the company is looking at this clearly by the $$$$$$
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On 3/5/2003 10:36:41 AM TWAnr wrote:
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[/blockquote]
I beg to differ. It is now clearer than ever that the company has no intention of training the TWA LLCers to crew planes flying under the AA certificate.
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[/blockquote]
I think I'll have to agree with you on this one. Not that I feel that its right but I think the company is looking at this clearly by the $$$$$$
TWAnr
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[blockquote]
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On 3/5/2003 4:25:23 PM MiAAmi wrote:
...I think the company is looking at this clearly by the $$$$$$
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[/blockquote]
No argument here. It is obvious that by refusing to offer OVL outside STL and SLT, to mitigate lay offs, the company gets to furlough flight attendants at the top of the pay scale.
It is all about money!!!
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On 3/5/2003 4:25:23 PM MiAAmi wrote:
...I think the company is looking at this clearly by the $$$$$$
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[/blockquote]
No argument here. It is obvious that by refusing to offer OVL outside STL and SLT, to mitigate lay offs, the company gets to furlough flight attendants at the top of the pay scale.
It is all about money!!!
kirkpatrick
Veteran
[blockquote]
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On 3/5/2003 5
56 PM TWAnr wrote:
No argument here. It is obvious that by refusing to offer OVL outside STL and SLT, to mitigate lay offs, the company gets to furlough flight attendants at the top of the pay scale.
It is all about money!!!
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[/blockquote]
While it seems the decision to transfer the 757's early is the final nail in our coffin, let me play with a few numbers here.
Assuming all 16 of the 757's to be kept (until leases expire 1/2007 through 1/2008) are converted by year's end, and 44 MD80's have been converted and 28 parked, that leaves 11 757's and 32 MD80's on the LLC side as of the end of this year.
Assuming 22 FA's per 757 (just guessing) and 19 per MD80 (Jane Allen said 18-20) that means there should be just 850 FA's at LLC. That goes to seniority 25Apr70, and unfortunately means both your wife and me will get a close-up of the pavement. With the 757's remaining going back to the lessors at approximately 1 per month and assuming the MD80's continue to be converted at about the same rate, that means the end of LLC by the end of the summer 2004.
So what's gonna save us? Training. When will that start? When the transfer of AC to the AA side ceases to alleviate an overage and starts to create a shortage. When will that occur?
Right now it looks like an overage of 528 (company numbers) with those returning from leaves this April and May figured into the furloughs for those months. The next scary part is when 1500 return next Oct and Nov. That brings us to something over 2000 as an overage.
So now it looks like this: the transfer of 16 757's and 44 MD80's, along with associated flying, alleviates just under 1200 of this overage. So we're depending on attrition for the rest.
How reasonable is it to expect attrition of 1000 a year? Well, it's happened in the past. 44 retired in Jan, decisions which were made before the caca hit the ventilator, and I expect it to increase considerably in the near future, especially as details on paycuts become available. It would only take about 80 per month to force training by the end of the year. But what else could happen?
1) The economy. What will it do?
2) The damn war. If they do it and get it over with quickly, the economy and airlines might begin a quick recovery. If they don't, well, who knows?
3) The APFA Presidential Grievance. As you know , APFA has finally decided to file a grievance on not offering leaves on the AA side. If this is won it could mean literally hundreds of LLC jobs.
4) Court cases. Probably to late to save anyone short-term, even if we should win. Grievances, however, generally happen much more quickly. Better to put hopes on that.
5) United. If they go belly up (and I wouldn't wish that on my fellow airline employee even to save my own skin) things could change drastically as we move into former UA territory.
Just playing with numbers. Comments welcome.
MK
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On 3/5/2003 5
56 PM TWAnr wrote: No argument here. It is obvious that by refusing to offer OVL outside STL and SLT, to mitigate lay offs, the company gets to furlough flight attendants at the top of the pay scale.
It is all about money!!!
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[/blockquote]
While it seems the decision to transfer the 757's early is the final nail in our coffin, let me play with a few numbers here.
Assuming all 16 of the 757's to be kept (until leases expire 1/2007 through 1/2008) are converted by year's end, and 44 MD80's have been converted and 28 parked, that leaves 11 757's and 32 MD80's on the LLC side as of the end of this year.
Assuming 22 FA's per 757 (just guessing) and 19 per MD80 (Jane Allen said 18-20) that means there should be just 850 FA's at LLC. That goes to seniority 25Apr70, and unfortunately means both your wife and me will get a close-up of the pavement. With the 757's remaining going back to the lessors at approximately 1 per month and assuming the MD80's continue to be converted at about the same rate, that means the end of LLC by the end of the summer 2004.
So what's gonna save us? Training. When will that start? When the transfer of AC to the AA side ceases to alleviate an overage and starts to create a shortage. When will that occur?
Right now it looks like an overage of 528 (company numbers) with those returning from leaves this April and May figured into the furloughs for those months. The next scary part is when 1500 return next Oct and Nov. That brings us to something over 2000 as an overage.
So now it looks like this: the transfer of 16 757's and 44 MD80's, along with associated flying, alleviates just under 1200 of this overage. So we're depending on attrition for the rest.
How reasonable is it to expect attrition of 1000 a year? Well, it's happened in the past. 44 retired in Jan, decisions which were made before the caca hit the ventilator, and I expect it to increase considerably in the near future, especially as details on paycuts become available. It would only take about 80 per month to force training by the end of the year. But what else could happen?
1) The economy. What will it do?
2) The damn war. If they do it and get it over with quickly, the economy and airlines might begin a quick recovery. If they don't, well, who knows?
3) The APFA Presidential Grievance. As you know , APFA has finally decided to file a grievance on not offering leaves on the AA side. If this is won it could mean literally hundreds of LLC jobs.
4) Court cases. Probably to late to save anyone short-term, even if we should win. Grievances, however, generally happen much more quickly. Better to put hopes on that.
5) United. If they go belly up (and I wouldn't wish that on my fellow airline employee even to save my own skin) things could change drastically as we move into former UA territory.
Just playing with numbers. Comments welcome.
MK
Just speculating....
Would a contractual change eliminating "leaves" (not sure how they really work), and flight attendants ability to drop most all of their trips help this situation? Admittedly, I'm not too familiar with the workings of the F/A's CBA. I know of MANY flight attendants who barely ever fly, yet retain all of their bennies including the insurance. (in some cases so their self employed spouses don't have to buy insurance)
Productivity is an issue.
Just how many flight attendants are employed at AA who really make this their "job"? I know there are many who do it to just to get out of the house once in a while, to keep pass bennies, or to get insurance, or whatever....
Would a contractual change eliminating "leaves" (not sure how they really work), and flight attendants ability to drop most all of their trips help this situation? Admittedly, I'm not too familiar with the workings of the F/A's CBA. I know of MANY flight attendants who barely ever fly, yet retain all of their bennies including the insurance. (in some cases so their self employed spouses don't have to buy insurance)
Productivity is an issue.
Just how many flight attendants are employed at AA who really make this their "job"? I know there are many who do it to just to get out of the house once in a while, to keep pass bennies, or to get insurance, or whatever....
There are many types of leaves. The ones being offered with benefits were contractually negotiated years ago. They help ease the number of involuntary layoffs, by letting those who can afford to take time off, do just that.
Other types of leaves, mini and bid are both for convenience and only given if an overage of crew exists at a base.
People do just drop there trips for others to fly. They must maintain a set number of hours to accrue sick, vacation and other benefits.
Other types of leaves, mini and bid are both for convenience and only given if an overage of crew exists at a base.
People do just drop there trips for others to fly. They must maintain a set number of hours to accrue sick, vacation and other benefits.
