AA and APFA announce ASAP Safety reporting program

[FWAAA]

APA terminated its participation in its ASAP program; now the FAs have one.

Press Release

American Airlines and Association of Professional Flight Attendants Announce Beginning of Aviation Safety Action Program

Friday January 16, 12:52 pm ET

FORT WORTH, Texas, Jan. 16 /PRNewswire-FirstCall/ -- American Airlines, in conjunction with the Association of Professional Flight Attendants (APFA) and the Federal Aviation Administration (FAA), implemented an Aviation Safety Action Program (ASAP) for the first time yesterday. ASAP is a safety partnership between the three organizations designed to encourage flight attendants to voluntarily report safety-related information. The reports will help identify potential precursors to serious safety incidents. The flight attendants' ASAP at American Airlines is now the single largest ASAP in the world by virtue of American's more than 18,000 flight attendants.

"Our flight attendants have made a huge commitment to supporting safety at American - one of our top priorities," said Lauri Curtis, Vice President - Onboard Service, American Airlines. "We have initiated this program with the best flight attendants in the industry, to help us remain one of the safest airlines."

http://biz.yahoo.com/prnews/090116/da59825.html?.v=1

What all types of safety-related concerns will be reportable?

 

[eolesen]

Probably some of the things that were mentioned as actionable in the pre-departure drink argument from a few months back, e.g.

• galley/service equipment not secured for takeoff/landing
• OH bins not closed, bags not stowed before door closure
• passenger found to be in lav during takeoff/landing/taxi

Some of it may wind up being CYA reports, but there is something to be said about trending these types of incidents either for the purpose of covering it in recurrent training or during a review of procedures by HDQ & field staff.

 

[jimntx]

The premature door closure--before bins closed, luggage stowed--is a big problem at certain stations. Despite multiple write-ups on f/a reports certain stations continue to follow the last passenger down the jetbridge and close the door before those passengers have even gotten to main cabin. Sometimes they don't even bother to hand the #1 the final paperwork. I've had more than one captain open his window, and yell out to the agent as the jetbridge pulls away that he is not leaving until they provide the paperwork. Such looks he gets from those agents, you vudn't believe!

 

[FrequentFlierCA]

Good for APFA for not playing politics with passenger safety. I think what APA did with this program was outrageous, and I applaud the FAs for not taking a similar approach.

 

[Mach85ER]

I think what APA did with this program was outrageous,............

Your statement is ridiculous and demonstrates an absolute total lack of understanding and ignorance of the issues regarding safety.

 

[youbetcha]

My understanding of the APFA ASAP Program is that APFA has secured a letter of agreement from AA stating that there will be no retaliation, no discipline for anything reported through ASAP. The pilots have not been able to secure such an agreement.

 

[FrequentFlierCA]

Your statement is ridiculous and demonstrates an absolute total lack of understanding and ignorance of the issues regarding safety.

What I understand very clearly is pilot arrogance. The pilots had no problem with this program until it was time to negotiate a new contract. Coincidence? No way. Not unlike the FAA, pilots are playing politics with safety.

 

[Mach85ER]

What I understand very clearly is pilot arrogance. The pilots had no problem with this program until it was time to negotiate a new contract. [b]Coincidence? No way[/b]. Not unlike the FAA, pilots are playing politics with safety.

The program was in effect for years with a specific expiration/renegotiation date (nobody really knew if it would really work in the first place). That date was fixed years before the 2003 contract was signed. The 2003 contract became amendable last summer. I think that covers your total ignorance on the subject. I will add that AA blamed APA for the failure saying the FAA wouldn't approve what the pilots were asking for. Last fall the #2 guy at the FAA reviewed what APA was seeking and said he had no problem with APA's proposed ASAP language. AA lied about the FAA stance on the issue. Not long after that, FAA Administrator Sturgell used unusually strong language to condemn the failure to reach an ASAP agreement at AA.

I know who is "politics with safety". If you ever find yourself flying into the mountains of South America, ask the pilots how much training they received 3 years ago, and then ask them how much training they receive for that type of flying today. That's one example of many.

Again, you have demonstrated that you are almost totally ignorant on the issue.

 

[slupilot01]

I could have sworn that I heard the pilots were offered the same side letter of agreement between AA and APA that the APFA was given, and the rumor is that the FAA recently approached both AA and APA to see if they would like to be granted an extension under the old MOU (the same one that has been used for 14+ years) so at the very least, the ASAP program for the pilots can be put back into use, while AA, APA, and FAA all come back to the table to work out a compromise...of which I believe I heard the ball is sitting in APA's court as AA has already said they would agree to that in the best interest of the pilots...but thats just what I hear through the grapevine...

 

[frontline]

Bull. The pilot "captains" (Hill and his cohorts) have been seizing any reason to not cooperative with the company on anything. If ASAP was so detrimental to pilots, where were all the complaints before the program expired? Since I also work at AA I know a lot of pilots, and I never heard a single complaint.

 

[nbmcg01]

Bull. The pilot "captains" (Hill and his cohorts) have been seizing any reason to not cooperative with the company on anything. If ASAP was so detrimental to pilots, where were all the complaints before the program expired? Since I also work at AA I know a lot of pilots, and I never heard a single complaint.

This type of program should ALWAYS be administered by an outside source with no ties to AA. We participated in the NASA report which was similar and I think everyone felt very comfortable using it.. For example, I was the FSM (Purser) on an all night flight, full with agents looking for any available seat. We had a large family with 2 lap children, (no question on size). It was only after takeoff that the father approached me and asked where his child's seat was and would I move the person now occupying it..Yes, he had a valid ticket for this little one. Valid mistake on our part BUT I felt bettter having the NASA reporting system to document the incident. If the Feds had been contacted, we were covered. The passenger had his childs ticket refunded, learned to communicate that the child was a paying passenger and not a lap child, and the crew (and agents) were "protected".

 

[Mach85ER]

Bull. The pilot "captains" (Hill and his cohorts) have been seizing any reason to not cooperative with the company on anything. If ASAP was so detrimental to pilots, where were all the complaints before the program expired? Since I also work at AA I know a lot of pilots, and I never heard a single complaint.

Add yourself to the same status of knowledge regarding ASAP that FrequentflierCA has here. The pilots were and are concerned, but like anything that deals with 3 parties and is somewhat complex, we didn't have all the details until negotiations broke down. I sided with APA after reviewing the facts. We had more than a few who were upset with APA too. After reviewing the facts, most of them sided with APA too. You might still find a few who will accept anything that AA says. I've always found these guys are near ignorant regarding the facts after discussing the issue for a couple of minutes.

 

[FWAAA]

Delta and its pilots agreed to reinstate its pilots' ASAP program:

http://biz.yahoo.com/pz/090128/158511.html

Any chance that AA and the APA come to an agreement to reinstate AA's program?

 

[youbetcha]

Delta and its pilots agreed to reinstate its pilots' ASAP program:

http://biz.yahoo.com/pz/090128/158511.html

Any chance that AA and the APA come to an agreement to reinstate AA's program?

I would presume if they got the same no recriminations letter from AA that APFA got, then they would reconsider. I don't know if it is that contained an issue for them. Both the pilots and AA are fully entrenched in their negotiaion positions. ASAP for the pilots became a cause and rightfully so when AA decided they would take disciplinary action. That is why APFA would not sign on till they had the assurances in writing.

 

[skipfly]

I would presume if they got the same no recriminations letter from AA that APFA got, then they would reconsider. I don't know if it is that contained an issue for them. Both the pilots and AA are fully entrenched in their negotiaion positions. ASAP for the pilots became a cause and rightfully so when AA decided they would take disciplinary action. That is why APFA would not sign on till they had the assurances in writing.

The flight ASAP program has always had disciplinary action it it. The problem was brought on because the APA wanted what M&E ASAP has had for years no discipline. AA offered up "Just Culture" as a way to accept or reject reports. The APA has been offered a new 120 day extension from the FAA under the old agreement to work it out. AA seems willing and the FAA has offered to extend, but it really shouldn't surprise anyone that the APA does not seem to be on board or in any hurry. Kinda silly if you are one of the pilots that the FAA is starting to go after now.

Bottom line is this, AA and the APA owe it to the flying public to get their program together. Not to mention that they owe the pilots a self reporting system. ASAP is a safety program to make flying safer, there should be NO negotiating! If something is going to be changed it should only to make the program better, not to gain something because you feel that you lost something else!