American Airlines and Labor Negotiations

[Kev3188]

Not surprising that selective "standardization" of benefits from Management extends just to the company's self-insured health insurance costs, but not to retirement benefits depending upon the work group? So Fleet Service gets the lower side of the health insurance AND the lower side of retirement benefits?

We have this same issue at my carrier. Part of the problem is that we (across the industry) either don't know our value, or don't recognize it.

Ever hear a pilot say "I just press the Autopilot button?" Probably not, but how many times do you hear "I just throw bags?" Couple that with the constant barrage of "you're just lucky to have a job" messaging over the last 30 years, and it's not hard to see how it could come to pass.

The harder question is how to fix it. You guys just happen to be up to bat.

 

[Tim Nelson]

I will admit that's an issue that keeps repeating in my head... I understand the Company's POV of wanting one health insurance plan/program for all employees as to standardize policies, but yet, we have these huge outliers on retirement benefits! The rumor I heard was that the 16% was not even a matching contribution requirement, but was automatic regardless of whatever a pilot would contributed.

Not surprising that selective "standardization" of benefits from Management extends just to the company's self-insured health insurance costs, but not to retirement benefits depending upon the work group? So Fleet Service gets the lower side of the health insurance AND the lower side of retirement benefits?

thats what management wants

 

[Tim Nelson]

Did you ever stop to think for a moment that this was planned intentionally to keep us divided and weak? We are so divided and lost that no one group knows what the other wants or has. We only care about our own group and that's about half of us at best. This was all planned well ahead of time. For it to be successful the NMB had to be in on it. Mission accomplished.

if the company said they will show us the offer, that would be appreciated. We know Mr Baskett and Sito wont. Just one big "Tuffa lucka" cant tell ya from Sito.
Then again he told cltrat that he would scrap the iam pension if the 401 was better. lmao.

 

[Jester]

We have this same issue at my carrier. Part of the problem is that we (across the industry) either don't know our value, or don't recognize it.

Ever hear a pilot say "I just press the Autopilot button?" Probably not, but how many times do you hear "I just throw bags?" Couple that with the constant barrage of "you're just lucky to have a job" messaging over the last 30 years, and it's not hard to see how it could come to pass.

The harder question is how to fix it. You guys just happen to be up to bat.

I understand why pilots earn (a lot) more income than we do given the level of training, education, responsibility, etc., so I don't begrudge them. Where I am having a problem is how the Company claims all work groups are critical to a successful operation of the airline while pushing for standardized health insurance benefits (in theory, treating all as equal), but once the pilots pushed heavy on a huge 401K retirement contribution, they got it. However, let LUS fleet service push for its health insurance plan, now it becomes an issue of equality as even Isom pointed out that he has the same plan. Seriously?

As for pilots down talking their profession, I have heard more than a few refer to their immediate transcon as "closet time" for the next 5 hours, as they sit in a space about the size of a closet with a closed door listening to music or reading.

 

[charlie Brown]

if the company said they will show us the offer, that would be appreciated. We know Mr Baskett and Sito wont. Just one big "Tuffa lucka" cant tell ya from Sito.
Then again he told cltrat that he would scrap the iam pension if the 401 was better. lmao.

I could care less if the company wants to show you the entire package! More power to them. But let me ask you a question since you state you would like to see it. With what you know the company is offering the IAM side right now ( or I should say taking away) is there actually something you feel you would see in the proposal to make you vote yes? What would that be? Just for curiosity sake.

 

[cltrat]

You must have not gotten the memo CB he’ll have Sitos job by then at which point all those members he’s supposedly doing it for will be forgotten

 

[Tim Nelson]

I could care less if the company wants to show you the entire package! More power to them. But let me ask you a question since you state you would like to see it. With what you know the company is offering the IAM side right now ( or I should say taking away) is there actually something you feel you would see in the proposal to make you vote yes? What would that be? Just for curiosity sake.

its not for me or you to say. I believe in full disclosure and im grateful if the company puts it out although it would be more appropriate for the union. Id vote no if we cant keep the current health care but its not about me, its about fully disclosing because Sito lies.
At any rate, i fully support the company wanting to increase my retirement over you and sito knifing us with the pension. But you dont care since your Grand Lodge pension is fully funded and you expense your health care on our dime.
At any rate, I fully expect the stall to continue past April 2019 and i wonder if mx wont get a card drive going before then? Good Grief!

 

[charlie Brown]

its not for me or you to say. I believe in full disclosure and im grateful if the company puts it out although it would be more appropriate for the union. Id vote no if we cant keep the current health care but its not about me, its about fully disclosing because Sito lies.
At any rate, i fully support the company wanting to increase my retirement over you and sito knifing us with the pension. But you dont care since your Grand Lodge pension is fully funded and you expense your health care on our dime.
At any rate, I fully expect the stall to continue past April 2019 and i wonder if mx wont get a card drive going before then? Good Grief!

So you think you know me good enough to say what I care about and what I don’t? Really??
I care and speak and fight for what the members I represent tell me to fight for. I care about the issues the membership express to me to care about. Nothing more than that. I have never nor will I ever negotiate for myself. And I’m pretty confident the membership I represent believes that. And the day they don’t, is the day I should no longer be on the negotiating team. That imo goes for anybody on the team.

 

[Tim Nelson]

So you think you know me good enough to say what I care about and what I don’t? Really??
I care and speak and fight for what the members I represent tell me to fight for. I care about the issues the membership express to me to care about. Nothing more than that. I have never nor will I ever negotiate for myself. And I’m pretty confident the membership I represent believes that. And the day they don’t, is the day I should no longer be on the negotiating team. That imo goes for anybody on the team.

Mr CB get your dirty hands off my retirement. You do what is safe. You dont have the balls to stand up and fight to get us out of this unsustainable pension.

Again, get your filthy hands off my retirement and let me get the 401k.
Or, at the least, you can still refrain from telling the members that their pension will need whacked again but allow the educated members to have a choice.
Parker +1 401k
Mr CB-1 pension kniffer

 

[NYer]

Did you ever stop to think for a moment that this was planned intentionally to keep us divided and weak? We are so divided and lost that no one group knows what the other wants or has. We only care about our own group and that's about half of us at best. This was all planned well ahead of time. For it to be successful the NMB had to be in on it. Mission accomplished.

Division is only possible in the absence of dialogue. If we don't talk to each other and honestly go over all different scenarios we face then it is harder to gain the most we can.

 

[charlie Brown]

Mr CB get your dirty hands off my retirement. You do what is safe. You dont have the balls to stand up and fight to get us out of this unsustainable pension.

Again, get your filthy hands off my retirement and let me get the 401k.
Or, at the least, you can still refrain from telling the members that their pension will need whacked again but allow the educated members to have a choice.
Parker +1 401k
Mr CB-1 pension kniffer

Tim
Do you believe I should negotiate for what the members have expressed to me that they want negotiated??
And I think opinions would vary about my balls thank you.

 

[Tim Nelson]

Tim
Do you believe I should negotiate for what the members have expressed to me that they want negotiated??
And I think opinions would vary about my balls thank you.

They arent educated about the pension and how the pension trustees are just gonna grab more of it. People trust you and will listen to you and prez bs about the pension.
your not on any moral high ground keeping people ignorant so spare me that you are doing what people want.

nobody wants to give the rest of their pension away.

 

[Kev3188]

really unfortunate that you have to display so much hate.
That said, the pension is toast. Period. Doesnt matter what agreement. Your future benefits that you already earned are "toast".
Its goin to be used as fuel to water that plant to keep it green in the desert. Look, it screws me too. Not sure what politics have anything to do with it. Even when I win, whats done is done.
Me and you will get $34 a month x years. Like it or not.
The difference is that you would be happy to keep tossing more company contributions in the fire, whereas I want to build a retirement.

What’s the current multiplier?

 

[Tim Nelson]

What’s the current multiplier?

the current multiplier is around $55. Before it was whacked in 2014 it was $83. Then whacked to $48 and after a few dines its up to $55.
Thats all Full Time.

Notice, for the 30%+ part time the multipliar is prolly around high $30s since our PT subsidize full time regarding health and pension. Never mind that many dont even reach 1600 hours and only get a % of credit. A man isnt a union man if he negotiates that chit.

 

[Tim Nelson]

its been pretty informative on this page lately as the personal attacks have been limited. Cool