American Airlines and Labor Negotiations

[Tim Nelson]

Food for thought.

In the beginning Jerry Glass said to Harry Lombardo “Why don’t you just take one or the other contract and we’ll just give you the money”

The Company knew that very green pastures were on the horizon.

Now at the end of the day however a deal winds up being struck doesn’t matter until we vote on them and pass. The Association can accept anything the Company offers it, try to sell it up or down with all sorts of Roadshows and colorful mailings. But at the end of the day the decision is still ours to make.

What leverage does the Association have?

Well the Company is not getting the full synergies of the Merger until we’re all under the same contracts. They say the proposal will cost them hundreds of millions but those synergies will also save them hundreds of millions. That includes the Maintenance programs, IT and payroll, and maybe shifting workers around after buyouts. And those buyouts will save them many millions as well.

please advise us exactly what synergies the company has left to get other than a very tiny payroll issue, catering, lavs, lus health, deicing? All other synergies have been realized.
There exist no other significant reason why the company would negotiate and give millions.
Alex needs to focus and not pull a Pontus Pilot and wash his hands and letling people vote.
must not vote on the current offer. is it better than dl and ua? without a doubt. but too much for me to lose. remember weez, we must kick the can down the road and not let my lus slip by.

 

[Tim Nelson]

Tim does the association have any leverage at all??

no. the association can just say no. thats some leverage i guess but the union cooperated and signed a contract that it will cooperate with management and not participate in a strike or any other actions.

 

[Tim Nelson]

Thank you driver exactly. It won’t change anything already agreed to. But we’re also not at the point where we can petition for those Section 6 talks yet.

I do firmly believe the Company will modify their offers officially before then and we’ll see what happens?

This whole thing is still extremely similar to how Negotiations took place in the past with the CWA PSA. They also were at loggerheads and talking tough when suddenly BAM they had a deal.

It might be how they always make the play?

yes it will. everything already agreed to can be scrapped and will be scraped.

 

[ALUS78]

yes it will. everything already agreed to can be scrapped and will be scraped.

Exactly, if you keep spitting in someones face.Vindictive why not they are saving millions

 

[ALUS78]

Tim what these guys are saying won't happen,can't happen we've already seen happen .Why cant they get that through their heads

 

[WeAAsles]

Exactly, if you keep spitting in someones face.Vindictive why not they are saving millions

I believe it was one of your own Negotiators who alluded to the possibility that the offer from the Company when actual long term financials are taken into account may possibly be cost neutral or even cost negative.

This is of course over the long term and the Airline Data Project doesn’t make future projections on Labor expenses.

Spitting in ones face Al is trying to take away their work and siphoning any economic improvements away through raising the Medical expenses of the individuals.

But I’m sure we’ll continue to respectfully disagree with each other.

 

[WeAAsles]

Tim what these guys are saying won't happen,can't happen we've already seen happen .Why cant they get that through their heads

Are you speaking about me? I will not engage TN any longer.

But I don’t recall myself stating any “absolutes”

I’m not one of the guys who does “absolutes” on here. I prefer to go with “common sense” and “cognitive reasoning” myself.

 

[Tim Nelson]

Tim what these guys are saying won't happen,can't happen we've already seen happen .Why cant they get that through their heads

its still admirable that Alex is fighting like hell to get his laa on our current lus health.
do i think its all fake news, Al? hell yea cuz the company already said keeping lus health care is a deal breaker so there is virtually zero chance of alex garcia delivering on his iron clad guarantees.
im afraid that NYer is spot on regarding this and is being honest with his members, but what else can Alex do since I cuffed Sito? And although NYer is being truthful to his peeps, my perspective is different and we gotta hope alex doesnt flip flop.

 

[Kev3188]

I would think Fleet lost most of it's leverage when working each other's metal was agreed to...

 

[Tim Nelson]

Exactly, if you keep spitting in someones face.Vindictive why not they are saving millions

the company will sweeten the offer but not as much as mr blowhard says. after they toss in some more $, phl clt cargo, and extend lus health a year....they done according to superfly. Not sure if they offered this yet as they most likely arent goin to negotiate in town halls.
in fact the reason why no dates are scheduled is due to the iam and twu convention schedules. trying to balance the numerous conventions, elections, and conferences of 2 different industrial unions is taxing to negotiations.
Once in section 6, fly says the company will start breaking balls. look for a couple twu stations to burn and for phl to possibly lose the 70s work to bring talks to a truncated conclusion.

 

[WeAAsles]

I would think Fleet lost most of it's leverage when working each other's metal was agreed to...

And if you saw the Roadshows the Executives said they lost much of their leverage when they gave out the wage increases as well.

Both sides relented much motivation to getting it done.

Again IMO the offers will be tweaked and be made officially soon.

 

[NYer]

look at the other end in what the company might potentially 'lose'. the mediator could suggest that the company open up it's profits, ala dl. if parker is correct that this company will soon realize an additional $1.5+ billion in post-merger synergies and also receive an additional $800 million a year from the credit card deals....then yes, we are on pace for yearly $3 billion-$7 billion yearly profits.

those profit sharing checks take from upper mngt. and investors and add to our wealth. does the company want this to happen?

if you dismiss this as impossible, then the company would be morons to negotiate...just let this drag on forever. i'll admit that labor is behind the 8-ball since the 1970s, but the usa is not a corporatist state yet.

there is a downside to the company playing hard-ball.

The NMB won't suggest the Company needs to "open up their profits" as it relates to profit sharing.

The NMB process for negotiations can force an outcome on Labor and/or the Company. It is debatable who would end up on the losing end of that but having an outside source dictate what we end up with is not in our best interest, whether it is by Arbitration, a PEB or Congress imposing a JCBA.

 

[Racer X]

stop sugar coating. you guys need to say "layoff". ive seen this 5 times over my career. With less work, company will do layoffs and realize synergies. there is NEVER overstaffing as ive never seen that. stop using that term. 6 months after this offer, a few thousand will lose their jobs while others will lose their weekends when the bottom drops cuz of members being displaced elsewhere.
the company hasnt had a layoff for 5 years so many are desensitized about being affected. But ive watched 2 company videos and the management narrators seem to scream how american has to employ 20,000 extra bodies than delta or united.
dont b so comfortable thinking that if the union bosses recommend a no vote that more than 5 people will listen.
Our members only care about the bonus and buyout just like at United.

I’m not sugar coating. I’m saying that IT IS JOB LOSS. You want to say layoff then you say layoff. I’m simply relating that the company says there will be no job loss with the loss of catering / lavs/ and cargo . I’m totally disagreeing with that. How that is sugar coating I’m not sure. Read what I’m saying.

 

[WeAAsles]

I’m not sugar coating. I’m saying that IT IS JOB LOSS. You want to say layoff then you say layoff. I’m simply relating that the company says there will be no job loss with the loss of catering / lavs/ and cargo . I’m totally disagreeing with that. How that is sugar coating I’m not sure. Read what I’m saying.

Avoid it Racer.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Venus_flytrap

 

[Racer X]

Avoid it Racer.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Venus_flytrap

Copy. Check.