ATA Flew 757's...

[ual777fan]

First off, I want to wish all of ATA's employees the very best. Waking up in the morning to discover your job is gone with absolutely no prior warning is a horrible situation.

That said... ATA flew 6 757's powered by RB211-535E4 jets, which if memory serves, is what powers AA 757's. I was wondering if AA might be interested in looking to pick them up cheap from the liquidation or a lessor? I know AA just leased 19 TWA 757's to Delta because they didn't want to bother with another engine type. Maybe American could be looking to replace some of that lost capacity? Any thoughts?

 

[1 VF-1 2NV]

It would serve AA right...

 

[whlinder]

Why on earth would AA want to add capacity?

If AA wanted to grab those 757s in order to replace some MD80s, then I could understand it.

Or TZ's 738s (if they are compatible) to replace some MD80s.

 

[ual777fan]

Why on earth would AA want to add capacity?

If AA wanted to grab those 757s in order to replace some MD80s, then I could understand it.

Or TZ's 738s (if they are compatible) to replace some MD80s.

Well adding 6 757's to replace the 19 that departed for Delta, I don't think would really be seen as increasing capacity. I know here in Austin there are several routes which are almost routinely overbooked (AUS-SJC comes to mind). Until AA leased the 757's to Delta, I know the early morning SJC run was routinely made with a 757.

And ATA's 737-800's are powered by CFM56-7B which appear on face to be the same engines that AA uses to power their 738's. According to Wikipedia, ATA had 12 737-800's, I have no idea as to whether they are leased or owned.

 

[jimntx]

I know AA just leased 19 TWA 757's to Delta because they didn't want to bother with another engine type. Maybe American could be looking to replace some of that lost capacity? Any thoughts?

Technical Correction: AA did NOT lease the a/c to DL. The a/c were leased to TWA, and AA does not like to lease equipment unless absolutely necessary. AA notified the lessor that they were not interested in renewing the leases upon expiration. The lessor then went looking for a new customer and found one in DL. I heard, but can not confirm, that AFTER the lessor had signed contracts with DL, AA thought better of their earlier decision and tried to renew the leases.

On a personal note: I LOVED the former TW 75s. The location of the lavs at mid-cabin in Main and the full-sized trash carts along with the newer, improved video system were great.

But, back to the topic, we could definitely use more 75s if available. Certain routes that used to be 75s and are now flown with S80s would benefit from additional capacity.

 

[L1011Ret]

Technical Correction: AA did NOT lease the a/c to DL. The a/c were leased to TWA, and AA does not like to lease equipment unless absolutely necessary. AA notified the lessor that they were not interested in renewing the leases upon expiration. The lessor then went looking for a new customer and found one in DL. I heard, but can not confirm, that AFTER the lessor had signed contracts with DL, AA thought better of their earlier decision and tried to renew the leases.

On a personal note: I LOVED the former TW 75s. The location of the lavs at mid-cabin in Main and the full-sized trash carts along with the newer, improved video system were great.

But, back to the topic, we could definitely use more 75s if available. Certain routes that used to be 75s and are now flown with S80s would benefit from additional capacity.

AA original purchase of TWA specified that the TWA 757 had a different engine type and that they would likely be returned to the lessor in 2007. This Power Presentation made by AA in the Spring of 2001.

 

[ual777fan]

Technical Correction: AA did NOT lease the a/c to DL. The a/c were leased to TWA, and AA does not like to lease equipment unless absolutely necessary. AA notified the lessor that they were not interested in renewing the leases upon expiration. The lessor then went looking for a new customer and found one in DL. I heard, but can not confirm, that AFTER the lessor had signed contracts with DL, AA thought better of their earlier decision and tried to renew the leases.

On a personal note: I LOVED the former TW 75s. The location of the lavs at mid-cabin in Main and the full-sized trash carts along with the newer, improved video system were great.

But, back to the topic, we could definitely use more 75s if available. Certain routes that used to be 75s and are now flown with S80s would benefit from additional capacity.

Thanks for the correction or additional information. I wasn't sure if TWA had actually owned the planes or if they had leased them. I know the expensive lease rates were the reason the 717's were returned a few years ago, instead of replacing the F100's which were eventually retired a few years after that.

 

[FWAAA]

AA original purchase of TWA specified that the TWA 757 had a different engine type and that they would likely be returned to the lessor in 2007. This Power Presentation made by AA in the Spring of 2001.

Exactly. When AA purchased the TWA assets, AA said that the 757s would be replaced by newly ordered 757s, just like the 763s. Of course, like many other plans, the horrific events later that year sidelined those orders and, of course, Boeing canceled the 757 program before AA turned profitable and could consider ordering them.

AA did place the orders for the 763s not long after the purchase closed, and in 2003, nine of them were delivered so the ex-TWA 763s could be returned to the lessors.

 

[MCI transplant]

Why on earth would AA want to add capacity?

If AA wanted to grab those 757s in order to replace some MD80s, then I could understand it.

Or TZ's 738s (if they are compatible) to replace some MD80s.

<_< ------ If the price was right, I believe AA would be foolish not to pick them up! That's if ATA in fact owned them!

 

[MCI transplant]

<_< ------ L1011, I believe ATA still flew two, or three, L1011-500's up until at least last year!!! I talked to a dead heading crew last year in DFW, and they were more than pleased to talk shop, with an ex "T-Way" person, about the Aircraft!!!

 

[ual777fan]

deleted and combined below...

 

[ual777fan]

The planes were flown by ATA under an operating lease with a buyout option when the lease expired as of there last 10K which was filed in 2004. So I don't know if they went through and purchased those planes or if AA could sit down with the leaser, put a deal on the table and they would take it...

Just to provide a smidge more information. The leases that ATA had are counted as airline assets and would be put up for auction just like everything else at the airline. Considering these planes also had a buyout option at the end of their leases AA could potentially pick up these leases for super cheap and then exercise the buyout clause.

Just to provide some more information... These are the 757's that are in discussion.

690 27971 B757-23N N514AT American Trans Air
735 27973 B757-23N N517AT American Trans Air
737 27974 B757-23N N518AT American Trans Air
779 27975 B757-23N N519AT American Trans Air
814 27976 B757-23N N520AT American Trans Air
843 29330 B757-23N N522AT American Trans Air
972 32584 B757-33N N550TZ American Trans Air
978 32586 B757-33N N552TZ American Trans Air
1031 33525 B757-33N N560TZ ATA Airlines
1032 33526 B757-33N N561TZ ATA Airlines

 

[NewHampshire Black Bears]

AA picking up "same engine" planes ?...................Absolutely !

AA is a very opportunistic carrier, sometimes to the point of being........"uncanny"
(For instance. AA along with others...NW/UA, croaks ATA in Hawaii, and then buys their a/c "on the cheap" )......................(uncanny)

 

[CubsFanJohn]

This is just an outsider (I don't work in the Industry) view on this but knowning AA Management which aren't the brightest crayon's in the box so I doubt they'd be smart enough to pick them up. I do agree that they should and use them on TATL Service, e.g. JFK-STN, JFK-BCN, and add a few new TATL routes. That would allow a few 763's to be freed up.

 

[eolesen]

Don't get a woodie yet.... All 29 aircraft (including the DC10-30s) are showing on the S.365 filing, so they're not transferring anything to the parent company.

ILFC owns the 738's, and they probably have a waiting list of customers where they can place them. The other wildcard is WN. They're not showing up as an unsecured creditor, but I'd be surprised if their codeshare liability didn't put them on the list. Assuming an aircraft lease as settlement isn't out of the question, especially if ILFC already does business with WN.

The 757-200's are all at least 10 to 15 years old. Might be a good idea, or it might be a bunch of hangar queens once AA M&E has a chance to look over them... Looks like Boeing holds the paper on these.

The four 757-300's are oddballs that only a few airlines might be interested in. I don't see AA going with an unsupported small subfleet. They'll probably go to an existing operator (Condor, LTU, NW, CO).

But it would sure be nice for AA to grab a dozen 738's with winglets right now.