Cattle call may stay

WNrforlife

Senior
Apr 17, 2003
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www.usaviation.com
Cattle call may stay :up: :up: :up:
Results mixed in Southwest's try at assigned seating

By Meredith Cohn
sun reporter

October 6, 2006

DULLES, Va. -- Southwest Airlines' chief said yesterday that a summer experiment in assigning seats yielded mixed results and more research is needed to decide whether the carrier can - and should - abandon its distinctive first-come, first-served seating.
Southwest remains the only major airline that does not assign seats in advance on its flights. The airline began testing assignments in July on some flights from San Diego, a move that delighted many passengers and aviation analysts but disappointed die-hard supporters of the cattle call.

Officials assigned the seats at the airport through Labor Day and used several boarding methods. They said Southwest could only change its policy if flights were not delayed, a key to its profitability.

"Some boarding methods were a little faster, most were a little slower," said Southwest's Chief Executive Officer Gary Kelly, who visited Washington Dulles International Airport where the airline launched service yesterday.

He said the airline will not make a decision until next year and will likely conduct more research. It will also complete more surveys to determine how many passengers want a seat in advance. That has been the No. 1 request from passengers in recent years. But a surprising number of people have come forward to oppose a change, Kelly said.

Joe Austin, a Northern Virginia resident headed to Las Vegas from Dulles yesterday, echoed some of the messages received recently by Southwest.

"I kind of like seeing what's available and choosing a window or an aisle depending on my mood," Austin said.

But his wife, Katrina, said that when they travel with their two kids they prefer assigned seats.

Southwest will spend 2007 updating its reservation system with technology so it can handle seat assignments.

But it also will spend the next year ramping up service at Dulles, where it began offering 12 daily flights to four cities, and promoting service to its headquarters airport at Dallas Love Field. It can add flights there now that Congress overturned the so-called Wright amendment that allowed flights only from a handful of neighboring states.

Southwest does not plan on launching service at new airports in 2007, after three years in a row of additions. But it will likely add flights to its network.

That doesn't mean resolving the seating isn't a priority.

Terry Trippler, an airline expert at myvacationpassport.com, a Minneapolis-based travel club, said it should be the priority.

"They do have to figure this out," he said. "You can stand alone as the only airline doing this when you stand alone as the only low-fare carrier. And they were for so long. But there is so much competition in the low-cost area that Southwest is going to be forced by the JetBlues, AirTrans and Frontiers to offer assigned seating. They'll give you a seat and other things like TV."

Indeed, Tony Comer, of Laytonsville in Montgomery County, who was flying to Houston on AirTran Airways yesterday, said he prefers JetBlue Airways because it offers DirecTV.

"And I like having the aisle seat," he said. "I'd pay a little more to know I'm getting it. It's not so much price with me as value."

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This all goes back to something I posted a long time ago:

Let's not forget that open seating enables us to make those quick turns that have been the envy of the industry over the years... our fleet does not make money sitting on the ground, it's that simple. It amazes me whenever I nonrev to hear Customers grumble about not having their "assigned seat". Of course it's not as readily apparent on the first flight of the day, but if it's a continuing passenger, I'll tell them to observe how quick that plane is turned, then I'll ask them how much they think that assigned seating would have slowed down the process. All of a sudden it all makes sense!
 
I'd find it hard to understand how dividing/boarding your passengers into Rows 1 through 8, Rows 9 through 16, and all remaining passengers is any slower than dividing/boarding them in Groups A, B, and C. What I like about assigned sitting is first purchase, first seat selection (isn't really any different from first come, first served) It also works great for families traveling with children.
 
please don't refer to our fellow citizens as cattle...its rude and not right. who had the most domestic boardings? i guess America is just one huge ranch! haha!
 
Hey guys,

I would like to add a view point of both competitor AND customer. First of all, as a customer, it felt good to be rewarded to checking in early and getting the chance to be in the A list...so to speak. I like to sit towards the back so regardless, I probably would had gotten my choice even in the B line. We all have to be at the airport early, so I didn't have a problem. I am responsible and go by the rules, so I am happy.

As a competitor, the method is a pain in the butt. Why? I'll use LAX as an example. This terminal is VERY congested!! Three lines make their way out to the walkways and make it difficult for people to get about the terminal. I always feel closed in with the constant lines jig jagging around alone with the already crowded seating areas. LAX is a terrorist dream come true.

I have no problem with the SWA method, however most airports are not designed for this method.

This is just my observation. SW needs terminals with adequate space for their method. That's my only beef. Besides that, I could care less. :)
 
I'd find it hard to understand how dividing/boarding your passengers into Rows 1 through 8, Rows 9 through 16, and all remaining passengers is any slower than dividing/boarding them in Groups A, B, and C. What I like about assigned sitting is first purchase, first seat selection (isn't really any different from first come, first served) It also works great for families traveling with children.

Not if said family books a ticket on a flight that's already 75% full, or if they misconnect. Then it royally sucks.

The advantages/disadvantages of assigned seating vs open seating are magnified for groups of people traveling together.

Ideally the best solution is half the plane open seating and half assigned seating but the logistics could be a problem.

Hey guys,

I would like to add a view point of both competitor AND customer. First of all, as a customer, it felt good to be rewarded to checking in early and getting the chance to be in the A list...so to speak. I like to sit towards the back so regardless, I probably would had gotten my choice even in the B line. We all have to be at the airport early, so I didn't have a problem. I am responsible and go by the rules, so I am happy.

As a competitor, the method is a pain in the butt. Why? I'll use LAX as an example. This terminal is VERY congested!! Three lines make their way out to the walkways and make it difficult for people to get about the terminal. I always feel closed in with the constant lines jig jagging around alone with the already crowded seating areas. LAX is a terrorist dream come true.

I have no problem with the SWA method, however most airports are not designed for this method.

This is just my observation. SW needs terminals with adequate space for their method. That's my only beef. Besides that, I could care less. :)

When did Southwest move their departure gates outside the security checkpoint?
 
I'd find it hard to understand how dividing/boarding your passengers into Rows 1 through 8, Rows 9 through 16, and all remaining passengers is any slower than dividing/boarding them in Groups A, B, and C. What I like about assigned sitting is first purchase, first seat selection (isn't really any different from first come, first served) It also works great for families traveling with children.
And what I like best about open seating is that I have a good chance of getting a window or aisle seat when my boss tells me to head out to the airport because I have to be on the Southwest flight to LA tonight. Southwest still does something that fewer and fewer major airlines are doing...preboarding families with children. I actually had it happen twice (Delta and TWA) where I had my assigned seats, only to show up at the airport to discover that the seats were "reassigned" and my 3 year old was assigned a seat by herself - away from the parents (who weren't assigned to sit together either).
 
Like a few others, my view on this is from a competitor and pax. While it is great to be in the A group to board, it sux to have to stand in a line for 45 minutes just for a flipping seat that you want. Add to that, what if most in the A group want an aisle seat? Now they have to get up and let the window & middle seaters in. Flying Non-rev, I'll take anything as I am trying to get to work. When paying in advance, I don't like it. Where I work, we turn our late arrivals in 25 minutes so telling me that WN can't make a profit from assigned seating is bunk. It can be done. Perhaps the A group should be Window seats, B the Middle and C the aisle. Just an idea that I am sure will be shot down by Pellets, Snipers and Howitzers. Tell NK to test their next bomb on this too, I don't care.... IMO B)
 
The airline began testing assignments in July on some flights from San Diego, a move that delighted many passengers and aviation analysts but disappointed die-hard supporters of the cattle call.
Would be interesting to see the percentages. Percentage of delighted passengers who like(d) assigned seating and the pecentage of diehards who like the cattle car method.
 
It is rather funny going by a SWA gate and seeing that "lucky" guy standing in chute "A", number one in line, leaning on the railing because he's tired standing reading a paper and noting it's still about an hour before the flight and sometimes the flight is running late. He's so proud he's got that number one position. NO seat on ANY airline is worth that monkey motion of standing there like some "numb nutz" to get that seat! Give me assigned seating anytime thank you! I'd rather be sitting in the gate area with my friends or family that I'm traveling with, enjoying my coffee and not looking like I'm standing in line at the bank! What some people won't do to save a buck....... :down:
 
It is rather funny going by a SWA gate and seeing that "lucky" guy standing in chute "A", number one in line, leaning on the railing because he's tired standing reading a paper and noting it's still about an hour before the flight

Who's dumb enough to stand for an hour? Us experienced 'chute cattle' don't stand, we 'pull up a floor' and stretch out and relax, sometimes to the point of dozing off!
 
Who's dumb enough to stand for an hour? Us experienced 'chute cattle' don't stand, we 'pull up a floor' and stretch out and relax, sometimes to the point of dozing off!
You beat me to it mga...IF I have an A card, I remain comfortably seated until the A line is pretty much ended, then get up and get on board. I actually had the last person to board in the C group take the aisle seat next to me and my daughter on one flight. And maybe fluf can tell me how much more comfortable a center seat in front of the exit row that doesn't recline is when you hold a boarding pass with that seat assigned to you.
 
It is rather funny going by a SWA gate and seeing that "lucky" guy standing in chute "A", number one in line, leaning on the railing because he's tired standing reading a paper and noting it's still about an hour before the flight and sometimes the flight is running late. He's so proud he's got that number one position. NO seat on ANY airline is worth that monkey motion of standing there like some "numb nutz" to get that seat! Give me assigned seating anytime thank you! I'd rather be sitting in the gate area with my friends or family that I'm traveling with, enjoying my coffee and not looking like I'm standing in line at the bank! What some people won't do to save a buck....... :down:

Yeah, what he said.