Do You Forsee More Wage Concessions To Offset Fuel

[kirkpatrick]

FWIW, I do not think that there is going to be a mass exodus of senior flight attendants as some seem to think.

I don't think there will be a "mass exodus" either. But I do think that anyone thinking of retiring in 2004 who is due a respectable amount of money would wait a few months for the payoff before going. I mean, if you were to get eight or ten grand if you waited until November, you wouldn't retire in August.

I'll guess one to two hundred, and not all at once. Some may wait a few months before finally calling it quits.

MK

 

[crew4aa]

If I were of retirement age, I would certainly take my pension and leave this fickle business and find alternative work to supplement my income.

I am 40 years old and I have doubts that when I get ready to retire there will be no retirement fund available to me. I will simply have to make certain that my 401k does the trick for me.

 

[LiveInAHotel]

I seriously doubt anyone's retirement date was influenced by who was president of their union at the time.

[post="176531"][/post]​

Do you fly for AA? No! Do you have 26 years with any airline? No! Have you been a member of a union who's President sold you out? No!

Since you don't work or fly for AA, butt out! Because you don't know JACK!

P.S. Your boy Tim Duncan sure choked in the Olympic Games!!

 

[Wretched Wrench]

P.S. Your boy Tim Duncan sure choked in the Olympic Games!!

[post="176562"][/post]​

????????????????????????

Is that related to the subject of this thread, or is it just general nastiness?

 

[LiveInAHotel]

????????????????????????

Is that related to the subject of this thread, or is it just general nastiness?

[post="176662"][/post]​

Not at all. We both are big NBA fans and he likes the Spurs and I like the Knicks. It's something between us and no pun intended for you.

 

[goingboeing]

If the management of AA steals my defined benefit pension plan I will exit AA.The pension issue will be the final straw on the camel's back.I'm a 19 year veteran of AA and I'm not at retirement age.

 

[local 12 proud]

est'a la vista, baby!

 

[eolesen]

There has never been even a hint of a SERP-type fund at CO. Remember, even if they don't tell the employees at such plans, they have to tell the SEC. The reason, Carty and company were anxious to get the RPA in place by 01APR03 was that the deadline for filing the financials with the SEC was 15APR03. How we found out about the SERP was through the public posting of the 10Q by the SEC. If there were such a plan at CO it would be known about by now.

Unfortunately, you're wrong. There is a SERP in place at CO, and there has been since their previous bankruptcy. It is even referred to in their 1993 proxy statement, since Bethune's retirement was expected at that time.

I don't think you'll find too many Fortune 500 corporations without one, unless they don't offer a retirement plan of any sort.

 

[Oneflyer]

If the management of AA steals my defined benefit pension plan I will exit AA

How exactly does one steal a defined benefit plan?

 

[LiveInAHotel]

How exactly does one steal a defined benefit plan?

[post="177301"][/post]​

Just ask Don Carty and he can tell you.

 

[goingboeing]

How exactly does one steal a defined benefit plan?

[post="177301"][/post]​

Class,can you spell Frank Lorenzo? Once upon a time there was an airline named Eastern Airlines and the emplyees had a retirement plan until Mr.Lorenzo stole it from the employees and then forced the airline into Chapter7.

Talk to an ex- CAL employee who worked for them 20+ years ago and ask them what happened to their retirement?

AA promised a defined benefit plan when I hired in 19 years ago and now they want to change the rules in the middle of the game.I don't have a problem with future AA employees having a different pension plan but it is morally wrong to move the goal posts in the middle of the game for the employees currently in the game.

 

[Oneflyer]

Mr.Lorenzo stole it from the employees and then forced the airline into Chapter7.

So Lorenzo actually took the money out of the pension plan and kept it for himself? Having read book "Grounded" about the Lorenzo and the Eastern bankruptcy I don't recall ever reading about how Lorenzo "Stole" the pensions. They might have been turned over the the Pension guarantee corp, but I don't believe Lorenzo kept any of the pension money.

I also would not compare AA's actions with anything Lorenzo did.

now they want to change the rules in the middle of the game.

When did AA say they were terminating the plan?

I don't have a problem with future AA employees having a different pension plan but it is morally wrong to move the goal posts in the middle of the game for the employees currently in the game.

I agree with you, completely. AA should honor the contract it made when it hired you. That being said, I personally believe AA and its unions would be better off without a defined benefit plan.

I think unions fail to grasp how much control they lose with the defined benefit plan. Airline management realizes that the unionized work force is essentially bound to the company, in a negeotiation in which side A needs side B, but side B doesn't really need side A, side A (the union) is bound to lose. A 45 year old employee with a pension too look after is much more likely to accept a pay cut than one that can up and leave, taking there retirement with them.

I understand that a 401k doesn't help someone that has already been working for 20-30 years, but to a new hire a pension and a 401k offer roughly the same benefit. Union membership would be smart to protect their own pensions by moving any new hires into a 401k.