Fuel prices way high!

[deltawatch]

Don't worry once big oil figures out how to control the alternatives they'll let us convert to the new fuels. Alternatives to oil are ready to go they haven't figured out how to make bucks from it, control it yet, ....

 

[US1YFARE]

Is this a rumor? I just read that US/HP will be offering lap dances on all int'l

Lap dances on Hawaii flights? I am definitely going to get a passport now.

 

[mrman]

I have an IDEA....I think all the airlines should get together in protest and pick a day to shut down the U.S. airline industry for a day...then maybe, just maybe the government might wake up and do something about these ridiculous, out of control, outrageous fuel prices. I realize many people would be inconvenienced, but it would certainly get the point across, wouldn't it?

Pick a Tuesday or a Wednesday for instance, and give customers enough advance notice to get rescheduled.


What the hell, since I'm on a roll...we should all refuse to fill our gas tanks for a weekend and STAY HOME with our families. I put 12 gallons in my tank last night and it cost me $39.60!!
That's just insane! :angry:

Why should the government do anything? If the gov't let market forces take effect, US in bankruptcy would have been shut down and capacity would be reduced today. The gov't has done something, they have let US survive two bankruptcies

 

[sharktooth]

Glassware will be the least of our worries in the not so distant future. This is not good people. What is our most fuel inefficient a/c (mainline)? I'm guessing the 767-200. The problem is the markets we use them in generate lots of revenue. And there is nothing to replace them with quickly.

If you are talking fuel per seat mile the most fuel inefficient aircraft would be the smaller aircraft, which also cannot do some of the missions, transcon, transatlantic and PacOps the larger aircraft does.

Also, loading up a CRJ with equipment to go overwater would cut into payload quite a bit (one fully equipped life raft would eliminate a greater percent of potential payload on a smaller aircraft vs a larger).

 

[Singleflyer]

Travelpro72, I am glad for your Aunt. She got a good deal and you know it. The problem with Tempe is they can't understand why I am mad about paying $540.00 on a one-way 290 mile flight and get only 290 miles. For total dollars spent, on four ticket RT is slightly more than a one-way fare, and the combined FF miles would be in the thousands. Don't price below break-even, that is what I tell my clients all of the time, you will never make it up on volume.

As Art says, its the fares stupid.

If they charged rational fares to FL for example, this fuel increase would not be as much of problem.

 

[BoeingBoy]

Fuel prices way high!, $105.51 dollars and rising. Where does this leave US?

The investor guidance that came out concurrent with the annual report estimated fuel prices averaging about $2.62/gal unhedged. With current crude prices, we're in the era of $3.00+ fuel - at least today. They estimated that hedges would save an average of about 7 cents/gal, but with higher prices the hedges become more valuable so the savings should be greater - just not enough to offset all the fuel price increase.

Oh - they estimate nearly 1.2 billion gallons of fuel will be used this year - so almost $12 million per 1 cent price increase.

Jim

 

[BoeingBoy]

I should have been a little clearer, or at least more specific.....

The statement about fuel costs increasing $900800 million was comparing it to 2007, when the average price paid was $2.20/gal. I assume they used the same estimated 2008 price as in the investor guidance - $2.62 - for a 42 cent increase, or about $500 million by my calculations (looking in the annual report for the 2007 fuel price, I see they say a 1 cent increase is worth $16 million instead of my $12 million for mainline only - that would up the extra cost to almost $700 million).

The consumption - estimated to be about 1.2 billion gallons - is for mainline only. Express in another nearly 400 million gallons, which US buys, for another $4 million per 1 cent increase (and probably why they say $16 million instead of the $12 million extra/cent that I used for mainline).

Of course, today's jet price is probably 40 cents higher than what they estimated for 2008. If it stays at these prices for the rest of the year, that another $4-500 million extra on top of the $800 million they previously mentioned.

Jim

 

[elixir]

Don't worry once big oil figures out how to control the alternatives they'll let us convert to the new fuels. Alternatives to oil are ready to go they haven't figured out how to make bucks from it, control it yet, ....

Wow, isn't that the truth...we put a guy on the moon over 20 years ago...with a Commodore 64 computer....the alternative is there....oilco hasn't patented it yet.

 

[700UW]

I dont know why someone keeps posting the 767 is not effiecent, you couldnt be more wrong.

Breathe easy with the 767
You can breathe easy with the 767 family. 767s produce less pollutant emissions per pound of fuel than any comparably sized jetliner. When combined with the fact that the 767 also burns significantly less fuel, the 767 is truly the "clear" winner. The 767 family is cleaner than industry standards for all categories of emissions -- nitrogen oxides, hydrocarbons, smoke and carbon monoxide.

767s burn less fuel
The 767 family of airplanes is the right size for the middle airplane market (200-250 seat airplanes). Lighter and more efficient than competing jetliners, the 767 family burns less fuel, for better environmental performance and improved operating economics

The 767 is the first widebody jetliner to be stretched twice. The 767-300ER is 10 feet (3.1 m) longer than the 767-200ER; and the new 767-400ER is 11 feet (3.4 m) longer than the 767-300.

The first 767 entered service in Sept. 8, 1982, since then 767 have flown more than 7.7 million flights, and carried millions of passengers.

The air flowing through a 767-400ER engine at takeoff power could inflate the Goodyear Blimp in seven seconds.

It takes about 60 gallons (227 l) of fuel per passenger to get from New York to London on board a 767-400ER. The same volume of gasoline would propel an economy car about half of that distance.

The 767 is the favorite airplane on Atlantic routes; it flies across the Atlantic more frequently than any other airplane.

The 767-400ER flight deck instrument panel has 82 percent fewer parts than other 767s. By using cast parts, the part count was reduced to 53 from 296. Production hours plummeted to 20 hours from 180 hours.

If GE CF6-80C2B8F engines were attached to a typical automobile, at takeoff power the car would accelerate from zero to 60 mph (96.5 kph) in less than half a second.

There are 3.1 million parts in a 767 provided by more than 800 suppliers.

The 767 is capable of cruising at altitudes up to 43,000 feet (13,106 m)

The 767-300ER and 767-400ER hold 23,980 gallons (90,770 l) of fuel - enough to fill 1,200 minivans. It takes only 28 minutes to fill the airplane.

The noise level of a 767 taking off from a 1.5 mile (3,000 m) runway is about the same as the average street corner traffic noise.

There are 90 miles (145 km) of electrical wiring in a 767-200ER, 117 miles (188 km) in a 767-300ER and 125 miles (201 km) in a 767-400ER.

 

[delta777]

I dont know why someone keeps posting the 767 is not effiecent, you couldnt be more wrong.

"The 767 is the first widebody jetliner to be stretched twice. The 767-300ER is 10 feet (3.1 m) longer than the 767-200ER; and the new 767-400ER is 11 feet (3.4 m) longer than the 767-300."

Not exactly. The -300 was stretched 21 feet versus the -200, and the -400 was lengthened another 21 feet over the -300 for a total length of 201 feet.

 

[700UW]

Well that came from Boeing's own webpage, guess you better tell them they are wrong.

767 Fun Facts
The 767 is the first widebody jetliner to be stretched twice. The 767-300ER is 10 feet (3.1 m) longer than the 767-200ER; and the new 767-400ER is 11 feet (3.4 m) longer than the 767-300.

Beoing 767 Fun Facts, From Boeing

The Boeing 767 family is a complete family of airplanes providing maximum market versatility in the 200- to 300-seat market. It includes four models:

767-200ER (extended range),
767-300ER -- approximately 10 feet (3.1 m) longer than the 767-200ER,
767-400ER -- approximately 11 feet (3.4 m) longer than the 767-300ER,
and a freighter based on the 767-300ER fuselage.

Beoing 767-From Boeing

Hate to tell you this, but your wrong delta:
767 Exterior-from Boeing

767-200=159 ft 2 inches
767-300=180 ft 3 inches
767-300=201 ft 3 inches

So is Boeing wrong?

 

[delta777]

Well that came from Boeing's own webpage, guess you better tell them they are wrong.



Beoing 767 Fun Facts, From Boeing


Beoing 767-From Boeing

Hate to tell you this, but your wrong delta:
767 Exterior-from Boeing

So is Boeing wrong?

The plane was not streched 42 feet from it original size.

Well, the 767-200 is 159ft long, the -400 is 201ft. which gives you a total stretch of 42 feet. That much is indisputable. It would appear Boeing is unsure on the length of their own aircraft!

QUOTE
767-200=159 ft 2 inches
767-300=180 ft 3 inches
767-300=201 ft 3 inches

Seems Boeing needs to do a little proof-reading on their airplane facts.

 

[BoeingBoy]

QUOTE
767-200=159 ft 2 inches
767-300=180 ft 3 inches
767-300=201 ft 3 inches

Seems Boeing needs to do a little proof-reading on their airplane facts.

Maybe Boeing isn't the one that needs to do some proof-reading.....two lengths for the -300?

Looks to me that Boeing is consistent with their stats - it's the same in 'Fun Facts' and the technical info, both of which match 700UW's numbers.

Anyway, back to fuel.....

For those that didn't see it, today's US Daily said that yesterday's (3/05) "composite" jet fuel price was $3.17/gallon.

Jim

 

[delta777]

Maybe Boeing isn't the one that needs to do some proof-reading.....two lengths for the -300?

Looks to me that Boeing is consistent with their stats - it's the same in 'Fun Facts' and the technical info, both of which match 700UW's numbers.

Anyway, back to fuel.....

For those that didn't see it, today's US Daily said that yesterday's (3/05) "composite" jet fuel price was $3.17/gallon.

Jim

Good Lord, who does the fact-checking over at Boeing? The "other" -300 would in fact be the -400. Kinda scary when Boeing is unsure of the specifics of their own aircraft.

 

[BoeingBoy]

Good Lord, who does the fact-checking over at Boeing? The "other" -300 would in fact be the -400. Kinda scary when Boeing is unsure of the specifics of their own aircraft.

Have you got a link to those "Boeing" specs? I sure can't find them on the Boeing site.

The 767 is the first widebody jetliner to be stretched twice. The 767-300ER is 10 feet (3.1 m) longer than the 767-200ER; and the new 767-400ER is 11 feet (3.4 m) longer than the 767-300.

From 'Fun Facts'

# 767-200ER (extended range),
# 767-300ER -- approximately 10 feet (3.1 m) longer than the 767-200ER,
# 767-400ER -- approximately 11 feet (3.4 m) longer than the 767-300ER

From '767 Family'

767 Technical Specs - External

767-200ER Technical Specs - General: length 159' 2"

767-300ER Technical Specs - General: Length 180' 3"

767-400ER Technical Specs- General: Length 201' 4"

Jim