GM Bailout

[delldude]

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Well (brother) dell,....MORE "government meddling" is EXACTLY what you're gonna get !!!!

Care to know why ??

(Before I give you the answer, only the Feds will loan them...that kind of ..do-re-mi)

Ever heard of the ol' saying........."For every action....there is a equal and opposite reaction" ??
(I know you have),

Or,

"You REAP what you sow" ??

In either case, your boys(the GOP) let Capitalism-AT-ANY-COST, run amok, so NOW it's time to "pay the piper", via the Democrats letting the FEDS virtually take OVER the GREED infested,now broke down..auto Industry.

When people UNDERSTAND that You CAN'T have it both ways, it's really easy to understand !!

So pay the piper and let Pelosi run the big three and mortgage your house,your wife and the kids for a down payment on your next car
You are that naive to think for one second that with the government DICTATING what DTW can make will get you a cheap vehicle??
I think it was Hitler that got into nationalizing all the German industry wasn't it?
Your party identifies with that kind of 'socialization change'?
You a cradle to grave kinda guy?

My boys?LOL....Alan Keyes dude....

 

[southwind]

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Well (brother) dell,....MORE "government meddling" is EXACTLY what you're gonna get !!!!

Care to know why ??

(Before I give you the answer, only the Feds will loan them...that kind of ..do-re-mi)

Ever heard of the ol' saying........."For every action....there is a equal and opposite reaction" ??
(I know you have),

Or,

"You REAP what you sow" ??

In either case, your boys(the GOP) let Capitalism-AT-ANY-COST, run amok, so NOW it's time to "pay the piper", via the Democrats letting the FEDS virtually take OVER the GREED infested,now broke down..auto Industry.

When people UNDERSTAND that You CAN'T have it both ways, it's really easy to understand !!

You got more "GOVERNMENT MEDLING" , than you'll be able to handle ,when you elected Nobama !

Reid, Franks, Pelosi, Dodd, Nobama, Franken....................now thats some scary #### ! :blink:

 

[southwind]

But bringing jobs back has to be realistic. Why should you and I pay so that Chrysler can keep Mexico employed? Or for GM to build SUVs in Russia?

Citizens in this country need to earn money to purchase goods but if US industries are taking jobs elsewhere to do things on the cheap, then where do US citizens get money to buy their products?

The US is the single largest market for everything. Workers in foreign countries earn far less and can't even afford to buy what they make. There is nowhere to sell!

It has to be realistic. It won't work any other way. And if we socialize healthcare, we're on par with Canada.

Stop taxing the crap out of them then ! :down:

 

[RDU Jetblast]

Stop taxing the crap out of them then ! :down:

I don't tax anyone.


But I do find YOU taxing at times.

 

[KCFlyer]

Stop taxing the crap out of them then ! :down:

There is a fine line between assessing a fair tax and giving away the farm. The tax breaks companies get for NOT hiring American workers amounts to giving away the farm. Could you identify the rate that does not equate to "taxing the crap out of them"? I mean...they turned a blind eye to companies like Tyco, whose "headquarters" was a PO Box in Bermuda, thus they paid NO tax.

 

[dapoes]

This is too funny: Pimp my Bailout

 

[KCFlyer]

A corporation has no morals, values or ethics. The people who run them do! Those same people have something called a fiduciary reponsibility to the shareholders. So in order to fulfill their fiduciary obligation of a suitable return on investment it is entirely ethical for the corporation to legally avoid taxes as Tyco did.

Bad example Piney...the people running companies like that also have no morals, values or ethics.

 

[delldude]

Bad example Piney...the people running companies like that also have no morals, values or ethics.

Lump the unions into that mix too,KC.

 

[Gilding the Lily]

While I'm on a rant here this needs to be done as a LOAN and the entire 25 Billion paid back with interest in 7 to 10 years.

Bob, both you and I know that $25b is only a drop in the hat. It is a drop that only postpones, not solves. Look at the current burn rate for each of the OEMs. GM and Chrysler would likely burn through their respective share by March, which only means that they will 1) come back to Congress with hat in hand again (likely) or 2) file chapter 11 (likely if congress refuses their request). If they file chapter 11 after the $25b, what good did it do? It only transferred loss, but through pennies on the dollar. And I am not so shy to say that I do not want their loss (i.e. certain creditors, equity holders, certain employees including management) to be transferred to me.

If they come back for more money, which would be inevitable at their current burn rates, then you are wasting money until we recognize that they need solutions... those solutions are only available, currently, through the chapter 11 process. This will allow them to shed many unwanted liabilites, reject many unwanted leases and contracts, wipe out equity holders, etc. Until the law is changed to allow the OEMs to make these changes though means other than through chapter 11, then chapter 11 is the only viable solution. If we want our tax money to be used as a loan, then let's allow it to be used as a backstop to other private loans to the OEMs to finance them through bankruptcy.

 

[RDU Jetblast]

that OPIC is a surprise!

Never heard of them but suspected they existed.

Wow. I learned something today.

 

[whatkindoffreshhell]

Do ya think the Detroit execs will again use their private jets to DC next week?

OR

How about driving in their own product and collecting supporters along the way thus assuring a huge caravan arrives at the steps of the Capitol on December 2nd?

Hey, if they can't organize a powerpoint presentation (and endure the discomfort of a eight-hour car ride) to DC then how serious do you think they really are about changing their auto companies for $25bil?

One question I would like to hear Congress ask Rick Wagoner is "what are you going to do when this $25bil runs out and you need more money?" Not if but when.

BTW, Cerebrus (the private equity fund that owns Chrysler) sucked $250mil worth of profit out of Mervyn's in California before they shut down the company and threw 18,000 employees out a job. Read about it, todays WSJ page B1.

 

[tech2101]

Do ya think the Detroit execs will again use their private jets to DC next week?

OR

How about driving in their own product and collecting supporters along the way thus assuring a huge caravan arrives at the steps of the Capitol on December 2nd?

Hey, if they can't organize a powerpoint presentation (and endure the discomfort of a eight-hour car ride) to DC then how serious do you think they really are about changing their auto companies for $25bil?

One question I would like to hear Congress ask Rick Wagoner is "what are you going to do when this $25bil runs out and you need more money?" Not if but when.

BTW, Cerebrus (the private equity fund that owns Chrysler) sucked $250mil worth of profit out of Mervyn's in California before they shut down the company and threw 18,000 employees out a job. Read about it, todays WSJ page B1.

This was a refreshing comment by our next President.

"I was surprised that they did not have a better thought-out proposal when they arrived in Congress"..."Taxpayers can't be expected to pony up more money for an auto industry that has been resistant to change"

Barack Obama

Video link

 

[USAir757]

I didn't write this, but it was a response to a news site regarding the Big 3 testifying today on the hill:


Several years ago, my son's company was installing software at General Motors in Detroit and brought along a proprietary server, a box with a power cord and input/output ports much like phone jacks. When they were ready to install the server, one of his co-workers went out to bring it in, only to be stopped by security, which told him the union required it to go through receiving. Because they were doing the work after work hours, receiving was closed. At 8 a.m. the next day, the co-worker was waiting at receiving. The receiving people let him cool his heels for an hour and a half while they drank coffee and swapped sport stories before accepting the router. When the router finally got to the floor the next day, they discovered an electrician had to be scheduled to plug the power cord into the wall and to plug in two input/output cables. No one at GM could be bothered to inform them about these procedures in advance. The bottom line is that a 30-minute job, tops, took two days and cost GM thousands of dollars. But, the United Auto Workers union was ensuring those poor workers "earned a decent living."

How can it surprise anyone that U.S. automakers find it difficult to compete when the UAW practically mandates featherbedding? This triumph of attitude over substance finds little sympathy with people being asked to fund a bailout. Designing better cars or suck-ing in bailouts isn't going to solve the auto companies' problems.

 

[Cosworth]

Unions have out lived their usefulness, at least in their current form. Then again, so has management. They deserve each other.

 

[freedom]

personally i do not believe that story ... why ? because it doesn't sound logical .. it sounds made up , which most likely it is ... most human beings are rational and do not behave like that ... hell even the TSA doesn't behave like that ...


as to unions not being pertinent going forward i completely agree , so make sure that you never join one and i'll just stay in mine making more money than you and receiving more benefits out of life because of it ..

hey someone has to make the cheap #### i buy , better you than me