Has USAPA declared success

[signals]

I think it's over and I've won.

But deep inside I feel I've lost. I could have helped him. Did I push too hard? Was I too crass? Too much tough love?

So many doubts and so many questions.

Anyway, do I get anything for the win?

If history is any indication...It ain't over until it's over or just start another thread!

 

[Iclubbabyseals]

Download the supporting docs for the injunction.

And brew yourself a pot of coffee. You'll have hundreds of pages to read.

Yeah, so I read.

CLT has, on average, taxi times 36 seconds (.6 minutes) greater. Big whoop. Considering the on-going taxiway reconstruction and broken taxiways, I would think that pilots at CLT are taxiing too fast.

 

[Iclubbabyseals]

What are you going to do about if?

Slow down?

On my own, I just sit there and the delays pile up around me, catering screw-ups, topped off fueling, attempts to route me through areas of thunderstorms, asserting that smoke and fume events are just in our minds and otherwise just plain stupid management. On my own, I just do the job as described in the company manual and various and sundry materials. Amazing how just doing those jobs results in such delays. It seems the agents, dispatchers and ground people are behind those of us who are on-board. Recently I notice that I get plenty of gas, great cooperation from the agents all over and the ground people seem to bend over backwards to help, especially in PHX. I especially like the PHX ground crew that told us that if we did our checks right after push that we could effectively block two other gates who wanted to push. Well done, unnamed sirs.

I would really like for you to back up your mouth with quotes from USAPA describing how they have incited pilots. Your unproven allegations sound like a little kid trying to impress his school mates. and, not succeeding.

The fact that you just buy into management BS really shows the streak down your back. Were you a weiner?

 

[cleardirect]

On my own, I just sit there and the delays pile up around me, catering screw-ups, topped off fueling, attempts to route me through areas of thunderstorms, asserting that smoke and fume events are just in our minds and otherwise just plain stupid management. On my own, I just do the job as described in the company manual and various and sundry materials. Amazing how just doing those jobs results in such delays. It seems the agents, dispatchers and ground people are behind those of us who are on-board. Recently I notice that I get plenty of gas, great cooperation from the agents all over and the ground people seem to bend over backwards to help, especially in PHX. I especially like the PHX ground crew that told us that if we did our checks right after push that we could effectively block two other gates who wanted to push. Well done, unnamed sirs.

I would really like for you to back up your mouth with quotes from USAPA describing how they have incited pilots. Your unproven allegations sound like a little kid trying to impress his school mates. and, not succeeding.

The fact that you just buy into management BS really shows the streak down your back. Were you a weiner?

What you don't understand. We don't have to back up anything. It is the company that accused you east pilots and usapa of an illegal job action. We knew it, the company knew it. But they are the ones that are going to prove it. They have all the data they need to make their case. You can whine and tell stories all day long. In the end the only person that it matters to is the judge.

Speaking of that. This case is in NC, usapa's backyard. According to east pilots you should have home court advantage and this should be a no brainer for the east biased judges there in southern country. What happens if usapa losses? What possible cause could that be? You know usapa lost in NC federal district court the last time they are there right. Who will you blame when the NC judge issues a TRO telling you all to act right?

Now how many of you are going to court to watch? Are you all going to show up in court wearing your pretty bright yellow lanyards showing solidarity with Cleary? Come I hope you show that judge just who is in charge of that courtroom. Wear your uniform and yellow lanyards and impress the hell out of that judge.

BTW listen to the questions he asks and watch his demeanor. It should be telling. I hear laughing at opposing counsel in court helps your case. At least it did in PHX. Seham was pissed when the courtroom broke out at one of his comments. She ruled in our favor. Give that a try.

 

[SparrowHawk]

Keep in mind that "Knowing" and "Proving" are two entirely different things. Ask the OJ Jury.

 

[necigrad]

Are you saying pilots are responsible for baggage and customer complaints as well. That is a pretty big feet to pull off there.

Bags are easy, and I THINK complaints are as well. The bag numbers come from how many passengers arrive with their bags at their final destination. IF pilots are causing flights to be delayed, and IF those flights cause a passenger to just make their connection, but their bag doesn't, then yes, it's VERY possible. Complaints I believe are simply what customer complaints are received by the DOT. If customers complain about anything the pilots have control of (the alleged slow taxi, waiting for the last second to call MX causing a delay, etc.) then this could be attributed to pilots as well. Please note that I am making no accusations (thought I certainly have an opinion).

Did I pull off the big feat?

 

[Dog Wonder]

If the connecting flight leaves late, would that improve the chances of a bag making a connection?

In the whole picture it is a wash.

 

[necigrad]

If the connecting flight leaves late, would that improve the chances of a bag making a connection?

In the whole picture it is a wash.

Yes, but that question might be misrepresentative in many situations.. Again making the assumption that the allegations are true, if this was an East flight to East flight maybe. If it was East to West or one of the express carriers maybe not.

 

[BoeingBoy]

The bag numbers come from how many passengers arrive with their bags at their final destination.

Actually it how many people fill out a missing bag report. Don't ask me what the difference between the two numbers is, though.

Complaints I believe are simply what customer complaints are received by the DOT.

Correct for the total number of complaints, although the DOT forwards copies to the airline and the airline can get some dropped. For example, a passenger complains to the DOT about a US flight but it was actually an Express flight operated by Mesa. US would have that complaint shifted to Mesa. BTW, there is a breakdown of the complaints into a number of broad categories in each DOT report so you can tell what general area the complaint was about.

Jim

 

[NoYellowNeck]

Bags are easy, and I THINK complaints are as well. The bag numbers come from how many passengers arrive with their bags at their final destination. IF pilots are causing flights to be delayed, and IF those flights cause a passenger to just make their connection, but their bag doesn't, then yes, it's VERY possible. Complaints I believe are simply what customer complaints are received by the DOT. If customers complain about anything the pilots have control of (the alleged slow taxi, waiting for the last second to call MX causing a delay, etc.) then this could be attributed to pilots as well. Please note that I am making no accusations (thought I certainly have an opinion).

Did I pull off the big feat?

If any of you easties want to read this, I suggest you find an adult to help you.



B. US Airways Has Incurred Significant Costs From Increased Baggage and Passenger Misconnections Attributable to Pilot Caused Delays

50. Flight delays increase the probability that connecting passengers and their checked

luggage fail to make their connecting flight. When passengers or checked luggage fail

to make their connecting flights, US Airways can incur additional costs. Although

many passengers that miss their connections can be rebooked on a later flight the same

day with minimal direct costs to the Company,55 US Airways may need to provide

various forms of compensation for passengers with longer delays due to a missed

connection such as meal vouchers, additional frequent flyer miles or flight vouchers to

be used on a future flight. Likewise, US Airways may need to incur the costs of hotel

accommodations and ground transportation for passengers who miss the last

connecting flight of the day to their final destination due to a flight delay. Finally, in

some instances, US Airways may need to pay the costs of re-accommodating

passengers who have missed their connections on another airline.



52. US Airways estimates that the costs associated with each mishandled piece of checked

luggage is approximately $50.59 Based on the estimated increase in the rate of

Charlotte mishandled bags attributable to pilot actions of 5.2 per thousand connecting

passengers and an average daily number of Charlotte connecting passengers of 37,863,

I estimate that pilot actions have added approximately $10,000 per day to US Airways

costs solely as a result of mishandled bags. Thus, since May1, East pilot actions have

led to over 17,000 misconnected bags, imposing more than $856,000 in incremental

mishandled baggage costs on the Company.

 

[SparrowHawk]

I'm waiting for the Judge to rule. You posted one side of the story. There is another side and that's why Judges have jobs. The Judge will sort through all of the legal posturing and shortly we will have a ruling that is like subject to appeal. I would not be surprised if ruled in favor of USAPA. I also wouldn't be surprised if USAPA got it's arm ripped off and beaten with the bloody end of it either.

 

[NoYellowNeck]

What if you were a betting man?

 

[SparrowHawk]

What if you were a betting man?

I haven't seen the USAPA response to even lay odds accurately.

That said, have pilots used tactics like this before in other unions? YES

Has it worked out well for them? NO

On the safety side, neither side in the past has done a squeaky clean job when it comes to mtc. old US had several tragedies and HP nearly got grounded, So neither side IMO can really claim the moral high ground.

US/HP Labor relations have been poor for far more years than most other carriers. Both former companies have a reputation for bludgeoning their workers

. Is there some kind of shenanigans going on? Yes I think so. Is US trying to break USAPA? Yes I think so!

Given that back drop I don't think you can accurately predict. I will say this. If the Judge thinks one of the parties us trying to con him they are in a world of hurt and both US and USAPA have a hisve history of bending the truth. I don't see a clear picture except for USAPA suggesting moving the hearing to New York where the other case is being heard, it makes me wonder if they're judge shopping?

 

[NoYellowNeck]

Ugh, BORING!

Quit walking the fence and commit.

This could make or break our relationship.

 

[necigrad]

I would not be surprised if ruled in favor of USAPA. I also wouldn't be surprised if USAPA got it's arm ripped off and beaten with the bloody end of it either.

Sadly. this is probably the most realistic post I've seen around here in a while. When it comes to the Courts and both sides insist they're right, SOMEONE is wrong.