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Is this the change you voted for? They are so inexperienced over at the WH, they don't know what they are doing. The polls are dropping FAST.
 
novaqt said:
Aint it grand? POTUS now wants to bill our valiant servicemen who are injured in the line of duty. They will have to get private insurance. What a slap in the face and how stupid of the WH advisors who are coming up with these ideas, especially on top of the AIG bailout and Exec bonus scandal.
Click to expand...


Show me in the proposal where it says any of that. I dare you.
 
NewHampshire Black Bears said:
The ONLY poll dropping FASTER than the one at the WH(that YOU SAY are dropping), is the poll numbers of the DECIMATED GOP ! :shock:
Click to expand...

PRINCETON, NJ -- Both the Republicans and the Democrats in Congress are more popular now than they were last December. While still quite low at 36%, the approval rating for Republicans is up significantly from December. There has been a similar increase in the rating of Democrats over this time.
Click to expand...

Info
 
NewHampshire Black Bears said:
Hey fixer, Good to "see" you.

I couldn't get the original link to work, but under "the Hill's" home page, the article was there under the caption......."GOP worries as allies stray on healthcare" (or words VERY VERY close to that affect)

Maybe someone way more PC knowlegeable than myself can "link it up"
Click to expand...

Bears:

No one is talking about whatever article you are refering to. Either here or on the news. One of the top stories on the NBC Nightly News last night was the issue regarding veternas health care. The gods honest truth is that the President made a serious blunder and burned up a lot of political capital doing it. All over something that was DOA and should have never seen the light of day in the first place. And guess what, the GOP has nothing to do with it.
 
Garfield1966 said:
Show me in the proposal where it says any of that. I dare you.
Click to expand...
Next time do your own research!


"Plan to bill veterans’ insurance for treatment draws fire
MCT News Service

Tuesday, March 17, 2009

WASHINGTON — The Obama administration is considering making veterans use private insurance to pay for treatment of combat and service-related injuries.

The plan would be an about-face on what veterans believe is a longstanding pledge by the government to pay for health care costs that result from their military service.

NATION/WORLD
• More Nation/World News
• Nation/World Photo Galleries
But in a White House meeting Monday, veterans groups apparently failed to persuade President Barack Obama to take the plan off the table.

“It’s a betrayal,â€￾ said Joe Violante, legislative director of Disabled American Veterans, which signed a letter of protest to Obama. “My insurance company didn’t send me to Vietnam, my government did. The same holds true for men and women now fighting in Iraq and Afghanistan. It’s the government’s responsibility.â€￾

“Veterans of all generations agree that this proposal is bad for the country and bad for veterans,â€￾ said Paul Rieckhoff, executive director of Iraq and Afghanistan Veterans of America. “If the president and the OMB (Office of Management and Budget) want to cut costs, they can start at AIG, not the VA.â€￾

“It became apparent during our discussion today that the president intends to move forward with this unreasonable plan,â€￾ said Commander David K. Rehbein of The American Legion. “He says he is looking to generate $540 million by this method, but refused to hear arguments about the moral and government-avowed obligations that would be compromised by it.â€￾

The proposed requirement for these companies to reimburse the VA would not only be unfair, says the Legion, but would have an adverse impact on service-connected disabled veterans and their families. The Legion argues that, depending on the severity of the medical conditions involved, maximum insurance coverage limits could be reached through treatment of the veteran’s condition alone. That would leave the rest of the family without health care benefits. The Legion also points out that many health insurance companies require deductibles to be paid before any benefits are covered.

Under current policy, veterans are responsible for health care costs that are unrelated to their military service. Exceptions in some cases can be made for veterans without private insurance or who are 100 percent disabled.

The president spoke Monday at the Department of Veterans Affairs to commemorate its 20th anniversary and said he hopes to increase funding by $25 billion over the next five years. But he said nothing about the plan to bill private insurers for service-related medical care.

Few details about the plan have been available and a VA spokesman did not provide additional information. But the reaction on Capitol Hill to the idea has been swift and harsh.

“Dead on arrivalâ€￾ is how Democratic Sen. Patty Murray of Washington described the idea. â€￾ … when our troops are injured while serving our country, we should take care of those injuries completely,â€￾ Murray, a member of the Senate Veterans’ Affairs Committee, told a hearing last week.

“I don’t think we should nickel and dime them for their care.â€￾

In separate comments, Republican Sen. Kit Bond of Missouri said the nation “owes a debt to the veterans who fought and paid for our freedom.â€￾

Secretary of Veterans Affairs Eric Shinseki said at the hearing where Murray spoke that the plan was “a consideration.â€￾ He also acknowledged that the VA’s proposed budget for next year included it as a way to increase revenue.

But Shinseki told the Senate Veterans’ Affairs Committee that “a final decision hasn’t been made yet.â€￾

For veterans, that was little comfort.

“When a man goes and defends his country and gets injured and then they want your insurance to pay, that’s wrong,â€￾ said David Gerke, a 60-year-old Vietnam veteran and retired postal worker from Kansas City. “When we went into the service, we were told our medical needs…would be taken care of for the rest of our lives.â€￾

Veterans claim that the costs of treating expensive war injuries could raise their insurance costs, as well as those for their employers. Some worried that it also could make it more difficult for disabled veterans to find work.

Several veterans groups had written Obama last month complaining about the new plan.

“There is simply no logical explanation for billing a veteran’s personal insurance for care that the VA has a responsibility to provide,â€￾ the heads of several veterans groups said in their letter to Obama.

Despite the current economic crisis, they wrote that “placing the burden of those fiscal problems on the men and women who have already sacrificed a great deal for this country is unconscionable.â€￾

A spokesperson for America’s Health Insurance Plans, a trade association, said Monday that it would evaluate any proposal that the administration puts forth. But “we don’t have a position on it at this time,â€￾ Robert Zirkelbach said.

Many veterans had high expectations for Obama after years of battling the Bush administration over benefit cuts and medical concerns such as post-traumatic stress disorder.

But the VA’s decision to float a potential change in its policy of paying for service-related injuries could signal a quick end to the honeymoon.

Gerke was a 20-year-old petty officer in the Navy during the Vietnam War. He helped load Sidewinder missiles and 500-pound bombs onto F-18s.

He came home with a bad back and post-traumatic stress disorder, among other injuries. But the government honored its pledge and has paid for his health care. Now he’s worried, especially for the injured service members returning from Iraq and Afghanistan.

“Let’s face it, (the VA) needs the money,â€￾ Gerke said. “But why should disabled vets be paying that price?â€￾"
 
novaqt said:
Next time do your own research!


"Plan to bill veterans’ insurance for treatment draws fire
MCT News Service

Tuesday, March 17, 2009

WASHINGTON — The Obama administration is considering making veterans use private insurance to pay for treatment of combat and service-related injuries.

The plan would be an about-face on what veterans believe is a longstanding pledge by the government to pay for health care costs that result from their military service.

NATION/WORLD
• More Nation/World News
• Nation/World Photo Galleries
But in a White House meeting Monday, veterans groups apparently failed to persuade President Barack Obama to take the plan off the table.

“It’s a betrayal,â€￾ said Joe Violante, legislative director of Disabled American Veterans, which signed a letter of protest to Obama. “My insurance company didn’t send me to Vietnam, my government did. The same holds true for men and women now fighting in Iraq and Afghanistan. It’s the government’s responsibility.â€￾

“Veterans of all generations agree that this proposal is bad for the country and bad for veterans,â€￾ said Paul Rieckhoff, executive director of Iraq and Afghanistan Veterans of America. “If the president and the OMB (Office of Management and Budget) want to cut costs, they can start at AIG, not the VA.â€￾

“It became apparent during our discussion today that the president intends to move forward with this unreasonable plan,â€￾ said Commander David K. Rehbein of The American Legion. “He says he is looking to generate $540 million by this method, but refused to hear arguments about the moral and government-avowed obligations that would be compromised by it.â€￾

The proposed requirement for these companies to reimburse the VA would not only be unfair, says the Legion, but would have an adverse impact on service-connected disabled veterans and their families. The Legion argues that, depending on the severity of the medical conditions involved, maximum insurance coverage limits could be reached through treatment of the veteran’s condition alone. That would leave the rest of the family without health care benefits. The Legion also points out that many health insurance companies require deductibles to be paid before any benefits are covered.

Under current policy, veterans are responsible for health care costs that are unrelated to their military service. Exceptions in some cases can be made for veterans without private insurance or who are 100 percent disabled.

The president spoke Monday at the Department of Veterans Affairs to commemorate its 20th anniversary and said he hopes to increase funding by $25 billion over the next five years. But he said nothing about the plan to bill private insurers for service-related medical care.

Few details about the plan have been available and a VA spokesman did not provide additional information. But the reaction on Capitol Hill to the idea has been swift and harsh.

“Dead on arrivalâ€￾ is how Democratic Sen. Patty Murray of Washington described the idea. â€￾ … when our troops are injured while serving our country, we should take care of those injuries completely,â€￾ Murray, a member of the Senate Veterans’ Affairs Committee, told a hearing last week.

“I don’t think we should nickel and dime them for their care.â€￾

In separate comments, Republican Sen. Kit Bond of Missouri said the nation “owes a debt to the veterans who fought and paid for our freedom.â€￾

Secretary of Veterans Affairs Eric Shinseki said at the hearing where Murray spoke that the plan was “a consideration.â€￾ He also acknowledged that the VA’s proposed budget for next year included it as a way to increase revenue.

But Shinseki told the Senate Veterans’ Affairs Committee that “a final decision hasn’t been made yet.â€￾

For veterans, that was little comfort.

“When a man goes and defends his country and gets injured and then they want your insurance to pay, that’s wrong,â€￾ said David Gerke, a 60-year-old Vietnam veteran and retired postal worker from Kansas City. “When we went into the service, we were told our medical needs…would be taken care of for the rest of our lives.â€￾

Veterans claim that the costs of treating expensive war injuries could raise their insurance costs, as well as those for their employers. Some worried that it also could make it more difficult for disabled veterans to find work.

Several veterans groups had written Obama last month complaining about the new plan.

“There is simply no logical explanation for billing a veteran’s personal insurance for care that the VA has a responsibility to provide,â€￾ the heads of several veterans groups said in their letter to Obama.

Despite the current economic crisis, they wrote that “placing the burden of those fiscal problems on the men and women who have already sacrificed a great deal for this country is unconscionable.â€￾

A spokesperson for America’s Health Insurance Plans, a trade association, said Monday that it would evaluate any proposal that the administration puts forth. But “we don’t have a position on it at this time,â€￾ Robert Zirkelbach said.

Many veterans had high expectations for Obama after years of battling the Bush administration over benefit cuts and medical concerns such as post-traumatic stress disorder.

But the VA’s decision to float a potential change in its policy of paying for service-related injuries could signal a quick end to the honeymoon.

Gerke was a 20-year-old petty officer in the Navy during the Vietnam War. He helped load Sidewinder missiles and 500-pound bombs onto F-18s.

He came home with a bad back and post-traumatic stress disorder, among other injuries. But the government honored its pledge and has paid for his health care. Now he’s worried, especially for the injured service members returning from Iraq and Afghanistan.

“Let’s face it, (the VA) needs the money,â€￾ Gerke said. “But why should disabled vets be paying that price?â€￾"
Click to expand...

I hate spoon feeding too Novaqt.
 
novaqt said:
Aint it grand? POTUS now wants to bill our valiant servicemen who are injured in the line of duty. They will have to get private insurance. What a slap in the face and how stupid of the WH advisors who are coming up with these ideas, especially on top of the AIG bailout and Exec bonus scandal.
Click to expand...


This is what you wrote. When I read the proposal, I did not see anywhere that it required a vet to have their own insurance. What I read was that IF they vet had insurance, THEN the private insurance would be used for any injury not related to the vets service. IF the vet did not have privste insurance THEN the VA would pick up the tab.

If I read that wrong fine, please point it out to me. So far I have not seen anything that indicates 1. service men will be billed, 2. anything to do with service related injuries or 3. a requirement to get private insurance.

So until you can show me in the proposal where I am wrong, you can take your spoon and research and stick it where the sun don't shine. I don't what to see your RNC talking points or anybodies opinion about what they think is in the proposal, show me in the proposal where it says any of the crap that you think is in there.

While we are at it. Why should the tax payer have to foot the bill for illnesses not related to the vets service? I see no reason why a vets private insurance should not take care of his/her in grown toe nail or lung cancer for smoking 2 packs a day. Republicans are supposed to be big on personal responsibility and small government ... well? Vets gets shot in combat ... that's VA, looses a limb to a IED .. VA, lays down a motor bike on the I10 ... Kaiser Permenente...
 
novaqt said:
Next time do your own research!


"Plan to bill veterans’ insurance for treatment draws fire
MCT News Service

Tuesday, March 17, 2009

Gerke was a 20-year-old petty officer in the Navy during the Vietnam War. He helped load Sidewinder missiles and 500-pound bombs onto F-18s.

He came home with a bad back and post-traumatic stress disorder, among other injuries. But the government honored its pledge and has paid for his health care. Now he’s worried, especially for the injured service members returning from Iraq and Afghanistan.

“Let’s face it, (the VA) needs the money,â€￾ Gerke said. “But why should disabled vets be paying that price?â€￾"
Click to expand...

Not to be nit picky but the F-18 did not enter service until the 1980's. Also I wonder how an AO managed to get PTSD loading ordanance on an aircraft carrier. Being on the flight deck can be a bit stressful but I never heard of anyone getting PTSD over it.
 
Garfield1966 said:
This is what you wrote. When I read the proposal, I did not see anywhere that it required a vet to have their own insurance. What I read was that IF they vet had insurance, THEN the private insurance would be used for any injury not related to the vets service. IF the vet did not have privste insurance THEN the VA would pick up the tab.

If I read that wrong fine, please point it out to me. So far I have not seen anything that indicates 1. service men will be billed, 2. anything to do with service related injuries or 3. a requirement to get private insurance.

So until you can show me in the proposal where I am wrong, you can take your spoon and research and stick it where the sun don't shine. I don't what to see your RNC talking points or anybodies opinion about what they think is in the proposal, show me in the proposal where it says any of the crap that you think is in there.

While we are at it. Why should the tax payer have to foot the bill for illnesses not related to the vets service? I see no reason why a vets private insurance should not take care of his/her in grown toe nail or lung cancer for smoking 2 packs a day. Republicans are supposed to be big on personal responsibility and small government ... well? Vets gets shot in combat ... that's VA, looses a limb to a IED .. VA, lays down a motor bike on the I10 ... Kaiser Permenente...
Click to expand...

The whole thing was a ruse anyways. It was just another way for Obama to back door his gov health care agenda.
 
dapoes said:
The whole thing was a ruse anyways. It was just another way for Obama to back door his gov health care agenda.
Click to expand...


There are not that many vets as to overwhelm the health care system so please share with us how this is too happen.

I sure hope you are pretty.
 
Garfield1966 said:
There are not that many vets as to overwhelm the health care system so please share with us how this is too happen.

I sure hope you are pretty.
Click to expand...

Its not that its that many but their care is very specialized and quite costly.
 
Anyone have any studies that compare vet med costs to civilian?

Also, as far as I understand that proposal was only to cover non-service related injuries which would be comparable to the rest of society. Any service related injuries would still be covered under the VA plan as it always has.
 
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