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Merger with LCC in the spring

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And just what is the threshold percentage for fragmentation in that UA pilot contract?

Jim

Several limitations. One of the limits is a transfer of aircraft or route authority that contributes to 20% or more of company block hours, revenue OR ASM's.

So for mrmunn to say that there is no chance of employee transfer is false.

I do enjoy reading the US contribution to the ALPA contracts. Allegheny/Mohawk provisions are often mentioned. What happened on the way to the merger with AWA? Thought you guys wrote the rules?
 
I do enjoy reading the US contribution to the ALPA contracts. Allegheny/Mohawk provisions are often mentioned. What happened on the way to the merger with AWA? Thought you guys wrote the rules?
Keep in mind that I'm probably in the minority when it comes to "East" US pilots.....

US pilots, courtesy of 2 BK's and the widespread sentiments of "I'm too old to start over" and "I can't do anything else and make that much", willingly accepted every concession asked of them (except the pension, which the MEC agreed to give up without a vote). Hence we (me before I retired) went from one of the best contracts (partly courtesy of UA and DL pilots thanks to "parity + 1%) to one of if not the worst. (And for the record, I voted "No" on every contract change since the early 90's including "parity + 1%)

As far as the A-M LPP's and the merger integration "turmoil" going on, looks to me like that went pretty much exactly as spelled out back then by the CAB - negotiation, followed by binding arbitration when agreement couldn't be reached. I personally find it amusing that a number of "East" US pilots can laud the recent law codifying the A-M language and lambast ALPA's merger policy, when the two provide the same identical process. (Also for the record, I think the US/HP combined list is basically fair - I'd quibble with two items but not the combined list as a whole)

In both cases, there's plenty of "It's everyone's fault by mine" rhetoric (mainly ALPA's fault it seems) going around on the "East" US side.

Jim
 
Too bad MrMan is not familiar with fragmentation clauses in contracts. Of course I would not suspect contractual language is his strong point. If SWA was to buy UAL assets the conversions to SWA standards would require too much cost. They would have to remove the dual FMC's, ACARS printers, install rifle racks and tobacco spittoons to bring them up (down) to SWA specifics.

Why would SWA buy anything from UA? I thought they were taking over the world, one trailer park at a time. Think they want the 777's for the hourly widebody service from Amarillo to Lubbock?

This post is solid evidence that small-minded airline employees like you and Tilton/Brace will certainly depart the industry under forced conditions.

Enjoy the ride! You will remain fastened to your seat until the ride comes to a complete stop.
 
NHBB I agree with you but it won't just be AA. The Dallas boys AA & WN both have checkbooks waiting to buy pieces. Both want assets planes/routes/gates but not people


I got a good chuckle out of that one.

The execs at AMR are no doubt in their war room right now trying to figure out how they're going to compete if DL and NW, and then UA and CO hook up. American is going to be at an extreme disAAdvantage with the business flyer.

Southwest? Yeah, right.
 
I got a good chuckle out of that one.

The execs at AMR are no doubt in their war room right now trying to figure out how they're going to compete if DL and NW, and then UA and CO hook up. American is going to be at an extreme disAAdvantage with the business flyer.

Southwest? Yeah, right.


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Well I've got a "chuckle for the chuckle" !!!

IF ANYONE assumes that American Airlines..."Misses the BUS", when the action starts....knows NOTHING about this company !!

AA did "miss the bus" in the early 80's when they "blinked" at the PAA Asian routes, now very successfully being run by UAL !!!

IF ANYONE think's that..that blunder will re-occur...is FOOLING themselves....BIG TIME !!


STAY TUNED, ...Cause it's going to get REAL Interesting ...real soon !!!!
 
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Well I've got a "chuckle for the chuckle" !!!

IF ANYONE assumes that American Airlines..."Misses the BUS", when the action starts....knows NOTHING about this company !!

AA did "miss the bus" in the early 80's when they "blinked" at the PAA Asian routes, now very successfully being run by UAL !!!

IF ANYONE think's that..that blunder will re-occur...is FOOLING themselves....BIG TIME !!


STAY TUNED, ...Cause it's going to get REAL Interesting ...real soon !!!!


We could very well see a bidding war....I'm making money holding CO.

You're right, though, it is going to get very interesting, very soon. In my mind, the stars have aligned: The fed has added a bunch of liquidity to the market, so lenders are able to do deals again, the airlines are relatively cheap, oil doesn't seem to want to go down, and there's an administration that has stated it won't stand in the way of mergers.
 
I got a good chuckle out of that one.

The execs at AMR are no doubt in their war room right now trying to figure out how they're going to compete if DL and NW, and then UA and CO hook up. American is going to be at an extreme disAAdvantage with the business flyer.

Southwest? Yeah, right.


http://www.ft.com/cms/s/2/d5727ad0-cf6e-11...00779fd2ac.html


American Airlines, the world’s largest airline by total passengers transported, could be a threat to a Delta deal, particularly if it tied-up with Northwest, the banker said. Having taken a hard look at Northwest “years agoâ€￾, the banker speculated that American could attempt to bust the deal by making a competing offer if and when the deal is announced. Further, a second industry banker said Northwest did not agree to the merger with American in 2000 as the offer did not reflect the full market premium to Northwest’s share price at that time.

Moreover, the first banker noted that American has more practical experience with mergers than any other airline, which could make the top carrier “more courageousâ€￾ under the right circumstances.

American is likely thinking ahead on the probable tie-ups, the banker suggested. If United merges with Delta or Continental, American will be faced with a “very, very serious problem;â€￾ namely that its hegemony with the business traveler will be threatened, the banker said. He added that a United and Continental tie up would put American in hot water, not just because the aggregate market share of the combined entity would be bigger, but because the new entity would be an enterprise that would practically have a hub in the major population centers around the perimeter of the US. This, he said, would be a very effective kind of competitor for American.
 
This post is solid evidence that small-minded airline employees like you and Tilton/Brace will certainly depart the industry under forced conditions.

Enjoy the ride! You will remain fastened to your seat until the ride comes to a complete stop.

Your right. I did forget one. The tailhooks to keep the airplanes on the runway after landing. Saw SWA could not reign another one in up in GEG this week. Maybe LBB turns is best for the boys from hicksville.
 
http://www.ft.com/cms/s/2/d5727ad0-cf6e-11...00779fd2ac.html


American Airlines, the world’s largest airline by total passengers transported, could be a threat to a Delta deal, particularly if it tied-up with Northwest, the banker said. Having taken a hard look at Northwest “years agoâ€￾, the banker speculated that American could attempt to bust the deal by making a competing offer if and when the deal is announced. Further, a second industry banker said Northwest did not agree to the merger with American in 2000 as the offer did not reflect the full market premium to Northwest’s share price at that time.

Moreover, the first banker noted that American has more practical experience with mergers than any other airline, which could make the top carrier “more courageousâ€￾ under the right circumstances.

American is likely thinking ahead on the probable tie-ups, the banker suggested. If United merges with Delta or Continental, American will be faced with a “very, very serious problem;â€￾ namely that its hegemony with the business traveler will be threatened, the banker said. He added that a United and Continental tie up would put American in hot water, not just because the aggregate market share of the combined entity would be bigger, but because the new entity would be an enterprise that would practically have a hub in the major population centers around the perimeter of the US. This, he said, would be a very effective kind of competitor for American.


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Mikey,

Between "this", and the fact(reported today) that DL is NOW talking to CO, makes this "murder/mystery" even all the more "Interesting"

IMHO, the DL/CO news, is the LAST thing that "Merger Maniac" Glenn Tilton ever wanted to hear !!!
 
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Mikey,

Between "this", and the fact(reported today) that DL is NOW talking to CO, makes this "murder/mystery" even all the more "Interesting"

IMHO, the DL/CO news, is the LAST thing that "Merger Maniac" Glenn Tilton ever wanted to hear !!!


Why would DL and CO merge? There are some serious negatives to the DL/CO rumor.

1. Both airlines have large NYC hubs. Besides the obvious of having two hubs so close together, I bet anti-trust issues would not pass muster.

2. CVG/CLE- redundant to an unusual degree.

3. IAH and ATL are also very close to serving the same areas and still does not give the companies a west coast presence.

4. While Air Mic has Guam it still does not have the route authority to serve nonstop US to China, NRT hub and some other huge benefits that both NWA and UAL offer.

Finally why is it that you think Tilton is bad guy, yet Anderson is soiling himself trying to merge. Also, do you really think that Tilton might have only learned of a "rumor" of DAL and CAL from the newspaper? Also, why no theories of NWA being broken up? Hasn't Steenland already admitted he was interested in merging also? While I am not huge fan of Tilton's I do think he is a shrewd business man when it comes to getting the dollar for his deal. And that is exactly what a merger would be for him, a big pay day.

If you want to spin these facts go ahead. It is very easy to do and ALL of us are on the outside looking in. However, it appears DAL is getting desperate as NO ONE wants to marry them. Maybe they can rekindle their love with a Doug Parker combo?
 
However, it appears DAL is getting desperate as NO ONE wants to marry them. Maybe they can rekindle their love with a Doug Parker combo?


I think it is just the opposite. Who knows what carriers are truly talking and what is being said? As it has been speculated elsewhere, AA may try to keep a proposed DL/NW merge from happening. If that is the case it would appear to make sense to keep a great deal of speculation in place in regards to your true intentions. I would also add that there is a real possibility that after all is said and done, nothing may happen. DL and the others may find that the cost of marrying far exceeds the benefits or likelyhood the merge would even be allowed to proceed.
In addition, it was obvious that there never was any "love" between Parker and DL.
As far as fragmentation goes, I wouldn't let others here get to you. If you research a little history on the DL boards during the hostile takeover attempt, you will find many of the same posters making the same baseless theories. Wishful thinking really isn't a logical basis for theory.
 
I’ve gotten a very strong rumor from a very well connected person inside the sandcastle that united is going to try and acquire us …


United , no offence but you can kiss our asses … keep your nose out of our business unless you come to the table in a merger , cause if you try and take us apart and screw the workers , well i can only guess at what the workers will do to the planes and equipment .... that is what I’ve been told to pass along to you .
 
I’ve gotten a very strong rumor from a very well connected person inside the sandcastle that united is going to try and acquire us …


United , no offence but you can kiss our asses … keep your nose out of our business unless you come to the table in a merger , cause if you try and take us apart and screw the workers , well i can only guess at what the workers will do to the planes and equipment .... that is what I’ve been told to pass along to you .

You are quite comical. :lol:

What do you propose to do? :blink:

Weld em Shut.... :up: :up:
And watch your job go away?
You must be confused... :shock:

B) UT
 
to be honest i am confused , i have no idea what would happen to us in a acqusion ... but i'd bet alot of money the PHL guys wouldn't just sit and do nothing... i for one wouldn't want to end up under their TED division.
 
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