National Unemployment BOLTS to 8.1% !

[Garfield1966]

'UAL_TECH'

The answer to your question is BOTH.
I fully realize that the "issue" is a VERY TOUGH emotional issue...'Tech",...I really do.

I also realize that it's NOT a LEGAL issue, it's the "law of the land", and I DOUBT SERIOUSLY that you or I will never live long enough to see the current Law reversed !

Bottom line................religion and politics DON'T MIX !!

McCAIN was Pro -Choice(before he was Pro-Life during the campaign). It's a good bet , that he's Pro-Choice now that the election is over.(You know, kinda like a John Kerry...."I was FOR it, before I was against it" thing")

I do not believe that murder has anything to do with religion. That supposition assumes that with out religion there can be no morality. I adhere to no religion and have a moral compass. I do not believe in murder for the simple reason that I have no desire to be murdered and I assume that others also prefer to live. I do not steal because I assume that others do not wish to be robbed either. The golden rule is quite simple. Do onto others as you would have them do onto you. It's simple self preservation. This concept has been around long before religion came onto the scene.

Murder is a moral and legal issue. Society as a whole decides what constitutes murder and how it should be punished. The biggest factor seems to be intent. Just because someone dies, at the hands of another does not make it murder. Self defense, euthanasia, abortion, accidental homicide and I am sure there are others. If you can convince a jury of your peers that you did not intend to murder someone or that the 'murder' was justified, then all of a sudden, it's no murder.

Bear, I think abortion is very much a legal issue in that the law must recognize that a woman must have sole discretion over her body and anything residing with in her. While I do not agree with abortion and believe it is being used as a form of birth control, I do not see any justification in taking that control away from a woman. I sure as hell know I have no interest in anyone telling me hat I may or may not do with my body (that golden rule thing again).

 

[NewHampshire Black Bears]

I do not believe that murder has anything to do with religion. That supposition assumes that with out religion there can be no morality. I adhere to no religion and have a moral compass. I do not believe in murder for the simple reason that I have no desire to be murdered and I assume that others also prefer to live. I do not steal because I assume that others do not wish to be robbed either. The golden rule is quite simple. Do onto others as you would have them do onto you. It's simple self preservation. This concept has been around long before religion came onto the scene.

Murder is a moral and legal issue. Society as a whole decides what constitutes murder and how it should be punished. The biggest factor seems to be intent. Just because someone dies, at the hands of another does not make it murder. Self defense, euthanasia, abortion, accidental homicide and I am sure there are others. If you can convince a jury of your peers that you did not intend to murder someone or that the 'murder' was justified, then all of a sudden, it's no murder.

Bear, I think abortion is very much a legal issue in that the law must recognize that a woman must have sole discretion over her body and anything residing with in her. While I do not agree with abortion and believe it is being used as a form of birth control, I do not see any justification in taking that control away from a woman. I sure as hell know I have no interest in anyone telling me hat I may or may not do with my body (that golden rule thing again).

VERY good definition Garfield.
And what please's me MOST about your great response(Golden Rule) is EXACTLY how the VAST majority of Native American's lived(before the White Man, and his "Book"...SCREWED things up)


UAL-TECH,
See Garfields post above, because it "echo's" my sentiments about this tough subject.



Hadenough,

By all means, you and others who share your belief(s) SHOULD try to pass Laws to "Change things"
May I remind you that 50%+ of the country does not want Roe v. Wade reversed !
May I remind you that Sandara Day O'Conner/Supreme court Justice.....A REPUBLICAN, cast the tie-breaking vote that enables Roe v. Wade to STAND as it does now.


Southwind,

In your little "skit" that you put before me,........I'm assuming that the Job you described for your two individuals, is a UNION job ?
If so,..Both people had to agree to join the union, therefore, if one has a "change of heart"....so be it(DON'T let the DOOR, hit you in the arse, on your way OUT) !!!!!!

 

[eolesen]

May I remind you that 50%+ of the country does not want Roe v. Wade reversed !

It's probably higher than that, Bears. But that won't stop Barry and Nancy from trying. Harry's probably got an ethical problem -- how does a Mormon support abortion?...

In your little "skit" that you put before me,........I'm assuming that the Job you described for your two individuals, is a UNION job ?
If so,..Both people had to agree to join the union, therefore, if one has a "change of heart"....so be it(DON'T let the DOOR, hit you in the arse, on your way OUT) !!!!!!

Au contrare, mon frere...

Few of you in the industry voted to join the union -- you were simply told there was no choice because it's closed shop under the RLA.

It's sort of like buying a house with a HOA -- you like the house, and decide you can tolerate the antics and dues from the HOA. Then you get into the neighborhood, and realize what a pain in the arse they are, and you can't withhold your dues, lest they foreclose on your house (which HOA's have the right to do in many states).


Bears, the stimulus jobs... I saw the video of the police cadets in Ohio whose jobs were "saved" by stimulus pork, but the footnote to that is they're only saved thru the end of the year. After that, the city employing them is in the same position they were before --- tax revenues are down, and they're likely to be laid off in the next budget cuts.

Same thing is going to happen with the construction workers in Maryland. The stimulus cash delays the inevitable, and simply raises the tax burden ---- we pay for them to be working now, and we'll pay their unemployment later.

 

[NewHampshire Black Bears]

It's probably higher than that, Bears. But that won't stop Barry and Nancy from trying. Harry's probably got an ethical problem -- how does a Mormon support abortion?...



Au contrare, mon frere...

Few of you in the industry voted to join the union -- you were simply told there was no choice because it's closed shop under the RLA.

It's sort of like buying a house with a HOA -- you like the house, and decide you can tolerate the antics and dues from the HOA. Then you get into the neighborhood, and realize what a pain in the arse they are, and you can't withhold your dues, lest they foreclose on your house (which HOA's have the right to do in many states).


Bears, the stimulus jobs... I saw the video of the police cadets in Ohio whose jobs were "saved" by stimulus pork, but the footnote to that is they're only saved thru the end of the year. After that, the city employing them is in the same position they were before --- tax revenues are down, and they're likely to be laid off in the next budget cuts.

Same thing is going to happen with the construction workers in Maryland. The stimulus cash delays the inevitable, and simply raises the tax burden ---- we pay for them to be working now, and we'll pay their unemployment later.

E,
Your confusing me w/the "Barry and Nancy" comment. They're happy that RvW stands as it is today.

When I said 50+% of American's don't want RvW reversed, that means that they are satisfied of the current status.

With your Boy..W in charge of the whole "shooting match"(meaning CONTROL of POTUS/House/Senate from 2000-2006, WHY was'nt legislation introduced to Overturn RvW ?
(Maybe it was that "your side" had guys like McSame who was pro-choice !)
(Yes I know he "was FOR it, before he was AGAINST it")(for election purposes)

As for the Unions,.........I "ran" across the(common) hallway that we shared w/AA in BOS,........(I was STUCK at PI at the time)(You remember that CULT airline PI...GOD/Piedmont/Family..in THAT Order)...........to join AA. I left those rednecks, making $13.00 p/hr at the time, to go to AA for.."$5.77 p/hr", and NO bennies for a year in 86'. It was the "BEST move" that I EVER made in my life !!!!!
(as evident from my current "man of leisure/Retiree" status)


To the Maryland construction workers being recalled via "stim", I say,....that while "stim" has them "initially" back to work,..........to hear YOU tell it, it sounds like YOU are saying that by (say) late 2010/2011, that the GWB economy will still be "in the tank" !!!!!!!!! HEL*, YOU must have one FABULOUS crystal ball(NOT !!!)


Limbaugh/Hannity...2012 (I give Daily THANX to the CREATOR above, that every day,...those two CHAMPIONS of the Republican party....DO what they Do BEST. I wish them Looooong healthy Lives, because "our side" can't get ENOUGH of the PRO Democratic effect that they have on the USA

 

[Garfield1966]

Harry's probably got an ethical problem -- how does a Mormon support abortion?...

Probably the same way all the good christians here in TX go to strip clubs. I read some where that TX has one of the highest ratios of strip clubs / porn joints in the nation. People may belong to a certain faith but they do not necessarily believe in all the tenants of that faith. If you believe all the poll which say up wards of 90% of the population claim to a member of some faith yet more than 50% believe in the right to abortion. Some folks do not just blindly follow the religious teachings.

 

[NewHampshire Black Bears]

Probably the same way all the good christians here in TX go to strip clubs. I read some where that TX has one of the highest ratios of strip clubs / porn joints in the nation. People may belong to a certain faith but they do not necessarily believe in all the tenants of that faith. If you believe all the poll which say up wards of 90% of the population claim to a member of some faith yet more than 50% believe in the right to abortion. Some folks do not just blindly follow the religious teachings.

Garfield,

ANOTHER very good post/info !

Here's another.

Though I can't relocate the link yet, (but It's true, I did read it, and I'm not making this stuff up), it was reported from the Porn industry assoc. that of the top ten(state) subscribers of internet Porn, 8 of the 10 were Red states, led by UTAH, and W. Virginia as # 1 + 2.
(Forbidden Fruit anyone or Just Plain Hypocrits) ??

 

[Garfield1966]

Garfield,

ANOTHER very good post/info !

Here's another.

Though I can't relocate the link yet, (but It's true, I did read it, and I'm not making this stuff up), it was reported from the Porn industry assoc. that of the top ten(state) subscribers of internet Porn, 8 of the 10 were Red states, led by UTAH, and W. Virginia as # 1 + 2.
(Forbidden Fruit anyone or Just Plain Hypocrits) ??

I'm doing my part here in TX.

It seems to be a fact of nature that prohibition makes the forbidden fruit just that much more desirable. Speakeasies during Prohibition were a dime a dozen. Drugs are probably more popular now due to them being illegal. Surely more money is being made off of them and they are more unsafe than if they were regulated like other drugs. Same for prostitution. Regulate it, tax it make it safer for the women who participate in it. Unfortunately the blue blood prudes in this nation look down on drug users and sins of the flesh so it's OK that those involved suffer. Never mind that there is a cost to society and that they use other sins but that's OK apparently.

Perhaps one of these days we will actually learn to let people live their lives as they see fit so long as their activities do not infringe on the rights of the people around them.

 

[USAir757]

WOW! I thought this was about unemployment?

😱ff:

 

[Garfield1966]

We wondered a bit .... eventually we'll get back too it ... or not.

 

[Hadenough]

Hadenough,

By all means, you and others who share your belief(s) SHOULD try to pass Laws to "Change things"
May I remind you that 50%+ of the country does not want Roe v. Wade reversed !
May I remind you that Sandara Day O'Conner/Supreme court Justice.....A REPUBLICAN, cast the tie-breaking vote that enables Roe v. Wade to STAND as it does now.

May I remind you not to make assumptions. You have no idea what my belief(s) might be nor my political affiliation.

 

[NewHampshire Black Bears]

May I remind you not to make assumptions. You have no idea what my belief(s) might be nor my political affiliation.

Fair enough...Hadenough.
It was incorrect of me to "Ass-ume" :blush: