No Joint Contract, No integration "AWARD"

[end_of_alpa]

The top 500 protected pilots and virtually all the captains would gain nothing by decertifying and the furloughees would likely not be permitted to vote in a decertification election. That leaves the F/O's to carry the vote and they simply do not have the numbers. The influence of the AWA EVP should not be discounted either.

Instead of pursuing dead-ends as a means of proving to the pilots they are at least going somewhere, the east should realize the hand they truly have and play it to their best advantage. That means accepting the arbitrators decision and moving forward productively. The AAA MEC has a duty to it's members to do this.

We'll find out, won't we!! The "crystal" ball is in your court, huh... You are going to be "surprised!" If you think the East pilots are apart on this, you better think again. They know they have more to risk in the future with this ruling than you realize.

 

[luvn737s]

Luvn737s,
Finally, I believe the America West pilots will get to keep thier PHX/LAS flying, not be able to bid East, not fly transatlantic (except for two B757 flights per day), not be able to fly from PHL to Asia, and will not be able to obtain EMB-190 flying for a very, very long time, if ever, unless this dispute is resolved. Why? Because that is what the Transition Agreement and Arbitrations require.

Moreover, with US Airways East pilots averaging 250 pilot retirements per year and the AWA pilots averaging 50 pilot retirements per year, the AWA pilots will have very little seniority list growth opportunites due to the Transition Agreement and the Company's plan to have very little domestic growth, which will lead to many, many years of AWA pilot stagnation, unless something changes.

Regards,

USA320Pilot

You missed the point of my post entirely. If the east pulls it's proposed shenanigans, there will be no TA and the firewall protections it offers the east. There will be nothing to stop the West from flying widebodies to anywhere from anywhere. Truly 'all bets' will be off.

Cutting off your nose to spite your face is one thing. Decapitating is quite another.

 

[end_of_alpa]

🙄

You missed the point of my post entirely. If the east pulls it's proposed shenanigans, there will be no TA and the firewall protections it offers the east. There will be nothing to stop the West from flying widebodies to anywhere from anywhere. Truly 'all bets' will be off.

Cutting off your nose to spite your face is one thing. Decapitating is quite another.

East pilots will "underbid" your contract. Just wait. We have the bases, the heavy flying, the E190's, Over two thirds of the pilots and only East pilots returning from furlough. And you'll have to square with that, Mate!

 

[USCREW]

This is where pilots are different from Beavis and Butthead. Pilots have very long attention spans and some even have the innate ability to hold a grudge FOREVER. And do.

Thank God that the flight attendants got DOH although the Westies tried to steal that! I can't imagine how we'd deal with something so insane. Right now it's all on paper, but when we actually work together as one crew....well it will make PI/PSA look like a marriage made in heaven!

 

[luvn737s]

🙄

East pilots will "underbid" your contract. Just wait. We have the bases, the heavy flying, the E190's, Over two thirds of the pilots and only East pilots returning from furlough. And you'll have to square with that, Mate!

With a 16 year term like EGL got? Good luck, vote twice.

 

[end_of_alpa]

Hmmmm,

Appears someone has "broken" the code. I'm not a pilot and I ran some numbers based on my understanding of the award and if you put a calculator to your before and after compensation and quality of life issues you'll do OK.

Frankly based solely on my limited knowledge I'd want to be a US East Pilot.

Hey Piney Bob...It takes a non-pilot to do this math. Union pilots don't generally count higher than the immediate cash in their wallet!!

 

[USA320Pilot]

Luvn737s,

US Airways East can negotiate, but not reach a deal. The JNC talks are voluntary, thus, this can be dragged out forever.

As far as the West getting widebody’s it will never happen because PHX & LAS are leisure markets and cannot support profitable flying.

Doug Parker says he would be perfectly content to keep us separate since the East has a contract that's not amendable until 2010. Section 6 negotiations would take about 4 years to negotiate, given his track record. That would put us up to 2014 or so. In the meantime, I suspect the lion share of the new long-haul flying and EMB-190 will come to the east because of the PHL international hub and the lower cost East labor contracts. For that matter, I believe we will get the majority of all new flying.

Moreover, the East pilots are not willing to let the West won't be able to take the massive East pilot attrition and the associated East pay raises.

As John McIlvenna said in Friday’s hotline message, “but with the list out, I think all bets are off.â€￾

Finally, we mean business and either the West pilots become reasonable and work out a solution or this will become very, very ugly. That is not me talking, that's the East MEC talking.

Regards,

USA320Pilot

 

[end_of_alpa]

With a 16 year term like EGL got? Good luck, vote twice.

Whois EGL?? :huh: Oh by the way, it is the companies position that LOA 93 and the East contract is the prevailing contract. Get ready for your pay cuts!!

 

[luvn737s]

Luvn737s,


As far as the West getting widebody’s it will never happen because PHX & LAS are leisure markets and cannot support profitable flying.

Regards,

USA320Pilot

Again, follow me here: NO TA = Anything goes.

The west won't be flying them from PHX. They'll be flying them from an AWA PHL crew base (at least there would be nothing legally stopping them).

Ignoring the risk of scuttling the TA will not make it go away.

But the east will decide what course it wishes to take - progress or vindictiveness.

 

[USA320Pilot]

Luvn737s,

Your theory violates the Transition Agreement, which was designed to prevent "whip sawing". Moreover, the East contract costs less than the West contract so do you think Doug Parker is going to have the AWA pilots fly the widebody's when it costs more?

Regards,

USA320Pilot

 

[phasersonstun2]

Luvn737s,

Your theory violates the Transition Agreement, which was designed to prevent "whip sawing". Moreover, the East contract costs less than the West contract so do you think Doug Parker is going to have the AWA pilots fly the widebody's when it costs more?

Regards,

USA320Pilot

Yes, and then some. Parker could open a separate PHL or PIT base staffed with AWA pilots, feed them the Intl. or whatever else he wanted, and do a Lorenzo (CAL/EAL) on the East.

East pilots will not destroy the airline. It doesn't make sense.

 

[barbeetantrums]

I want this airline to go out of business and I would like to thank you guys for hastening this event. Focus your hatred towards eachother. Spit in eachother's face. Feel the hatred make your bowels churn and your heart race. That's adrenaline. Imagine punching your enemy, easie or westie, in the mouth so hard that there is an eruption of teeth and blood. When you run into eachother on the hotel shuttle, or whatever, get in that person's face and just scream at the top of your lungs. Make Al proud.

 

[fatherabraham]

RICO,

Aquagreen73 is 100% correct!! You propose to hold an entire pilot group and company at considerable financial cost hostage because you didn't get your way. I guess you would much rather have a federal Judge force the issue upon you at which case you would stand the chance of seeing a bump. Lets suppose you do attempt something that stupid and we do go to federal court and you lose. All the people that upgraded on the east could be bumped as a result. Now that is costly to the company so they won't do that but what is likely is the fact that you could have several hundred f/o's ready to upgrade and they would be put on hold until things are made right by upgrading all the west pilots that should have. This could take a couple of years worth of up grades away from the east...

Bottom line, think long an hard about your next move as it really could hurt much worse in the long run.

Focus all your collective energies on getting a contract with pre BK rates and work rules...

awa320,

Your own words prove your greed and foolishness. If this were not a windfall (against alpa merger policy) then you and your cohorts would be just fine with keeping operations separate. DP is OK with it or did you forget?

The lack of comments endorsing separate operations by awa folk speaks volumes. Painfully obvious to most on this board that it is you who are trying to steal another pilots rightful attrition progress.

Noticed you replied to my last post neglecting to admit you nor any awa employee is in the airline saving business.


FA

 

[autofixer]

Barbee, Okay.

 

[barbeetantrums]

Barbee, Okay.

So does that mean you will follow your Hatred? That would be so cool. I'm waiting for pilots to start brawling. Don't let me down.