Other suitors come out of the woods after AA

[FWAAA]

Voting on a POR sounds like such a powerful thing but is about as useless as having a choice between a democrat and a republican.

My point was that those who craft your choice have more power than those who choose and those who have a secured interest (coupled with new financiers) have the most. Voting is a means of pacification.

Your posts in this thread reflect a profound lack of knowledge about how bankruptcy law works. And that's odd coming from an employee at US, which experienced two Ch 11 cases in quick succession beginning about a decade ago. Perhaps the passage of time has eroded your memory. I can only hope that you know more about whatever it is that you do at USAirways than you know about Ch 11.

The secured creditors have no vote on the POR. The unsecured creditors (including Boeing and airports bond trustees and employees and the PBGC and others who hold unsecured AA debt) are the only parties whose opinion will matter when the company (or others) submit plans of reorganization for creditor approval before seeking approval from the judge.

New money has no vote. Secured creditors have no vote. Employees of US have no vote. Wall Street financiers have no vote. Existing shareholders have no vote. AA management has no vote. The unsecured creditors have the vote.

 

[UPNAWAY]

There are really only two probably scenarios IMHO AA emerges from BK alone or with a plan to merge fully with US. Every other permutation is an extremely unlikely long shot.

 

[SparrowHawk]

There are really only two probably scenarios IMHO AA emerges from BK alone or with a plan to merge fully with US. Every other permutation is an extremely unlikely long shot.

Remember this is the Airline Business we're talking about. A place where Truth is Stranger then fiction. BA has a who;e lot to lose alliance wise if US/AA merge and remain in Star Alliance. If we end up with a Republican POTUS a DL/AA merger might pass DOJ muster. Or even a DL/US merger for that matter.

If I were a betting man I'd keep my money in my pocket.

 

[FWAAA]

There are really only two probably scenarios IMHO AA emerges from BK alone or with a plan to merge fully with US. Every other permutation is an extremely unlikely long shot.

I tend to agree. It looked obvious to everyone that DL and NW were sleeping together and planning a LTR but they both exited Ch 11 as technically "single." Kept the prudish grandmothers happy.

Even if AA and US do the dirty, I don't see any formal merger announcement until after AA has exited Ch 11 as a standalone, unattached "single."

 

[767one]

OK Jim, if as you say and you are correct (as always 😉 ) and there is no "value" to the PHX operation, I guess there just wouldn't be any takers.

Your list of "ALL the benefits" of the merger consists of post merger changes in fleet and staffing, additions and changes that are almost exclusively utilized by and directly benefit the East operation. Why do you suppose that is?

BECAUSE THAT'S WHERE THE VALUE IS!

Nobody I fly with has expressed any desire to "stick it" to the West. How about you, oh that's right, its been a few YEARS since you've flown a trip or spent any time in the crew room or been hanging out on any layovers. Amazing how you can maintain such an accurate take on the "sentiments" out on the line. Must be some kind of "Vulcan" mind thing you got going on.

Time will tell whether the West manages to make themselves a big enough pain in the butt, with respect to the SLI and its possible negative effect on "Team Tempe's" merger plans, to wind up being spun off, to make a deal happen. Wouldn't that be the ultimate irony! Don't think "Dougie" and the boys won't turn to "eating their young" if necessary to line their pockets and inflate their egos.


seajay

Good post. Must be a lot of westies on the forum because you got some negative feedback.

 

[mrbreeze]

OK Jim, if as you say and you are correct (as always 😉 ) and there is no "value" to the PHX operation, I guess there just wouldn't be any takers.

Your list of "ALL the benefits" of the merger consists of post merger changes in fleet and staffing, additions and changes that are almost exclusively utilized by and directly benefit the East operation. Why do you suppose that is?

BECAUSE THAT'S WHERE THE VALUE IS!

Nobody I fly with has expressed any desire to "stick it" to the West. How about you, oh that's right, its been a few YEARS since you've flown a trip or spent any time in the crew room or been hanging out on any layovers. Amazing how you can maintain such an accurate take on the "sentiments" out on the line. Must be some kind of "Vulcan" mind thing you got going on.

Time will tell whether the West manages to make themselves a big enough pain in the butt, with respect to the SLI and its possible negative effect on "Team Tempe's" merger plans, to wind up being spun off, to make a deal happen. Wouldn't that be the ultimate irony! Don't think "Dougie" and the boys won't turn to "eating their young" if necessary to line their pockets and inflate their egos.


seajay

perfect

 

[mrbreeze]

"how may times have easties claimed that PHX loses money and has no value?"

I'm on record as pointing out that east would be right back in bankruptcy and facing liquidation without the west and the PHX hub. So don't try to make me a party to the west screwing you're attempting...



Because east was saved from liquidation perhaps.



Is that the value that resulted in 2 bankruptcies and would have ended in liquidation without the merger??? Now the east is "entitled" to it all.... :blink:



Actions speak louder than words...doing everything possible to get DOH says all that needs to be said.

Jim

Try some Metamucil, Jim.

 

[FrequentFlierCA]

This is not surprising, although I still think that AA will emerge as an independent carrier. US Airways is probably the least desirable option. Alaska would make a lot of sense, and I could see jetBlue potentially.

Let's just not put the jetBlue flight crews with the AA flight attendants. BAD combination. 😀

 

[Iclubbabyseals]

I guess in theory BA rescued USAir or maybe it was already USAirways......sorry it was a long time ago and my memory is getting shorter. I don't think that deal worked out too well for BA but who knows, it might work out well for AA.

When BA did the deal with US, I remember talking with their "property manager" or whatever she called herself, who was quite pleased that US traded BA all the PIT airport rents totaling some $138 million over, I think, 5 years, at the time. Traded for what? Who knows anymore?

 

[Move2CLT]

OK Jim, if as you say and you are correct (as always 😉 ) and there is no "value" to the PHX operation, I guess there just wouldn't be any takers.

Your list of "ALL the benefits" of the merger consists of post merger changes in fleet and staffing, additions and changes that are almost exclusively utilized by and directly benefit the East operation. Why do you suppose that is?

BECAUSE THAT'S WHERE THE VALUE IS!

Nobody I fly with has expressed any desire to "stick it" to the West. How about you, oh that's right, its been a few YEARS since you've flown a trip or spent any time in the crew room or been hanging out on any layovers. Amazing how you can maintain such an accurate take on the "sentiments" out on the line. Must be some kind of "Vulcan" mind thing you got going on.

Time will tell whether the West manages to make themselves a big enough pain in the butt, with respect to the SLI and its possible negative effect on "Team Tempe's" merger plans, to wind up being spun off, to make a deal happen. Wouldn't that be the ultimate irony! Don't think "Dougie" and the boys won't turn to "eating their young" if necessary to line their pockets and inflate their egos.


seajay

"Spun off" - the perpetual eastie wet dream!

And let me guess, Parker just got the AWA certificate back from the FAA, right?

Dream on easties, dream on.

 

[Phoenix]

Your posts in this thread reflect a profound lack of knowledge about how bankruptcy law works. And that's odd coming from an employee at US, which experienced two Ch 11 cases in quick succession beginning about a decade ago. Perhaps the passage of time has eroded your memory. I can only hope that you know more about whatever it is that you do at USAirways than you know about Ch 11.

The secured creditors have no vote on the POR. The unsecured creditors (including Boeing and airports bond trustees and employees and the PBGC and others who hold unsecured AA debt) are the only parties whose opinion will matter when the company (or others) submit plans of reorganization for creditor approval before seeking approval from the judge.

New money has no vote. Secured creditors have no vote. Employees of US have no vote. Wall Street financiers have no vote. Existing shareholders have no vote. AA management has no vote. The unsecured creditors have the vote.

Voting is a means of pacification for those who don't frame the game. I have been a cynic ever since my first grade teacher gave us a choice, "Do you want spinach or brussels sprouts for lunch?"

 

[Phoenix]

Oh no...

Not you too??

What is your definition of the "everyone to be happy" you've identified? The good news starved LCC folks?

You misunderstood my post... The article is a puff piece. I don't have any idea if it has any semblance of reality... "inevitable" is what the article was painting.. the articles are entertaining and both sides (and more) will have friends publish articles trying to paint the reality they prefer.

 

[Phoenix]

First, what's to buy? Some beyond perimeter slots in DCA, which may or may not be able to be transferred anyway. Second, how may times have easties claimed that PHX loses money and has no value? Yet someone would pay good money for it??? For the right to compete with WN in one of their biggest focus cities???

Sure, it has no value and any forwarding looking management team would steer clear of it. That is why managers at USAir bought it. 😛

 

[BoeingBoy]

That is why managers at USAir bought it. 😛

Cute, but factually deficient...a common trait in the east...

Jim