Pilot Comments!

[Hopeful]

Had a brief cockpit conversation with a first officer yesterday. In so many words, this pilot said he and fellow pilots support the outsourcing of more American Airlines maintenance so the pilot group could argue for more wages since the company's expenses would be drastically reduced.


I told him that was selfish and basically that logic sucked. So he came back and said ALL employees could argue for higher wages.

I left the cockpit in amazement








Nice guy, that pilot!

 

[Ken MacTiernan]

It is hard to not judge a group of people based on one person's beliefs. But, having talked to many pilots as they leave the a/c about cAArty & AArpey and concessions they all seem to be reluctant to say staight out what they feel but almost to a man/woman they give the impression that they are concerned about THEIR retirement/pension and will screw any work group to preserve their golden egg.

Just look at the pilots that are trying to buy the airline. Why don't these pilots try and get better union representation to protect what they can negotiate instead of attempting something that will fail?

 

[aafsc]

It is hard to not judge a group of people based on one person's beliefs. But, having talked to many pilots as they leave the a/c about cAArty & AArpey and concessions they all seem to be reluctant to say staight out what they feel but almost to a man/woman they give the impression that they are concerned about THEIR retirement/pension and will screw any work group to preserve their golden egg.

Just look at the pilots that are trying to buy the airline. Why don't these pilots try and get better union representation to protect what they can negotiate instead of attempting something that will fail?

[post="227802"][/post]​

I believe I read or heard it from somewhere that the APA is looking to do an ESOP at AA.

 

[FWAAA]

Many people would throw their own mother under the bus if they thought it would help preserve a retirement valued in millions of dollars. Doesn't make it right, but I can understand it. The A-plan and B-plan lump sum totals can easily be $3 million. Every retiring pilot basically has a winning lottery ticket, on top of all other wealth they are able to accumulate. Woe to anyone they fear is threatening that ticket.

 

[Bob Owens]

The pilots are pursueing their own interests, just like the rest of us.

Our problem is not that the pilots have a union that is fighting for them, our problem is that we have a union that doesnt.

Instead of looking to pick a fight with the pilots we should look for a way to join with them to fight our common opponent.

To those pilots who think that outsourcing maintenance is a good idea let them know that they are the ones who will be flying these things.

Remind them of Valuejet.

There wasnt even enough left of the pilots from that plane to make gator snacks. But they saved a lot of money, and guess what, the Valuejet pilots did not get it.

As skilled workers are chased out of this industry into other feilds where their skills command a higher rate without the inconvenience of working shifts, holidays and weekends in an insecure enviornment more and more work will be done by unliscenced workers who do not have the training, skills or responsibilities that pilots like that take for granted.

Many years ago I worked for one of those outsourced outfits. AAR tech. They hired people and just threw the part in front of them and said "fix it". In some cases they refused to buy the proper materials to make the repairs leaving up to the repair person to improvise. No training, if you were lucky you would get the manufactureres shop manual. They wanted to offer training on the condition that workers did it on their own time and agreed to stay on for an extended period of time so the company could recoup their "investment". If the employee left they would have to pay the company for the "value" of the training. Most of the work was signed off by a shop forman who took little interest in really examining the work, basically he just put his name to it.

If thats what these guys are willing to fly thats one thing, but the public should be informed, they may feel differently. Another problem with these low cost, low skilled third party providers is the huge turnover. High turnover heightens security risks. As these places get desperate to replace the constant churn of workers they cant possibly perform adequate background checks and these workers are not subject to criminal background or drug testing like liscenced airline mechanics.

 

[Hopeful]

It seems that the pilot who made these comments to me is part of the mainstream pilot group. Now we see the UAl pilots reachinga tentative deal that requires the raping of the FA group and the other union groups.

These pilots are out of control!

 

[Strake]

It is hard to not judge a group of people based on one person's beliefs. But, having talked to many pilots as they leave the a/c about cAArty & AArpey and concessions they all seem to be reluctant to say staight out what they feel but almost to a man/woman they give the impression that they are concerned about THEIR retirement/pension and will screw any work group to preserve their golden egg.

[post="227802"][/post]​

They sound like they could be "high senior" amfa supporters if not for being pilots.

 

[Hopeful]

They sound like they could be "high senior" amfa supporters if not for being pilots.

[post="230165"][/post]​

Strake:
We're talking about pilots here who will gladly have other union members take it in the shorts to preserve their pensions and pay.

Since AMFA is not on AA property, I assume you would gladly have your fellow TWU members take it in the A##.

AMFA is a different argument here. We ALL got raped and the UAL pilots are essentially saying F### the other work groups because "WE ARE PILOTS!"

It's quite amazing when the pilots have their ISSUES, the go by the book and flex their muscles and beat their chests and remind the world that they are the pilots.

Well, Strake, earlier this year they got their 7% kick back while the TWU twisted arms and got us 1.5% or $.46 an hour per year.

Strake, I don't know where you work, but at the line stations the Captains will whine and whine about having the APU's been left running. They have been cracking the APU's up about 15 minutes before departure while passengers were sweating their balls off in the summer months and freezing those same balls off in these winter months.

What do you think they're getting in return for fuel savings?

We mechanics aren't getting any incentive for taxiing on one engine!

In the summer, one Captain gave me the "I AM CAPTAIN HEAR ME ROAR" mantra about leaving the APU on while the plane was on the ground for about two hours. I told him that cabin service had to clean the aircraft and I turned the APU and AC packs so they wouldn't have to work in a 98 degree cabin.
He reminded me that we have to help the company. I agreed and I then compared his 7% kick back to my $.46 an hour increase and then gave him the entire list of what WE gave back in concessions.

That was the end of the conversation.

I don't fault anyone for trying to preserve their pay and pensions, BUT not at the RAPING of another work group.

 

[Bob Owens]

It seems that the pilot who made these comments to me is part of the mainstream pilot group. Now we see the UAl pilots reachinga tentative deal that requires the raping of the FA group and the other union groups.

These pilots are out of control!

[post="230148"][/post]​

Yes it seems that the mighty AFL-CIO alliance is once again demonstrating its Solidarity. ALPA has cut a deal where they get a $550 million bond in exchange for screwing everyone else.

Pat Friend was quoted in the Financial Times (Monday Dec 22, pg 22) as saying "I think they(The Airline Pilots Association) should be thrown out of the AFL-CIO". "It looks like a mutual protection deal to stop the pesky flight attendants (AFA) and mechanics (AMFA) from filing for a trustee, whilst selling out their pensions.They are despicable."



Some time after Sept 11, 2001 the APA hosted a dinner in Manhattan where they invited representatives from the APFA, UAL(ALPA, AFA), the NYFD and NYPD. Reprsentatives from Local 562 were also invited. Another board member and I attended. At this dinner I was introduced by the the APA to the head of the UAL-ALPA MEC. Needless to say I did not hit it off well with that pompous ass. Right off the bat he was saying about how everyone had to give concessions. He said "You got to know when to hold em, know when to fold em". He didnt like it when I said "Who are you Kenny F***ing Rodgers? Our discussion quickly got heated as a couple of other ALPA members and APA members cut in and changed the discussion. It was after all a meeting in remembrance of 9-11.

There are many pilots out there that are good union people, who understand and appreciate the value of the services that other workers contribute to the safe and effective operation of transporting people and cargo in an aluminium shell at 600mph. Unfortunately those pilots do not sit on the board of the UAL APLA MEC.