I have a question. If about every union is having a problem with Dave and his buddies, why doesn't one of them call for his resignation. For some reason I believe that if one union stands up and calls for it, the rest might follow. This is something that could unite the employees. BUT, sometimes I wonder why someone hasn't already mentioned it. IS dave really doing a good job. Are some of us in denial over how he's doing. I just don't know..... I guess I'm just a completely confused person just triying to figure out what the hell is wrong with U.... Sorry i just had to vent.
Question...
- Thread starter Jon153
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Jon, I have thought about your question myself for a while. I have concluded that yes Dave is doing a poor job in CCY BUT, with union reps on the Board of Directors I believe that this is more the doing of Alabama Dave.........otherwise we would have had an emergency meeting of the BOD which would have came out with a vote of no Confidence with out leader.
aerosmith
Senior
A letter released by DL 141 the day after Judge Cindrich's decision granting a preliminary injuction did call for Seigel & Cohen's resignations.
To date the ALPA Union is the only labor group on record with a vote of NO Confidence
The IAM is in a major battle with Siegel over the Airbus work..yet not such call has been made....what the heck are they waiting on??? ( On this observation I stand somewhat corrected , yet un-impressed with it's lack of muscle)
The AFA has more than it's fair share of beefs with Siegel..yet no such call has been made....again, what's the hold-up here ???
.....and so on and so on !!
Many here agree that Siegel has done wonders to bring all unions together..and that's in a completely negative context as we know it. Hate based unity can become a very nasty thing...the time for a change is over-due for the good of everyone
I firmly believe that every union on the property..including the mis-treated and frequently lied too members of the wholly owneds need to bond together with a voice of unity in asking for Siegels immediate resignation.
I believe that most , minus a couple here and there , see that Siegel has no actual plan to run U..or no interest in ever expanding U's scale to become a more competative force in the industry....with the exception of mainline job robbing RJ's at contract carriers...or Walmart wages at MDA.
Every word we hear is based on consolidation or the infamous UCT/ICT's that a certain U Captain loves to write about. Should the consolidation process grow wings?..U as we know it now will become a shadow of what we are at present....and that isn't much if you look around with a half-way open and objective eye.
Consolidation or the infamous UCT/ICT's will also not ever allow the return of thousands of our brothers and sisters....it will in fact cause the loss of countless more jobs via intergration and supposed duplicaton of effort relief. Yes some management (Lower Eschelon) will feel the bite...but whom will bare the brunt of these actions? Yes dear friends you and I will.
Again...it's time for the unions to raise a collective voice and assume a collective posture here. We have voting members on the BOD...and maybe just maybe? some of Bronners BOD'ers or Bronner himself will see the light on this subject?
Rumors have flown about Bronner becoming less and less pleased with Siegel...on the off chance that there is some truth in this? Why not try to exploit that?..do we really have anything to lose by trying? We have everything to lose by remaining silent and accepting of the current trends here.
I'm sure everyone knows that Dave is forming the words again on how to ask more from us...or sharpening the pencil on how many people to furlough....time is not on your side , management is not on your side , your unions voice is all you have ..and it's high time to use it to it's maximum potential.
The IAM is in a major battle with Siegel over the Airbus work..yet not such call has been made....what the heck are they waiting on??? ( On this observation I stand somewhat corrected , yet un-impressed with it's lack of muscle)
The AFA has more than it's fair share of beefs with Siegel..yet no such call has been made....again, what's the hold-up here ???
.....and so on and so on !!
Many here agree that Siegel has done wonders to bring all unions together..and that's in a completely negative context as we know it. Hate based unity can become a very nasty thing...the time for a change is over-due for the good of everyone
I firmly believe that every union on the property..including the mis-treated and frequently lied too members of the wholly owneds need to bond together with a voice of unity in asking for Siegels immediate resignation.
I believe that most , minus a couple here and there , see that Siegel has no actual plan to run U..or no interest in ever expanding U's scale to become a more competative force in the industry....with the exception of mainline job robbing RJ's at contract carriers...or Walmart wages at MDA.
Every word we hear is based on consolidation or the infamous UCT/ICT's that a certain U Captain loves to write about. Should the consolidation process grow wings?..U as we know it now will become a shadow of what we are at present....and that isn't much if you look around with a half-way open and objective eye.
Consolidation or the infamous UCT/ICT's will also not ever allow the return of thousands of our brothers and sisters....it will in fact cause the loss of countless more jobs via intergration and supposed duplicaton of effort relief. Yes some management (Lower Eschelon) will feel the bite...but whom will bare the brunt of these actions? Yes dear friends you and I will.
Again...it's time for the unions to raise a collective voice and assume a collective posture here. We have voting members on the BOD...and maybe just maybe? some of Bronners BOD'ers or Bronner himself will see the light on this subject?
Rumors have flown about Bronner becoming less and less pleased with Siegel...on the off chance that there is some truth in this? Why not try to exploit that?..do we really have anything to lose by trying? We have everything to lose by remaining silent and accepting of the current trends here.
I'm sure everyone knows that Dave is forming the words again on how to ask more from us...or sharpening the pencil on how many people to furlough....time is not on your side , management is not on your side , your unions voice is all you have ..and it's high time to use it to it's maximum potential.
USAirBoyA330
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MEC Resolution
(This resolution was unanimously passed at the MEC meeting on Wednesday, July 23, 2003.)
WHEREAS, the US Airways flight attendants did our part to save our airline after CEO David Siegel and his new management team took over, and,
WHEREAS, the hundreds of millions of dollars saved by the airline as a result of the substantial sacrifices flight attendants twice made in wages, benefits and work rules that were extracted under heavy-handed threats of the shuttering of our carrier, have taken a devastating toll on our families and quality of life, and,
WHEREAS, those extreme measures still were not enough to save the jobs of thousands of our flying partners, whose dedication to US Airways was repaid with a furlough notice and a ticket to the unemployment line for them and their families, and,
WHEREAS, Dave Siegel's management team has regularly violated our contract even after the sacrifices we made for the survival of the airline, and
WHEREAS, management has unilaterally expanded the scope of our negotiated Restructuring Agreement beyond any terms the flight attendant would ever consent to under any circumstances - even under the threat of closure of our airline, and,
WHEREAS, Siegel and his key lieutenants disingenuous interpretation of our contractual provisions regarding personal days, medical and sick policies, the reserve system and an abusive continuance of the additional 5% pay reduction because of the war have been, by judgment of this MEC, to be willful and illicit attacks on the US Airways flight attendant,
THEREFORE BE IT RESOLVED that the MEC's position is that the existing US Airways management team has failed to honor or administer our collective bargaining agreement in good faith shows a reckless disregard for the emotional and physical health of their workers, treating us as liabilities rather than the frontline ambassadors that we are everyday for our airline, and,
BE IT FURTHER RESOLVED that David Siegel and the US Airways Board of Directors will be alerted to our position and asked to intercede on the behalf of the airline's dedicated frontline employees to return our 5% pay deferral now and immediately resolve outstanding contractual violations in an acceptable manner, making a public display of this airline's massive internal problems unnecessary and,
BE IT FINALLY RESOLVED that if David Siegel and the US Airways Board of Directors do not intercede on behalf of the US Airways flight attendants, the MEC and all flight attendants will act in solidarity to ensure that the flying public, community leaders, shareholders, and the media are alerted to the massive disputes described here, through all legal avenues available to us - including letters to Congress, letters to investors, media events and other public displays - as part of an intensive effort to bring US Airways into compliance with the existing flight attendant working agreement.
(This resolution was unanimously passed at the MEC meeting on Wednesday, July 23, 2003.)
WHEREAS, the US Airways flight attendants did our part to save our airline after CEO David Siegel and his new management team took over, and,
WHEREAS, the hundreds of millions of dollars saved by the airline as a result of the substantial sacrifices flight attendants twice made in wages, benefits and work rules that were extracted under heavy-handed threats of the shuttering of our carrier, have taken a devastating toll on our families and quality of life, and,
WHEREAS, those extreme measures still were not enough to save the jobs of thousands of our flying partners, whose dedication to US Airways was repaid with a furlough notice and a ticket to the unemployment line for them and their families, and,
WHEREAS, Dave Siegel's management team has regularly violated our contract even after the sacrifices we made for the survival of the airline, and
WHEREAS, management has unilaterally expanded the scope of our negotiated Restructuring Agreement beyond any terms the flight attendant would ever consent to under any circumstances - even under the threat of closure of our airline, and,
WHEREAS, Siegel and his key lieutenants disingenuous interpretation of our contractual provisions regarding personal days, medical and sick policies, the reserve system and an abusive continuance of the additional 5% pay reduction because of the war have been, by judgment of this MEC, to be willful and illicit attacks on the US Airways flight attendant,
THEREFORE BE IT RESOLVED that the MEC's position is that the existing US Airways management team has failed to honor or administer our collective bargaining agreement in good faith shows a reckless disregard for the emotional and physical health of their workers, treating us as liabilities rather than the frontline ambassadors that we are everyday for our airline, and,
BE IT FURTHER RESOLVED that David Siegel and the US Airways Board of Directors will be alerted to our position and asked to intercede on the behalf of the airline's dedicated frontline employees to return our 5% pay deferral now and immediately resolve outstanding contractual violations in an acceptable manner, making a public display of this airline's massive internal problems unnecessary and,
BE IT FINALLY RESOLVED that if David Siegel and the US Airways Board of Directors do not intercede on behalf of the US Airways flight attendants, the MEC and all flight attendants will act in solidarity to ensure that the flying public, community leaders, shareholders, and the media are alerted to the massive disputes described here, through all legal avenues available to us - including letters to Congress, letters to investors, media events and other public displays - as part of an intensive effort to bring US Airways into compliance with the existing flight attendant working agreement.
USAirboyA330,
The above statement was strong...and I do believe it had an impact on the pay deferal return...and I applaud the AFA's MEC efforts on that subject...yet it is not as implied a Vote of No Confidence..or a direct call for anyones resignation as I have outlined.
What has taken place since July 23rd when that letter was dated has only worsened in nature.
We are in fact on the cusp of another concessionary speach...as well as possible additions to the furloughed ranks as the tea leaves tend to indicate.
We are also seeing our fleet dwindle as Airbus narrow bodies drop from use over FAA mandated S- Checks not being performed due directly to Siegels anti-labor actions to date.
With the above in mind....Flying hours cannot help but be hampered for both the pilots and F/A's at some point. We will also be placing ourselves in a position to not capitalize on peak Holiday traffic with portions of the agreed upon figure of 279 Acft sitting idle in Arizona and Alabama....and nothing returning in their absence.
Siegels chosen course is also causing money that should be spent on fixing Acft and the airline as a whole to be spent on legal battles that he shows no tangible way to win..yet the money trickles away by the hour...and the work will still have to be performed at a hectic pace later as other S-Checks continue to become due.
Again..this subject is based on current issues...as well as projected ones as Seigel seeks outside cures for internal flaws. Outsourcing , RJ affiliations , MDA or any of the other suedo solutions Seigel brings to the table , will not correct things to the benefit of the rank and file. The sooner all parties come to terms with that fact...and act accordingly , the better are chances of hauling ourselves collectively out of an impending inferno.
The above statement was strong...and I do believe it had an impact on the pay deferal return...and I applaud the AFA's MEC efforts on that subject...yet it is not as implied a Vote of No Confidence..or a direct call for anyones resignation as I have outlined.
What has taken place since July 23rd when that letter was dated has only worsened in nature.
We are in fact on the cusp of another concessionary speach...as well as possible additions to the furloughed ranks as the tea leaves tend to indicate.
We are also seeing our fleet dwindle as Airbus narrow bodies drop from use over FAA mandated S- Checks not being performed due directly to Siegels anti-labor actions to date.
With the above in mind....Flying hours cannot help but be hampered for both the pilots and F/A's at some point. We will also be placing ourselves in a position to not capitalize on peak Holiday traffic with portions of the agreed upon figure of 279 Acft sitting idle in Arizona and Alabama....and nothing returning in their absence.
Siegels chosen course is also causing money that should be spent on fixing Acft and the airline as a whole to be spent on legal battles that he shows no tangible way to win..yet the money trickles away by the hour...and the work will still have to be performed at a hectic pace later as other S-Checks continue to become due.
Again..this subject is based on current issues...as well as projected ones as Seigel seeks outside cures for internal flaws. Outsourcing , RJ affiliations , MDA or any of the other suedo solutions Seigel brings to the table , will not correct things to the benefit of the rank and file. The sooner all parties come to terms with that fact...and act accordingly , the better are chances of hauling ourselves collectively out of an impending inferno.
After consulting a virgin chicken's entrails, I, too, believe dave has no intent of operating this company. Every action points to a sale. While other carriers are strapped for cash, a slimmed-down U, and perhaps an MDA IPO in the offing makes the deal doable.
Two problems, employee-wise, that AOG alluded to. OA CEO does not want senior employees bloating his costs. OA union 'brothers and sisters' do not want a bunch of senior folks moving in on them.
Solution: Run off every employee possible. Shift many of them into MDA. Few mainline employees are left. Sale of U mainline now possible; MDA IPO sweetens the pot. The poor bastards at MDA do NOT make the jump to the surviving entity, or if they do, with zero seniority.
One fact goes along with this scenario. The startup of MDA is being designed to run employees off. I already understand it has been proposed to AFA for f/a's to get a one-time offer of MDA employment. I know for a lead-pipe cinch such a scenario is being discussed at IAM-fleet.
This is wholly against union principles. My station has had most agents from a nearby station that got expressed a few years ago transfer in. Some have been in and out of furlough, and in and out of full-time/part-time employment. Yet they have been able to maintain employment in the area they prefer to live in, AND THEY HAVE NOT LOST A SECOND OF SENIORITY. As the company is contemplating 'expression' on a massive scale, (I believe this is one of the major cost carve-outs of 2004), it is INCUMBENT on the unions to protect the 1999 furlough language. Basically, you maintain your seniority for four years of furlough, REGARDLESS of where you work.
The company will fight this tooth and nail.
IAM, you stood tall for the mechs. You damn sure better stand tall for fleet!
Two problems, employee-wise, that AOG alluded to. OA CEO does not want senior employees bloating his costs. OA union 'brothers and sisters' do not want a bunch of senior folks moving in on them.
Solution: Run off every employee possible. Shift many of them into MDA. Few mainline employees are left. Sale of U mainline now possible; MDA IPO sweetens the pot. The poor bastards at MDA do NOT make the jump to the surviving entity, or if they do, with zero seniority.
One fact goes along with this scenario. The startup of MDA is being designed to run employees off. I already understand it has been proposed to AFA for f/a's to get a one-time offer of MDA employment. I know for a lead-pipe cinch such a scenario is being discussed at IAM-fleet.
This is wholly against union principles. My station has had most agents from a nearby station that got expressed a few years ago transfer in. Some have been in and out of furlough, and in and out of full-time/part-time employment. Yet they have been able to maintain employment in the area they prefer to live in, AND THEY HAVE NOT LOST A SECOND OF SENIORITY. As the company is contemplating 'expression' on a massive scale, (I believe this is one of the major cost carve-outs of 2004), it is INCUMBENT on the unions to protect the 1999 furlough language. Basically, you maintain your seniority for four years of furlough, REGARDLESS of where you work.
The company will fight this tooth and nail.
IAM, you stood tall for the mechs. You damn sure better stand tall for fleet!
robbedagain
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I'd have to say that if siegal and glass go, what about that raider dude? I was told a while back from my station manager that steve raider is a very heartless sob. I think he should go along with the rest of the gangsters of ccy!
USAirBoyA330
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AOG-N-IT:
That resolution was cleaned up by AFA International before it was presented. The original writing of it was just scathing and did call for their resignation. It was deemed at the time to be a bit strong. If we had known then what we do now, I am sure it would have been left the way it was written in the first place.
That resolution was cleaned up by AFA International before it was presented. The original writing of it was just scathing and did call for their resignation. It was deemed at the time to be a bit strong. If we had known then what we do now, I am sure it would have been left the way it was written in the first place.
Hindsight is indeed 20/20...but I fully appreciate where they were coming from at the time.USAirBoyA330 said:
Would you not agree now...that joining ALPA and the IAM's call for their resignations is in order?
I would certainly like the see IAM-Fleet and the CWA step up too...and dare we not forget our friends at the WO's either...if we catch a chill? They catch the flu as it seems.
RedOne
Senior
I often wonder if by our posting our fears, what we think, or our guesses as to what is going to happen...are we really giving "the palace" ideas that they hadn't thought of. As we express our fears or thoughts, are they saying, "Oh-h-h-h-h! We haven't thought of that. That's a good idea! Let's assign someone to read this chat site daily for suggestions from the employees on how we can get them. This stuff is great!"
