DakotaHC8...Question, in the last year how many A/C''s has PDT lost back to the owners? 15? 16? ,any word yet on the replacement equipment...jets??? Or only lip service and "verbal promises" from M/L??? With "cost" being a issue do you really think "Uncle" Dave is going to allow big $$$$ to be spent to "ramp" up ALG, PDT, to fly jet equipment when the contract carriers, and (MidAtlantic) are at the top of the list? Look at PDT in Fla., the writings on the wall pal, so wake up ...snap out of it. As time goes on the wholly owned group will be "bleed off" a little at a time and replaced by Midatlantic and the contract carriers. Its already started.
Questions for ''expressed'' stations
- Thread starter diogenes
- Start date
PDT gave up FL because Dave wanted to give up intra-florida flying cause he says there was no money in it.
With a little scheduling/routing program PDT could still serve some Fl cities,,but thats another subject all together.
I do not know what you mean by spending money to ramp out the wholly owned to work RJ seeing we already work RJ's in CLT DCA and other places....
I see the wholly owned merging under the USairways express system out of CCY instead of ALG PDT and PSA.
They just made plans to merge customer service and maintenace department. Earlier on I believe the merge the department that handles payroll and ordering.
Next I suppose they will merge Dispactchers..Mechanics and Flight crews.
..
Earlier on it was reported that MDA would get a number of 70 or 90 seat RJ's and the wholly owned would get about 120 50 seat RJ's
But only time will tell
With a little scheduling/routing program PDT could still serve some Fl cities,,but thats another subject all together.
I do not know what you mean by spending money to ramp out the wholly owned to work RJ seeing we already work RJ's in CLT DCA and other places....
I see the wholly owned merging under the USairways express system out of CCY instead of ALG PDT and PSA.
They just made plans to merge customer service and maintenace department. Earlier on I believe the merge the department that handles payroll and ordering.
Next I suppose they will merge Dispactchers..Mechanics and Flight crews.
..
Earlier on it was reported that MDA would get a number of 70 or 90 seat RJ's and the wholly owned would get about 120 50 seat RJ's
But only time will tell
1ab...If there is no money to be made in Fla., why did Mesa jump into it?? And why is Midway going to pick up the lease on PDT''s hanger in JAX?? As far as you saying the W/O''s already working the jets, true as far as ground ops, ie. customer svc. no MX that I know of by W/O''s Mx. Sure Fla. is a tough market, but if you can''t "Run with the big Dogs" stay out of the market, only the fit and smart will make it.
----------------
On 4/14/2003 10
35 AM N786P wrote:
1ab...If there is no money to be made in Fla., why did Mesa jump into it?? And why is Midway going to pick up the lease on PDT''s hanger in JAX?? As far as you saying the W/O''s already working the jets, true as far as ground ops, ie. customer svc. no MX that I know of by W/O''s Mx. Sure Fla. is a tough market, but if you can''t "Run with the big Dogs" stay out of the market, only the fit and smart will make it.
----------------
To clarify something here..Mesa was always in the intra-florida market doing jax-tlh-pns-msy and tpa-eyw and mco-vps etc with beeches...the only market they picked up from piedmont were pns-tpa-mia-eyw-pbi and the bahamas...they sent 2 dh8 to cover these routes and they chose those routes mainly to position their ac''s....since they did not pick up the lucrative routes such as tlh-tpa or tlh-mco...On 4/14/2003 10
35 AM N786P wrote: 1ab...If there is no money to be made in Fla., why did Mesa jump into it?? And why is Midway going to pick up the lease on PDT''s hanger in JAX?? As far as you saying the W/O''s already working the jets, true as far as ground ops, ie. customer svc. no MX that I know of by W/O''s Mx. Sure Fla. is a tough market, but if you can''t "Run with the big Dogs" stay out of the market, only the fit and smart will make it.
----------------
I dont know why midway went to Jax ,,maybe because they will have a crew base down south who knows...but the need for pdt not to be in Jax is obvious since the only cities they fly to in Florida is TLH and GNV which is basically 3 flight a day and I guess its no longer feasible to fly a dash to JAx for mtc when they can easily routes to ROA SBY or other MTC sites
DFW, I beg to differ there are many rank and file employees that could have done a better job then the management US has had over the years including dave:
[SIZE= 11pt]As far back as Ed Colodny mistakes have been made that has probably cost this company millions if not billons if you add all the blunders.[/SIZE]
[SIZE= 11pt] [/SIZE]
[SIZE= 11pt]Colodny’s Blunders[/SIZE][SIZE= 11pt]:[/SIZE]
[SIZE= 11pt] [/SIZE]
[SIZE= 11pt]Schofield’s Blunders[/SIZE]:
[SIZE= 11pt] [/SIZE]
[SIZE= 11pt]Wolf and Gangwal:[/SIZE]
[SIZE= 11pt] [/SIZE]
[SIZE= 11pt]Overreacting to the September 11[sup]th[/sup] tragedy and shrinking the airline by 23% and increasing costs by putting larger airplanes on shorter routes.
Yep I guess the highly educated executives did a fine job, NOT![/SIZE]
[SIZE= 11pt]As far back as Ed Colodny mistakes have been made that has probably cost this company millions if not billons if you add all the blunders.[/SIZE]
[SIZE= 11pt] [/SIZE]
[SIZE= 11pt]Colodny’s Blunders[/SIZE][SIZE= 11pt]:[/SIZE]
[SIZE= 11pt] [/SIZE]
- [SIZE= 11pt]Mirror Image, imposing US Air’s business methods upon Piedmont and PSA, instead of looking at each respective airline and adapting their successful practices. [/SIZE]Some examples would be dismantling of the Piedmont Shuttle which accounted for 32% of Piedmont’s Gross Revenue.
- [SIZE= 11pt]Not furthering International Service and canceling the last three 767s on order from Boeing, then realizing how much money was made serving international destinations and paying Boeing a $30 million penalty to reorder the three planes.[/SIZE]
[SIZE= 11pt]Schofield’s Blunders[/SIZE]:
[SIZE= 11pt] [/SIZE]
- [SIZE= 11pt]Business select, $50 million on wasted seats that never worked properly and we eventually removed from the 737-200 fleet. [/SIZE]Operation Highground.
- [SIZE= 11pt]The IAM Mechanic and Related Strike of 1992 in which US Air lost $35 million and agreeing to pay all the pilots during our strike regardless if they flew or not.[/SIZE]
- [SIZE= 11pt]The hiring of Joe Gorman from United Airlines. [/SIZE]Gorman stayed a few months then went right back to United, then United started taking us on head to head in numerous markets where we did not compete before Gorman’s tenure.
- [SIZE= 11pt]The alliance with British Airways to infuse quick cash, but not on favorable terms to US Air, BA got more out of the alliance then we did.[/SIZE]
[SIZE= 11pt]Wolf and Gangwal:[/SIZE]
[SIZE= 11pt] [/SIZE]
- [SIZE= 11pt]Canceling all the Boeing orders and having to pay a substantial penalty to Boeing to this day the dollar amount is not known as it was a confidential out of court settlement after Boeing sued US Airways, but it is believed to be hundreds of millions of dollars.[/SIZE]
- [SIZE= 11pt]Closing of three maintenance bases and trying to accomplish all the work in just three bases, which caused a backlog of airplanes awaiting “Q†and “C†checks and Mod visits. [/SIZE]At one point you could see numerous airplanes parked in Charlotte, Pittsburgh and Tampa awaiting maintenance.
- [SIZE= 11pt]Buying back over $1.5 billon of US Airways stock instead of using the money as operating capital or paying down debt or just having it around for a downturn.[/SIZE]
- [SIZE= 11pt]Selling the company to United Airlines and then for the next 14 months having no direction and running the company into the ground.[/SIZE]
[SIZE= 11pt]Overreacting to the September 11[sup]th[/sup] tragedy and shrinking the airline by 23% and increasing costs by putting larger airplanes on shorter routes.
Yep I guess the highly educated executives did a fine job, NOT![/SIZE]
----------------
On 4/12/2003 5:59:58 AM REACC1 wrote:
Ok, so the company doesn''t want dedicated "career" people anymore. They have become overwhelmed by this industry. They set the premise of prosperous "career", lured thousands of people into the business, and now they are reneging. So typical of U.
dfw79-(curious about your handle).......Q-"When was the last time you looked out at the plane with a huge smile on your face and felt a bit of pride watching it taxi out after a quick turn."
A-The last time was when I was working in the position that I bid for, before I was decieved into believing that an opentime position was rotating job assignments, and I was making well above 13.01/hr. I believed that the company appreciated and respected its employees and the hard work that they do. Apparently, not anymore. ----------------
Companies don''t care about career people anymore, sorry - its true. Right now they care about getting costs down in order to survive and compete. Do you think ATA, AirTran, Frontier, and JetBlue would be growing like they are if they paid U''s wages?On 4/12/2003 5:59:58 AM REACC1 wrote:
Ok, so the company doesn''t want dedicated "career" people anymore. They have become overwhelmed by this industry. They set the premise of prosperous "career", lured thousands of people into the business, and now they are reneging. So typical of U.
dfw79-(curious about your handle).......Q-"When was the last time you looked out at the plane with a huge smile on your face and felt a bit of pride watching it taxi out after a quick turn."
A-The last time was when I was working in the position that I bid for, before I was decieved into believing that an opentime position was rotating job assignments, and I was making well above 13.01/hr. I believed that the company appreciated and respected its employees and the hard work that they do. Apparently, not anymore. ----------------
What is to be curious about my handle?
Mike...I understand your comments on the job fare....it beats getting paid $6.25 starting at PSA doesn''t it? People right now want jobs...if they need it bad enough, they accept an offer it comes to them.
Your comment about Dave makes it all the more clear on your union position. Last I checked Dave was an employee too...who made a paycut. Yes he gave bonuses to some VPs to retain them. Yes it sucks the rest of employees are expected to take cuts in view of that. Unfortunately...a guy throwing bags on the ramp in Cleveland doesn''t hold the skills to run a multibillion dollar company; he knows how to stack a bin and get a plane out early....but sit him down and tell him how to manage the scheduling or marketing department and he''ll say a few choice words and laugh. Everyone is in their position because they have a skill that they are good at; everyone is a piece of a huge puzzle and they all have their part.
DFW,
It takes virtually no skill to be a butcher.It does take skill to make money in difficult economic times.Dave hasn''t shown that he is able to do that. I don''t know what your connection with this company is and frankly I don''t care.The bottom line is you get what you pay for and you''re about to see that in spades.
It takes virtually no skill to be a butcher.It does take skill to make money in difficult economic times.Dave hasn''t shown that he is able to do that. I don''t know what your connection with this company is and frankly I don''t care.The bottom line is you get what you pay for and you''re about to see that in spades.
- Thread Starter
- #23
----------------
On 4/12/2003 4:28:42 AM dfw79 wrote:
I''m sure if CCY had the ability...they would rather furlough everyone at the top of the list instead of the bottom. Just think...get rid of the people getting paid the bigger bucks
----------------------------------------------------------
If you mean starting at the very top of the pyramid, you get my vote!
On 4/12/2003 4:28:42 AM dfw79 wrote:
I''m sure if CCY had the ability...they would rather furlough everyone at the top of the list instead of the bottom. Just think...get rid of the people getting paid the bigger bucks
----------------------------------------------------------
If you mean starting at the very top of the pyramid, you get my vote!
- Thread Starter
- #24
----------------
On 4/12/2003 4:28:42 AM dfw79 wrote:
$6/hr paycut does stink, however...everyone is missing the whole point behind these changes. The problem, is the 20+ year employee making over $20/hr to throw bags or check people in. They are competing against airlines like ATA, AirTran, etc...all of whom have a much younger work force (18-25) and therefore are more productive and cost less. Starting wages at those carriers may be $8-10/hr, but they make up for it by having fewer agents per flight and fewer expenses in terms of 401k, health, etc.
----------------------------------------------------------
Before we get to happy about ATA,JetBlue and AirTran (nee ValueJet) let them get some years under their belt, and see if they stand up to the long haul.
Interestingly, a discount carrier that has been around, and has the balance sheet to match, is WN. Even more interestingly, they are;
1. One of the MOST unionized airlines in the industry.
2. Pay their senior ramp rats $25 an hour.
Obviously, there''s more to the story than labor and wages.
Perhaps a superior business plan? Perhaps superior management?
On 4/12/2003 4:28:42 AM dfw79 wrote:
$6/hr paycut does stink, however...everyone is missing the whole point behind these changes. The problem, is the 20+ year employee making over $20/hr to throw bags or check people in. They are competing against airlines like ATA, AirTran, etc...all of whom have a much younger work force (18-25) and therefore are more productive and cost less. Starting wages at those carriers may be $8-10/hr, but they make up for it by having fewer agents per flight and fewer expenses in terms of 401k, health, etc.
----------------------------------------------------------
Before we get to happy about ATA,JetBlue and AirTran (nee ValueJet) let them get some years under their belt, and see if they stand up to the long haul.
Interestingly, a discount carrier that has been around, and has the balance sheet to match, is WN. Even more interestingly, they are;
1. One of the MOST unionized airlines in the industry.
2. Pay their senior ramp rats $25 an hour.
Obviously, there''s more to the story than labor and wages.
Perhaps a superior business plan? Perhaps superior management?
DFW79 said-"Companies don''t care about career people anymore, sorry - its true. Right now they care about getting costs down in order to survive and compete. Do you think ATA, AirTran, Frontier, and JetBlue would be growing like they are if they paid U''s wages?"
What? They seem to care about fly by night Ceo''s, VP''s etc.
Once again, it''s not U employee(labor) wages. Never has been. They would like you to believe that U has the highest labor costs in the industry, and that is why we''re here. It simply is not true.
''Poorly run'' companies (disfunctional) would better fit your description above. I noticed that you didn''t include CO or WN in your list. CO makes the list of "100 top companies to work for" I hear that they have improved their relationship with their employees. Bet they pay more than U does. WN absolutely whoops employee compensation at U. Yet their costs are still lower.
DFW says: "Everyone is in their position because they have a skill that they are good at; everyone is a piece of a huge puzzle and they all have their part."
DFW also says:"I''m sure if CCY had the ability...they would rather furlough everyone at the top of the list instead of the bottom. Just think...get rid of the people getting paid the bigger bucks, and you are able to keep on those who get paid less."
-I was better on the ramp than I am in cs. cs was not my choice. Unfortunately I am adaptable to a fault. Probably from all those years of service I put in that are now viewed as a detriment to this company. First, all those years were virtually ignored with respect to my peers, now they make me a burden to the company. If they got their way, you and everyone else would be running from U like it was the plague. Another blunder waiting to be hatched.
DFW said:What is to be curious about my handle?
DFW79? Where ya from cowboy? Just wondering if there is any meaning to it.
What? They seem to care about fly by night Ceo''s, VP''s etc.
Once again, it''s not U employee(labor) wages. Never has been. They would like you to believe that U has the highest labor costs in the industry, and that is why we''re here. It simply is not true.
''Poorly run'' companies (disfunctional) would better fit your description above. I noticed that you didn''t include CO or WN in your list. CO makes the list of "100 top companies to work for" I hear that they have improved their relationship with their employees. Bet they pay more than U does. WN absolutely whoops employee compensation at U. Yet their costs are still lower.
DFW says: "Everyone is in their position because they have a skill that they are good at; everyone is a piece of a huge puzzle and they all have their part."
DFW also says:"I''m sure if CCY had the ability...they would rather furlough everyone at the top of the list instead of the bottom. Just think...get rid of the people getting paid the bigger bucks, and you are able to keep on those who get paid less."
-I was better on the ramp than I am in cs. cs was not my choice. Unfortunately I am adaptable to a fault. Probably from all those years of service I put in that are now viewed as a detriment to this company. First, all those years were virtually ignored with respect to my peers, now they make me a burden to the company. If they got their way, you and everyone else would be running from U like it was the plague. Another blunder waiting to be hatched.
DFW said:What is to be curious about my handle?
DFW79? Where ya from cowboy? Just wondering if there is any meaning to it.
Similar threads
