US Airways Pilots Say Strike an Option

[wings396]

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On 2/25/2003 10:29:16 AM chipmunn wrote:

Wings396:

I was with MEC members until midnight last night and trust me, when one pragmatic MEC member said "this is more than about money", the potential for a full-scale war between the company and ALPA is not an understatement.

I can assure you ALPA’s rank-and-file strongly objects to having their pension plan terminated when management has purposely not disclosed their new compensation plan in the Disclosure Statement and three former executives are paid a $35 million severance bonus, after leaving employment, just before the company files for bankruptcy.

You should have seen the faces of my colleagues when this was announced yesterday.

There are creative ways to fix this problem, but ALPA will not stand for inequities, regardless of the consequences.

There is no pilot who loves this airline more than I, nobody wants to see the company and its employees prosper, or who understands the sentiment of the pilot group better than me.

The reason I went to yesterday's hearing was not to watch the proceedings, but to gauge ALPA's sentiment, which yesterday became much more militant.

Chip

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[/blockquote]
I can understand your sediment, but if nobody blinks and ALPA fights to the bitter end.........who wins this one...NONE of the employees period. RSA will sell what they can to get their cash back and upper mgmt. will move on to another company looking to reorganize. This will leave you as well as the rest of us out in the cold. It is great that you may have a job offer elsewhere, but what about the rest of us who don't? Many of your ALPA people will be flying an RJ for Mesa or someone else, or starting over if they are lucky at Jet-Blue or Southwest in the right seat.....

 

[MiAAmi]

It might be a disaster at first but the satisfaction that they stood together and said NO! will be inspiring to all their colleauges for times to come. No one wants to see US go under but things couldn't look any worse for them. Why keep chipping away at everyone, be done with it. God bless and Good luck to you all.

 

[oldiebutgoody]

It's becoming really clear to me that this management has one main goal in mind. To stick MORE MONEY into their own pockets. This has been the singular goal of the management of this company since I've been here, well over 15 years. Now, they've been caught with their hand in the cookie jar, and don't know what to do about it. I can't believe that they didn't have the time to include that information in the disclosure statements. They were probably hoping that Judge Mitchell would just rubber stamp their proposal like he has with everything else. I believe now that the choice of Dave as CEO was because he was well aware of how to manipulate the chapter 11 process, coming from a couple of jobs where he became intimately familiar with it. It appears that there was no real effort to avoid chapter 11, it just took time for them to plan the heist.

 

[Tim Nelson]

Just to set the record straight. I believe I saw in a news article where ALPA said that US AIRWAYS was unsuccessful in getting concessions from other employee groups regarding pension or retirement givebacks.
Well, for the record, US AIRWAYS and the IAM agreed to institute the IAM pension program on fleet service effective January 5th, 2003. The ceasing of future company 401k contributions together with the commencement of the IAM pension fund was a concession of close to $50 million dollars for fleet service.

Tim Nelson
IAM LC1487

 

[chipmunn]

Wings396:

I understand how you feel and many of us share your frustration, but I am just one pilot with one vote.

I have enormous confidence in the ALPA MEC who is controlled by very pragmatic, reasonable, and capable men. They will make the correct decision and I will support them regardless of what they decide.

What's unique about this negotiation, for the first time in my 19-year career, is I do not believe the company realizes that the majority of the pilot group is "crazy enough", especially after yesterday, to burn this place down to the ground.

Chip

 

[ua767fo]

Wings said: "I can understand your sediment, but if nobody blinks and ALPA fights to the bitter end.........who wins this one...NONE of the employees period"

Thats true....but there have been battles worth fighting. EAL is no longer around, but it was worth the fight to get Lorenzo out of the industry......Wolf wanted to fragment United, it was worth the fight to prevent this. As much as no one wants to get hurt, some must in the fight for greater causes. Is this a greater cause, thats up to the USAirways pilots to decide. To me it is, and if the same happens at UAL today, my vote, upfront is to strike. I'll stand up for what I believe, I look with disdain at those who cower in fear. Many on this board who today are very fearful are the same people I know that cheered for the demise of Midway, Eastern, and PanAm.

 

[savyinvestor]

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On 2/25/2003 12:46:02 PM wings396 wrote:

[blockquote]
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On 2/25/2003 10:29:16 AM chipmunn wrote:

Wings396:

I was with MEC members until midnight last night and trust me, when one pragmatic MEC member said "this is more than about money", the potential for a full-scale war between the company and ALPA is not an understatement.

I can assure you ALPA’s rank-and-file strongly objects to having their pension plan terminated when management has purposely not disclosed their new compensation plan in the Disclosure Statement and three former executives are paid a $35 million severance bonus, after leaving employment, just before the company files for bankruptcy.

You should have seen the faces of my colleagues when this was announced yesterday.

There are creative ways to fix this problem, but ALPA will not stand for inequities, regardless of the consequences.

There is no pilot who loves this airline more than I, nobody wants to see the company and its employees prosper, or who understands the sentiment of the pilot group better than me.

The reason I went to yesterday's hearing was not to watch the proceedings, but to gauge ALPA's sentiment, which yesterday became much more militant.

Chip

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[/blockquote]
I can understand your sediment, but if nobody blinks and ALPA fights to the bitter end.........who wins this one...NONE of the employees period. RSA will sell what they can to get their cash back and upper mgmt. will move on to another company looking to reorganize. This will leave you as well as the rest of us out in the cold. It is great that you may have a job offer elsewhere, but what about the rest of us who don't? Many of your ALPA people will be flying an RJ for Mesa or someone else, or starting over if they are lucky at Jet-Blue or Southwest in the right seat.....
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[/blockquote]
I'm afraid "win the battle lose the war' mentality has set in. All will be lost. This will be remembered as "never have so few done so much to destroy so many". Savy

 

[airfreight]

A STRIKE? In this economy? With UAL looking closer to Chapter 7 everyday.WAKE UP CHIP AND FRIENDS,YOU HAVE GONE CRAZY,TURN IN YOUR MEDICALS!You have a very HIGH PAYING JOB in a terrible economy,you even have the ability,to fully fund IRA'S & 401K'S and have a great lifestyle!USAirways is Chapter 11 END OF STORY-SURVIVE TO FIGHT ANOTHER DAY!

 

[insp89]

I'm just a little amazed at the number of people that are shocked about the $35 MILLION dollar payments that went to our corporate CROOKS before they left this airline in the basket case that it is in. This is to be expected when you have a judicial system that has no interest in what's right or wrong..Where's the outrage when judge Mitchell granted $6 MILLION to our present corporate cowboys while the rest of us took DEEP pay and benefit cuts ?? A question for ALPA,, Could it be that handing out all those $1 million dollar lump sum retirement checks contribute to the shape of your fund ? Would it help to ask past retirees to give some back and in turn start receiving monthly payments ?

 

[airlineorphan]

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On 2/25/2003 3:00:24 PM insp89 wrote:

I'm just a little amazed at the number of people that are shocked about the $35 MILLION dollar payments that went to our corporate CROOKS before they left this airline in the basket case that it is in. This is to be expected when you have a judicial system that has no interest in what's right or wrong..Where's the outrage when judge Mitchell granted $6 MILLION to our present corporate cowboys while the rest of us took DEEP pay and benefit cuts ?? A question for ALPA,, Could it be that handing out all those $1 million dollar lump sum retirement checks contribute to the shape of your fund ? Would it help to ask past retirees to give some back and in turn start receiving monthly payments ?
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[/blockquote]


Don't get us wrong. Most of us are not really surprised. Outraged to find out suspicions were correct. Surprised? No.

And if you go back and look at the board when the $6million in bonuses were reported, I think you will find quite a bit of outrage. It was one of the reasons many many people (albeit a minority) voted NO on the concessions.

-Airlineorphan

 

[N628AU]

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On 2/25/2003 11:59:50 AM MiAAmi wrote:

It might be a disaster at first but the satisfaction that they stood together and said NO! will be inspiring to all their colleauges for times to come. No one wants to see US go under but things couldn't look any worse for them. Why keep chipping away at everyone, be done with it. God bless and Good luck to you all.
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[/blockquote]

It is obvious from your username where your loyalties lay. The inspiration the "colleauges" as you put them, will feel will come from an enhanced bottom line for our competitors should U fail. Also, you are terribly afraid that AA is next in line after UA to make a visit before the judge. The industry has changed forever, and like it or not, we all must adapt or go the way of the dinosaurs.

 

[savyinvestor]

[blockquote]
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On 2/25/2003 3:00:24 PM insp89 wrote:

I'm just a little amazed at the number of people that are shocked about the $35 MILLION dollar payments that went to our corporate CROOKS before they left this airline in the basket case that it is in. This is to be expected when you have a judicial system that has no interest in what's right or wrong..Where's the outrage when judge Mitchell granted $6 MILLION to our present corporate cowboys while the rest of us took DEEP pay and benefit cuts ?? A question for ALPA,, Could it be that handing out all those $1 million dollar lump sum retirement checks contribute to the shape of your fund ? Would it help to ask past retirees to give some back and in turn start receiving monthly payments ?
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[/blockquote]
Sorry, but don't expect anyone from ALPA responding. Excellent question though! Savy

 

[insp89]

airlineorphan, Good to here from another NO voter.

 

[Upsgnr]

I'm sure that when the comet or asteroid or whatever it was struck the earth however many millions of years ago that some of the predatory dinosaurs just couldn't get it through their heads that the plant-eating dinosaurs they had survived on were gone and weren't coming back. They kept searching for them and then lay down never to get up.

The survivors grew fur or feathers to survive in the new climate.

Adapt, or disappear

 

[pitguy]

STRIKE.......Hahaha.......

There will not be a strike. Pilots can play as tough as they want, but the cold reality is there are few jobs out there and they will not give up a six figure job when all the chips fall.

"""Live to fight another day."""



---Do not be stupid. This is like trying to rob a broke man.